Anime Expo 2010 Anime Music Video Contest Rules Up

[Castor Troy]

One point that Michael and I consistently debate about is regarding minimum standards for source material and video quality. I think Michael is too lenient, whereas he thinks I'm far too harsh. Let's just say pre-screening time would probably drop from thirty hours to six if my standards were imposed.

I think it's time your standards should be imposed.

I don't wanna watch a video that looks like it's underwater.

[Radical_Yue]

For one...as stated by others, this isn't the first embarrassment you've let into your contest. Watch the creator's youtube...The Blue Orchid video you let in last year is just one of the damn intros to Sayonara Zetsubo Sensei.

And if all else fails, look up the damn source. It took 3 seconds to search for "Persona 4 opening." If you're not sure, look a little deeper.

The problem there is we weren't even suspicious of the video in question.

So, since our suspicion radar is a bit out of whack, that'd mean that we'd need to start hunting for and watching torrents and YouTube vids for source material from nearly all of the over 100 vids submitted. That will take way longer than 3 seconds (or even 3 minutes) per vid, I assure you. It took us 30 freaking hours to blaze through the pre-screenings. This is not a viable request to ask.

You said you let certain videos in due to the fact that you weren't familiar with the sources. Now, if you really have a group that's up to date with technical know how, this should severely limit the number of sources to dredge through to just a few.

Maybe it could be something that can be done before it gets to the prescreeners by a dedicated AMV staff, but really, this is sounding way overkill to me. There's got to be a more elegant or efficient solution.

You said you let certain videos in due to the fact that you weren't familiar with the sources. Now, if you really have a group that's up to date with technical know how, this should severely limit the number of sources to dredge through to just a few.

If all else, I volunteer. Give me two weeks and you've have all the bad technical and poorly edited videos out. The ones that are obviously blatant that is.

Honestly, HOW ARE THESE VIDEOS JUDGED AND WHO IS JUDGING THEM?

A group of ten to fifteen staffers (mostly AMV fans and/or people whose opinion Michael trusts) are invited to the office. They sit and watch a vid. They write a score for that vid on a scale of 1 to 5 (1 to 10 for AMTV) on the criteria of "Fun", "Tech", and "Concept". They move on to the next vid. Repeat until ridiculously late hours.

Fun, Tech and Concept? I don't know how you'd judge a drama video on fun but I think you may need to change this. I highly recommend contacting A-kon. They're one of the oldest running cons around and they've got excellent criteria.
Also, doing all of them at once is the worst idea I've ever heard of. Too many people + incredibly long periods of time = horrible idea. You think that having that many people in a room for hours on end, they're going to pay full attention and everyone is going to know what the hell they're voting for? A judging staff should consist of 5 people maximum (in my opinion) and the judging should be drawn out over time. Otherwise people get bored, distracted and no longer care what they're doing. In reality, the human race never moves past age 5. You make them do one task for long enough, but the end you'll find they've been playing with their shoe for the past 3 hours.
Also, when you have a large group of people that you only trust and are not up to date with technical know-how/recent AMVs, then the majority who is uneducated will always have the winning vote. They go with what they like, not with what is actually good.

...ability to follow proper rules and regulations and provide a clean encode.

One point that Michael and I consistently debate about is regarding minimum standards for source material and video quality. I think Michael is too lenient, whereas he thinks I'm far too harsh. Let's just say pre-screening time would probably drop from thirty hours to six if my standards were imposed.

It's true. This is a basic standard that would drop down the amount of entries to be screened to a minimum. After all, if you don't care enough to encode properly, then you obviously don't care enough about whether you make it into the contest or not :/

But the judging really needs to strengthen up a bit.

If you've got suggestions, let's hear them.

I'd love to compare notes with how other competitions do their judging. For instance, I was gobsmacked to hear that Otakon opens their before-con pre-screenings to the public, even to the AMV editors themselves. If I'd ever heard that suggested for our competition I'd say that's crazy talk, but they obviously seemed to have made it work. Frankly, there have been times in which I wished that some editors could be present at the pre-screenings.

Editors don't even need to be present. Just round up (IMs, emails, etc..) a couple people and say "Hey, would you mind helping out with the contest"
Even if you can only get them to knock out a couple hours of videos per editor, just for pre-screening it would make a MAJOR difference. Feel free to contact me on AIM, skype, or whatever. I've got lists of intelligent people who are never not willing to help out.

