At what point is constructive criticism no longer useful?

[Kai Stromler]

Personally, any criticism, constructive or not, stops being useful about 2 years after the video under examination is released. Anything wrong with it has either been noticed and fixed in the interim, or was done that way on purpose.

You will never get to the point where all commentary is categorically useless; you can't stand in the shoes of all your viewers at once, so every so often someone is going to have a different take that makes you go "huh, I never thought about X that way". Result: change in the way you approach your next project, no matter how subconscious or incidental.

--K

[ZephyrStar]

(constructive criticism is ALWAYS useful.)

[Knowname]

The best constructive criticism I got this year was from one of my first videos 8-9 years ago. "Why don't you show this kind of determination now?? Your shit today sucks".

[downwithpants]

The best constructive criticism I got this year was from one of my first videos 8-9 years ago. "Why don't you show this kind of determination now?? Your shit today sucks".

haha that's how i personally felt with my last few videos.

[CrackTheSky]

I'm going to have to disagree with just about everything you said here man. Your opinion of what looks good, or what needs sync is subjective and relates differently to everyone. As your thread showed, majority of the editor's there didn't agree with your scene selection or sync. For someone who has been editing for three-and-a-half years, you should know by now that not everyone's gonna enjoy your releases. But you don't need people to tell you how to edit ( and I agree with that, I think each person's style of editing should be different and unique ) but if you can't tell people what you think they should do, then there is no criticism.

I'm not saying that criticism doesn't exist, I'm saying that as far as the technical aspects go (see my post on the bottom of page three for my definition of "technical"), it's not useful to me because I did what I did for a reason. Subjective criticism is fine and dandy, but it's not going to change the way I make a video. To use Alternator as a further example, if in the future I decide to make another action video, I'm probably going to make it in a similar fashion to Alternator because that's the style I like to see, and even moreso the style I enjoy editing to.

Isn't that what criticism is? Explaining why you didn't get some sort of enjoyment out of the video.

Well, yes. However, subjective criticism is almost inherently useless to me in a practical sense because if other people react to my video unfavorably, it's not like I'm going to go back and fix the video and reupload it to meet everyone else's standards. This does not mean that I don't enjoy hearing what other people say and knowing that they're viewing my work, but for something that's a hobby that I do in my limited free time, people telling me (at this point in my editing career) how I should edit doesn't do much for me.

Both of those sentences were constructive criticism, one was just more demanding than the other. Either way you say it, you would still want it to have more sync. So why not say it as if you demand it? And I don't think you should be courteous to other editor's who are better than you.

It's not so much a question of courtesy as it is a question of Ileia (in this example) knows how to sync and how to do all the technical things right. I assume that because she knows what she's doing, any technical errors I might see are either known or unimportant. I also assume that my opinions on ways she should have edited the video probably would not have changed how she edited the video - that's simply how most editors are.

When I'm asked to beta other people's videos, any technical mistakes I point out are quickly patched up, but more general critiques on the editing style or overall mood tend to be completely ignored or later justified by the editor in question, not necessarily because the editor doesn't value my opinion in such matters, but because he knows exactly how he wants his video to feel and look and my vision of what the video is supposed to be ends up different from his.

You find this often in announcement threads as well. When someone leaves constructive criticism that says, "I thought this video felt too X" usually the editor will either ignore it altogether, say "Thanks for watching anyway", or "Well, that's actually what I was going for". How many editors do you see that actually acknowledge the complaint, admit that the feeling was off, and commit to changing in the future? They do exist, but almost none of them are editors who have been around for more than a couple years.

You do realize that in order to be considered a Master in something, you need to be doing it for at least 10 years right? I think I read that at some point...and honestly, that's a shitty attitude and a weak defense of your point.

I'm not going by any absolute definition. As far as I'm concerned, I've been around long enough, watched more than enough excellent and terrible videos, and made enough videos myself to know the basics. That's all I'm claiming; I'm not saying I've perfected the art or even approached perfecting it, but I do believe that I have a solid base for the formation of my own opinion of what looks "good".

Honestly, want it or not, you're going to get criticism. An ignorant man rejects it and thinks he knows everything, a wise man is humble and listens, accepting the fact that what he knows is nothing in the scheme of things. Whether you like it or not, you can learn a LOT from criticism. When I hear what people say about my video, I apply that knowledge to a general pool of "what does my audience look for". You can determine what people like and become more successful.

Well, I'm going to end up falling back on the "Well I just do it for me" defense, so...

But when you release a video here, it's not just for you any more. Whether you argue that or not, that's up to you. But if you're just doing it for you, there's no reason to ever release videos. You can keep them to yourself and watch them whenever you'd like. In the meantime, humble yourself and listen to what people have to say whether you like it or not, and use it to improve yourself further.

