Effects Discussion

Flint the Dwarf · Post by **Flint the Dwarf** » Sat Jan 31, 2004 8:27 am

Of course, I seem to have forgotten some things so I'll elaborate since I can't sleep...

When I make a video, I split my focus into two parts. Story and emotion.

Story

I believe that a story can only be told through the source footage that you are given (though in crossovers, I know you combine footage). The story is what drives me to make a video in the first place. That's the simple part.

Emotion

In my experience, emotion does rely heavily upon the clip selection. However, the song is also key to this. When you can make the footage match the song perfectly with what you are given, that's great. I keep it that way. Simple. However, sometimes what I'm given just isn't enough. The imagery is perfectly fine, but I know more can be added without using more footage. And since I always like to conserve footage in case I might need it later, I don't mind utilizing effects to extend a clip's duration by splitting it or fading or adding pretty flashes as long as the emotional impact is also extended. However, in the case of my last video I had to make my footage look like old war footage because that's what the audio called for. If I hadn't done that, it would have just looked weird to me. o.o

In summary: my editing, admittedly, is still primitive. However, my vision is not. So that is what I rely on. I take what's given me and I put it in the video the best possible way I can without relying on effects. When I find that I can do something extra without using more footage, I don't hesitate.

LightningCountX · Post by **LightningCountX** » Sat Jan 31, 2004 1:11 pm

-What do you think effects should be used for?

Impact i believe. They can carry the feeling of the song better with the video, and make your amv much more interesting.

-What do they add to a video?

Originality, and emotion if used correctly(Vegita's Fallen Hero's Lost Love video is a good example

)

-When would you use them?

Depends when you think the part of the song is appropriate for an effect.

-When would you like to see effects used in someone else's vid?

Pretty much whenever it feel appropriate for it

-What sort of effects do you like and why do you like those particular effects?

I dont really look for HARDCORE effects in a video, just flashes on beats and fades along with the regular transition is perfect for me.

-Do you link certain effects to a certain result when adding them to your own vids?

Colors and some special effects add to the mood, and make the video better. im trying to learn all the effects in premiere to make everything look good in each video.

-When you see a particular effect, does it matter what is going on behind the effect, or do you like it because of how hard it was to add?

I dont care for effects themselves(I really didnt enjoy Europhia cause of all the effects)I need a constant mood mixed with effects that match the mood set in the video.

-Do you prefer non-duplicatable effects (or effects that take more than a button-click to add)?

I like making my own effects instead of dragging it into the timeline and its there. Thats one of the things i enjoy about premiere is that most of it is done manually.

-When you see a visual effect in a video do you stop to think how difficult it was to do, or do you enjoy it on face value?

I dont care about how hard it was, i just enjoy it

Nightowl · Post by **Nightowl** » Sat Jan 31, 2004 1:22 pm

Okay, I'll chime in.

The reason I use effects is I have a problem with using other people's footage. I have a need to make the footage my own, put a different stylistic spin on it. For me, I use effects in order to express myself - without certain touches I like to utilize, my videos would not stand out, nor would they be my own, in my opinion.

I use effects as a stylistic decision. As a tool. As an expression of myself. As a way to convey a different aspect of the story I say in a particular show, but maybe no one else did.

I use effects because I want to. Because that's who I am.

There are plenty of answers to the question, and perhaps there's a different answer each time. It all comes down to an artist's decision, in my opinion. It supports the concept. Without a solid backbone, what is the point of an effect other than a superficial layer of gloss?

-N

Klicks · Post by **Klicks** » Sat Jan 31, 2004 1:49 pm

Ok, one great example of people liking a video for its effects (mostly) i the one AD talked about earlier in this thread: Shameless Rock Video. Because of the effects of that video a whole new depth and layer of feel was added to what would have been a decently good video without them. In that particular example the effects were an integral part of the AMV, they were what made it mroe entertaining and exciting because it was aesthetically more pleasing and more exciting for the eye.

Now, on the other hand, great videos can easily be made without the aid of visual effects. Take anything by Kevin Caldwell. Just, downright beautiful editing. A very simple, yet catchy style of editing done perfectly to the song and there is no need for visual effects. Another more recent video with a couple effects was Spectacular Anime. I loved the video, and it didn't use excessive visual effects to pull off its fun lovingness. Just some great scene selection and editing.

So, visual effects are good for aesthetics, but great videos don't require visual effects to be great.

That's just a my two cents.

jrodegheri · Post by **jrodegheri** » Sat Jan 31, 2004 5:00 pm

I personally hate AMV's with tons of effects, but it's just my opinion and I know it's different from most people's here.

Actually, I have noticed that AMV's which use tons of effects are the ones which get the best scores here.

Freezing, multiple-exposure, slow motion, fog effect, "stop motion" effect, superimposition, distortion, fast motion, flashing, flashing-a-lot, increased contrast, black and white, reddish, blueish, yellowish, brownish, geometrical shapes flying all over the screen, more flashing, picture in picture, composite, frantic edition (1/4 of a second for each scene during 1 minute), more freezing, combinations of all of these, and all of this all the time!

(Not to mention lip sync, some AMV's are all about lip sync, nothing happens, it's just watching the characters "speaking"... And worse yet, sometimes frozen images with only the lips (digitally modified) moving... Yawn...)

I hate these AMV's, but they DO get wonderful scores here, so you shouldn't consider my opinion. Just check the top 10% video list and see that most of them have lots of special effects most of the time.

But then again, most of the people who vote here are people who make AMV's and recognize how difficult it is to include special effects on them and appreciate a lot these special effects maybe exactly because of this.