[Vlad G Pohnert]

Sorry, the reason I've been all over this thread is just because I'm incredibly passionate about the subject and I despise what AMVs are nowadays. And to have one of the biggest cons around showcasing crap makes me sick.

Trust me Yue, your input is a good reminder of where the contest still needs to improve. Being passionate is a good thing.
But yeah, about the staffing issue, just in general, the back end staffing for AX has been a big drama ball this year. it is unfortunate things had to go the way they did.

Well, to be honest it's not the AMV contest to blame for AX's problems as much, but AX itself... Personally I think with all the politics over the last 10 years, I don't think I would want to get involved on the con running at any level... I think Micheal works hard and wants it to succeed, however maybe it's time the honest and good people at AX move on to creator/work at a con that does not have so many political torpedos.. Maybe it's time to burry it.

Vlad

[XStylus]

I believe something needs to be done about the pool of judges...When was the last time they have either made a new AMV or watched newer series? I'm not saying they need to "be in teh editor know how yo'" but it would be nice to know just how up to date they are with today standards.

I know of only two staffers who have ever entered an AMV. Myself, and MilkmanDan (maybe three, if Rider joins up this year). MMD and Rider entered, so they can't judge. That leaves me, and somehow I don't think it'd be fair for me to be the sole person to select the 28 finalists.

As for my lack of being "up to date" with the newer series, it's my opinion that any vid which the viewer needs to be heavily media literate in order to appreciate is a failure, in my opinion. It is not reasonable to expect every sitting judge to be an Encyclopedia Otakunica of anime.

So, that being the case, what would you suggest be done to revise the pre-screening process?

[XStylus]

One point that Michael and I consistently debate about is regarding minimum standards for source material and video quality. I think Michael is too lenient, whereas he thinks I'm far too harsh. Let's just say pre-screening time would probably drop from thirty hours to six if my standards were imposed.

It's true. This is a basic standard that would drop down the amount of entries to be screened to a minimum. After all, if you don't care enough to encode properly, then you obviously don't care enough about whether you make it into the contest or not :/

Let me further amend that. If my standards were imposed, we might not even make it to 28 videos.

For example, got fake letterboxing to hide subtitles? DQ. Got crystal clear source yet you accidentally let one single ever-so-brief frame of subtitle slip by? DQ. Y'know those vids that appear to have pristine source yet have those itty bitty NHK network logos? DQ. Got jagged edges? DQ.

[Radical_Yue]

I believe something needs to be done about the pool of judges...When was the last time they have either made a new AMV or watched newer series? I'm not saying they need to "be in teh editor know how yo'" but it would be nice to know just how up to date they are with today standards.

I know of only two staffers who have ever entered an AMV. Myself, and MilkmanDan (maybe three, if Rider joins up this year). MMD and Rider entered, so they can't judge. That leaves me, and somehow I don't think it'd be fair for me to be the sole person to select the 28 finalists.

As for my lack of being "up to date" with the newer series, it's my opinion that any vid which the viewer needs to be heavily media literate in order to appreciate is a failure, in my opinion. It is not reasonable to expect every sitting judge to be an Encyclopedia Otakunica of anime.

So, that being the case, what would you suggest be done to revise the pre-screening process?

When it comes to the whole being up to date on newer anime, I never mentioned the video itself. A good video should be able to convey a simple story even if you don't know the anime. I'm talking about the "Huh, I've never even heard of the series...but this looks INCREDIBLY professional...maybe I should double check the reference" response.

Why not ask for volunteers to start with? You've got a vast internet with lots of people who frequent it. If you'd like, I could provide you with a list of wonderful people that would make excellent consults.
All you need is a small group of people to go through the entries and pick out the ones that are obvious hack jobs. Not deciding the merrit of the video itself, whether they think it should be in the finals, but whether they just slapped an opening on the timeline and called it a video. Or decided to run their encode through a blender before submitting it. This would take pressure off the judges and make for a much shorter screening. As I've said numerous times, I will personally volunteer for this if you'd take me.
After that, I say limit the amount of judges. It's fine to have A fan and A trusted friend, but for the most part, you need people that know EDITING.
Once you have the prescreening process taken care of however, this doesn't leave much work for the judges. If you chose to, you could even take a couple of those prescreeners and make them actual judges once the final list of entries has been decided.
When it comes to voting, not everyone needs to be in the same small, sweaty, damp room. USB drives are rather cheap. I think AX could spring for a couple that people could take home with them and do their voting there. Or they can always pal up and watch them together. Those who fail to get their judging taken care of are taken off the roster and more dedicated replacements are found. As for those who don't live in California with physical access to the the entries, well, they have glorious things called FTP servers that you can purchase for as cheap as $5 a month.