I won't argue your point that it's not just for me anymore once I release a video on the .org, and I even said in my first post that anyone who releases a video on the .org or YouTube or anywhere has some innate desire to impress others. I'm not free of this claim, but at the same time my reasons for releasing my video on the .org are more numerous than just that: I know that there are other editors out there who have enjoyed my work in the past, and so may enjoy my current work as well; the primary purpose of the .org is to catalog all AMVs; it's useful to have somewhere that all my videos will be kept in case something happens to my computer. And I do enjoy hearing what people have to say; however, I don't see it as a failure when others dislike my video, I simply see it as a difference in taste.

And I would like to throw one other question out there in response to Reda's statement above: What constitutes "improvement"? I find that to be a vague term, and likely a subjective one, but the way you used it above, Reda, makes it sound like one cannot improve without the approval of others. I don't know if I agree with that or not, but I'd like to hear others' opinions on this.

[EvaFan]

I upload my vids cause I enjoy reading comments or seeing their reactions... Not cause I have an innate desire to impress others or win contests... If that was the reason I would of quit a while ago or would of been hellbent on learning more crazy and intense eyecandy/fx work for amv's. I do this for me and my ideas only, other then meps, cause I support the theme/idea/band or am friends with other people in it.

[Unitfort]

Crackthesky is just pissed that no one like his shit work no more. How the mighty have fallen

[CrackTheSky]

Crackthesky is just pissed that no one like his shit work no more. How the mighty have fallen

Ha.

[Adv1sor]

Good constructive criticism is always useful.

Someone pointing out a particular problem or suggesting a different editing technique should always be welcome, whether or not you take their advice.

[Taite]

I think I read somewhere that 4/5 times the criticism people give you is right? Or something like that...
But, while some people may share the same ideas, ("more sync here, that effect doesn't fit, etc."), all criticism is based off one's own taste.
If you were making an AMV to please every single person out there, then your video would have all sorts of things going on. Some people might prefer lots of effects on a techno-y song, others might prefer more of a raw-style, others just one anime, others a billion.

Over time though, every editor develops their own 'style.' Meaning, every time you critique their video, you are critiquing their style. Critiquing based off their style is better than critiquing their style ( ). I'm not saying that everyone critiques one's style, but in general, when you read comments like, "Bad anime choice, better if you used blah," that kind of stuff is like critiquing one's style. Sorry, but I don't think I'm going to go hunt down an entirely different anime just because someone says the song would look better with it. That's just me though. As per fourth to last paragraph, I'm a person who would rather satisfy myself than someone else.

That kind of stuff is simple-minded though. When someone can get used to a lot of different styles, I think then they critique better, because they are more able to give criticism that can be accepted. It's the simple-minded people who say the general "criticism", if you can even call it that, (ie: more sync, bad clip here, etc. all that good stuff.) Although, I don't think those people should be shot down with a "NO, I'm gunna make my videos how I wanna, WHEN I WANNA!" It's better to just say "Yeah, okay" and let it slide even if you're not really gunna accept it.

I'm pretty sure all editors out there edit for themselves, otherwise no one would have "criticism." Sometimes it's best to ignore criticism and maintain your 'style.' Other times, you can accept criticism because it is something you can see "adapting" (for lack of a better word) to. Or when you are more satisfied with pleasing others than yourself, you can accept that criticism. However, even though deep inside we want to please others and that's why half the time we release a video is to hear those wonderful comments such as "GOOD JOB!", I don't think people care enough so much as to change their style and accept criticism all the time. At least not me and half the other people out there. I mean, come on, how many times have you heard beta testers go "you didn't do blah and blah" once the final video is released.

Everyone, though, can say that 'simple-minded' kind of criticism every now and again though. I know I do. I think it's due to the fact that we are too lazy to give a good look into that person's history and are happier with their video pleasing us, rather than themselves. The people who give ops on peoples' videos nowadays should seriously be applauded, because half the time people don't do it because 1. they are too lazy, 2. don't really care if that person improves or not, 3. would rather look for a different video to entertain themselves than waste their time oping, or 4. the video is not 'their cup of tea' and would rather just set it down and ignore it. I applaud those who care By the way, I'm not saying you're a bad person if you don't op. Sometimes people don't write ops because the person's video, in their eyes, is fine the way it is.

Constructive criticism, in my opinion, is those who take the time to do ops or lengthy things. Always look at constructive criticism with an open mind, because it's those people who put thought into things and it's courteous to actually consider them. But it's the little comments, the regular 'criticism' (that i've been talking about half the time), that is, imo, basically useless.

Of course, all of this is just speaking generally. I know there are people out there who aren't all about criticism and do like to op and can adapt to many different styles etc. All of this is just my opinion as well.