If you check on Kazaa, for example, the AMV's most exchanged there are without any special effects, just smart good-ol'-edition (Incredible Kwasek's Only In Dreams (which hasn't made it to the top 10% list here) for example)

I think edition is an art, and it was the original intention of AMV's, and it recquires a lot more creativity to CHOOSE the right scenes to fit the song than to MODIFY any scenes you get to MAKE them fit the song.

But maybe I'm too old fashioned and don't know how to appreciate the new art of modifying animes.

Just to mention: Don't think I hate special effects at all, some people do know how to handle them in a very creative way without spoiling the scenes (Kusoyaro for example).

I was quite boring now, but Arigato for reading

Nestorath69 · Post by **Nestorath69** » Sat Jan 31, 2004 5:30 pm

SarahtheBoring wrote:For two reasons - because I'm only in this as a hobby (i.e. I don't feel like devoting 40 hours a week to it) and because I have no visual ability at all - I'm in the group that doesn't use effects and probably never will.

That said, I do -whatever- to the footage (change it from the original visual) whenever the sound suggests something that the original footage can't fit. In any instance I try the original visual first, or my mind starts with the original, and then things are added or tweaked if the image still needs more of a push to fit the song.

F'rinstance, darkening a shot because the original was too bright and looked jarring against a subdued section of a song, and no other clip choice came to mind to fit that part better.

Those aren't effects, though. You could probably do that in WMM.

Generally, in other people's vids, I think it's one of those Catch-22s - you shouldn't use them unless you're good at them, but hell if I know how you GET good in the first place. Don't ask me, I don't use effects.

But when used well - and "used well" depends on the vid, IMO it means "serving the song" - they're another tool to get sound to match visual. Personally, that's all they are to me.

I'm not too keen on video effects- I groove on other people's work, but I'm a hardware tech- I don't have time to do them myself. I use Transparencies a lot, but those aren't really video effects. I also typically invert some clips so that they play backwards. Dunno if that's an effect. Fading to white, to black, and Premiere transitions, that's all I can do. All the other phenomenal video effects are beyond me. Hell, it took me forever to post an Avatar here... I'm a simple guy.

I take my time with my vids, usually an hour or so a day for about three weeks or so. My current project has me up all night every night trying to get some footage synched with techno beats... I may give up because it's eating into my A+ hardware study time, and I got a test looming on the horizon.

OmniStrata · Post by **OmniStrata** » Sun Feb 01, 2004 10:35 am

jrodegheri wrote: I think edition is an art, and it was the original intention of AMV's, and it recquires a lot more creativity to CHOOSE the right scenes to fit the song than to MODIFY any scenes you get to MAKE them fit the song.

I have to totally and royally disagree with you on that one.

"fit the song"?

Is that beat match or lyric match? If it's neither then that's something for "thematic match".

Some people here have videos that without special fx, just wouldn't NEARLY have an impact. As far as that statement is concerned, the easiest thing one can do [in my humble opinion] is matching the scenes to the music to tell your story. Still, just cause it's easy doesn't mean it's "sub quality".

Arigatomina · Post by **Arigatomina** » Sun Feb 01, 2004 10:49 am

OmniStrata wrote:...the easiest thing one can do [in my humble opinion] is matching the scenes to the music to tell your story.

Which, if true, would beg the question. Storytelling is the easiest part of making an amv - so why the huge multitude of random action vids, random dance vids, random fun vids, random romance vids (the worst - imo - since these should tell the strongest story), random comedy vids, and amvs of all types that simply fail to tell any kind of story whatsoever?

If storytelling is easy with vids, then you'd think after watching hundreds I could think of more than a few (maybe 12) offhand that tell a good (however simple) story. The rest try and fail - or use effects to force the footage that simply did not cooperate.

One place where I definitely see the use of effects - for when the footage won't work by itself.

It's a way to make up for a concept that is so original (different from the footage) that changing the footage is the only way to make the two match (to tell your story).

OmniStrata · Post by **OmniStrata** » Sun Feb 01, 2004 10:57 am

telling a story...

vs.

random goofiness...

Can random goofiness be actually HARDER than telling a story? [I for one told a story in my Moonlight Vengeance dance amv, the question is can some people grasp it?]

I never thought of it that way. I find telling a story to be simple and ridiculously enough . That's just my problem. The majority of amvs I've seen can be funny and still tell a story too.

"Why soooo many randomness goofy?" There are more noobs here than ever before. Statistics aren't wrong. That's my explanation. However, I AM working VERRYYY SLOOWWLLY on my first Character Profile AMV which is right now quite sucking

TaranT · Post by **TaranT** » Sun Feb 01, 2004 1:31 pm

Arigatomyna wrote:
OmniStrata wrote:...the easiest thing one can do [in my humble opinion] is matching the scenes to the music to tell your story.
Which, if true, would beg the question. Storytelling is the easiest part of making an amv - so why the huge multitude of random action vids, random dance vids, random fun vids, random romance vids (the worst - imo - since these should tell the strongest story), random comedy vids, and amvs of all types that simply fail to tell any kind of story whatsoever?

If storytelling is easy with vids, then you'd think after watching hundreds I could think of more than a few (maybe 12) offhand that tell a good (however simple) story. The rest try and fail - or use effects to force the footage that simply did not cooperate....

If that's the evidence, then wouldn't it be safer to conclude that storytelling is not the easiest part? I mean, if you ask all of those creators, many of them will tell you that they were trying to tell a story - and clearly not succeeding.

Maybe it's more accurate to say that good storytelling is not easy, which is somewhat ironic since AMV source material comes from stories.

As for effects, I always assume a tradeoff: effects or story...more of one means less of the other. This is especially true for public exhibition where people will see your work only once. Since you only have a few minutes, you have to decide what you want people to notice.