There are many ways to take care of this issue.
But you primarily need:
1) Prescreeners
2) Better and fewer judges
3) Different judging criteria.

The contest on a technical scale is run beautifully. Now, let's clean up the entries.

[Rider4Z]

...I didn't want to but i may give up entering next year so i can help Michael out as well. I'm sick of the drama. Not saying there wouldn't be any but i do my best to avoid it... (i'm sure niotex is laughing out loud but you get my point)

There is no hate. Only frustration and confusion. I'm angry but only about the situation. I'd like to see it fixed and want to know why precautions weren't taken after that horrible Death Note video winning drama last year. I'd be more than happy to assist in judging, etc... I don't live near LA anymore, but there is a nice little thing called the internet.

Also, Niotex has high standards but I don't understand why you'd think he'd be laughing. He's actually one of the sweetest and most helpful people I know as long as you don't come off as a complete idiot.

misunderstanding about niotex, i was referring to little bitch-fests he and i have duked out with each other (off subject drama).


onto another subject, people keep bringing up the complaints about Death Note Rhapsody. now i don't mean to be "siding with the enemy" here, but that vid (while i myself didn't care for it either) has won SEVERAL awards at SEVERAL cons. i know, i keep up with the contest threads. So it's not fair to keep using it as a scapegoat for why the AX contest has "gone to crap". knock it off.

[Radical_Yue]

...I didn't want to but i may give up entering next year so i can help Michael out as well. I'm sick of the drama. Not saying there wouldn't be any but i do my best to avoid it... (i'm sure niotex is laughing out loud but you get my point)

There is no hate. Only frustration and confusion. I'm angry but only about the situation. I'd like to see it fixed and want to know why precautions weren't taken after that horrible Death Note video winning drama last year. I'd be more than happy to assist in judging, etc... I don't live near LA anymore, but there is a nice little thing called the internet.

Also, Niotex has high standards but I don't understand why you'd think he'd be laughing. He's actually one of the sweetest and most helpful people I know as long as you don't come off as a complete idiot.

misunderstanding about niotex, i was referring to little bitch-fests he and i have duked out with each other (off subject drama).


onto another subject, people keep bringing up the complaints about Death Note Rhapsody. now i don't mean to be "siding with the enemy" here, but that vid (while i myself didn't care for it either) has won SEVERAL awards at SEVERAL cons. i know, i keep up with the contest threads. So it's not fair to keep using it as a scapegoat for why the AX contest has "gone to crap". knock it off.

Just because a video is submitted to massive amounts of cons and manages to win awards due to crowd votes doesn't mean it's good.
If the newest fad was to have a bouncing squirrel head over a yellow flashing background, the audience would vote for it because it makes them laugh. This doesn't mean that it's well edited in intelligent or any way/shape/form.

Winning awards doesn't mean that you have a good video on your hands.

You could argue that you're really just doing it for the audience...but isn't a contest about the best of the best competing? Hence the name COMPETITION? The audience will always find something to be entertained by. Whether it actually deserves to be there is another thing.

[Fall_Child42]

I've been told to read this thread an now I see why. Anyone who has ever met me knows I am big fan of food. I have had the great opportunity to grow up surrounded by many types of food, the most different coming from the kitchen of a Chinese family our family is friends with. Pigs blood soup and Grilled chicken feet are not new concepts for me. Later when I started to travel I always try and check out the local foods of different areas. I never had grits and collard greens until I went to the south, Chicago style deep dish pizza was something I had heard about but never got to try until ACEN. Jerk Chicken is spicy as hell but delicious! After constantly seeking culinary adventures I have decided I would really like to be a food critic and I understand that's what this thread is all about. I will of course need to decide on a few things, what it mean to be a food critic, What training I need, and what is my final goal.

Firstly, I need to figure out what a food critic is. There is a really good movie about cooking and food criticism that has alot more insight then it first appears. Ratatouille, a Pixar movie about a rat with a dream to cook and eat good food, provides a notorious food critic with a very appropriate quote: "I don't just like food, I love it, and if I don't love it I spit it out." At first I thought this was the correct Idea to take. I should exclusively find and consume the best of the best foods prepared on white plates with expensive sauces. But you know what this attitude is wrong. If you only allow yourself to eat fancy cuisine you may miss out on the simple pleasures of more pedestrian foods. A well made charcoal grilled burger with the right toppings and a balance of flavours can be just as enjoyable as an excellently prepared Cornish game hen. The end of the movie even confirms my suspicion when the critic is brought back to the simple pure enjoyment of food when at the end of the film he eats the ratatouille and he travels back to the innocent child enjoying the simple pleasures of food. After I started voraciously consuming the food network, I discovered Guy Fieri and his show Diners, Drive-ins and Dives. In this show he travels around America and finds the best local restaurants in a variety of states. He showcases the true American cuisine for the regular person, from the gumbos of Louisiana to the Clam Chowders of New England. Guy showed me that as a food critic it was alright to enjoy fancy and normal food equally. To me a food critic can not be somebody that only looks at the best. A food critic must be someone that loves all food, despite the supposed target audience and judge its quality fairly no matter if it came from a 5 star restaurant or a lunch truck.

Second, I must decide what I should eat. Obviously, an extremely varied experience of food is a must, and even though I have experienced many foods it is only a fraction of the dishes out there. I will not be able to tell a good taco from a poor taco if I've never been to Mexico. If I want to become a world class food critic I must travel the world. But what of the skills of chefs? I have seen chefs be able to determine what ingredients make up the sauce they tasted. I have seen people know exactly what something is supposed to look like because they know about the steps of preparing a million dishes. I asked myself if these are skills I need to have. I wondered if to be a food critic I must first be a chef. My answer is no. As a food critic I do not need to know that garlic, cumin, salt, white whine, and heavy cream made this sauce. As a food critic I do not need to be able to prepare the dishes I am about to enjoy. I only need to know that they taste good. I need to be able to experience the food, to let the flavours wash over my tongue and have them leave me content, or disgusted. I only need to be able to taste food, enjoy food, and write about food.

Finally, my goal is simple. You may laugh. You may not believe, but I wish to one day be a judge on Iron Chef. The food those master chefs make is incredible, I would love to be in kitchen stadium just once to experience the atmosphere take in the sights and sounds, and after many long hours of waiting to partake in the creations the chefs humbly present to me. This is my goal.

In conclusion, knowing I am on the correct track to becoming a food critic, I have decided what being a critic means to me, I have decided what I need to learn, and I have a final goal, I ask you, the readers of this thread, what do I do next?

[Kazemon15]

One point that Michael and I consistently debate about is regarding minimum standards for source material and video quality. I think Michael is too lenient, whereas he thinks I'm far too harsh. Let's just say pre-screening time would probably drop from thirty hours to six if my standards were imposed.

It's true. This is a basic standard that would drop down the amount of entries to be screened to a minimum. After all, if you don't care enough to encode properly, then you obviously don't care enough about whether you make it into the contest or not :/

Let me further amend that. If my standards were imposed, we might not even make it to 28 videos.

For example, got fake letterboxing to hide subtitles? DQ. Got crystal clear source yet you accidentally let one single ever-so-brief frame of subtitle slip by? DQ. Y'know those vids that appear to have pristine source yet have those itty bitty NHK network logos? DQ. Got jagged edges? DQ.

Subtitles and logos in AMVs are always a no no.

However, not everyone can get their sources picture perfect, I know in heck I can't. I can get by with pretty good quality but it may never be picture perfect. I say if the quality is good enough to blow up on a giant screen and doesnt look like utter crap, then it should be fine.

Focusing too much on the quality and not the editing can also make up a bunch of not so good lineup. An amv can have the best quality in the entire world... but if it's just one sequence of an episode put to music, that defeats the purpose of an enjoyable and well edited amv...