Dmytryk vs. The AMV Criteria (Substance before synch.)

[Niwa]

Holy shit O:

moonie

[Serv0]

"A sharp image is no good with a fuzzy idea." -Jean-Luc Goddard

(1) Why do you think this movement is not larger than it currently is?

This is a tough question to answer because yes, the movement has been existent ever since the first AMVs. The closest answer to this question is the movement is already large, but has no idea where to go. This is blasphemy to many of you I know, but it is the truth.
I understand that many of you have drawn an absolute line from film and AMV but remember one important thing. They both communicate something to the audience.
Trythil, editing AMVs is like Alchemy. We deconstruct something and construct it into something else. It's not how large the movement is, it's where the movement is going. I'm hoping that AMVs, machinima, and all other fan-base products will have their own face seperate from the original sources.

I don't think the problem is a failure to recognize this characteristic of the AMV community, nor do I think that it's due to a lack of discussion on the topic.

You're right, the problem isn't due to the lack of discussion. It's the lack of AMVs finding their destination.

It sounds like you think that these videos have so far done little for AMVs in the eyes of art society and society at large. Is this an accurate statement? If it is, why do you think that is? Do you think they're getting drowned out by all the noise? Are they just not good enough?

Not quite accurate Trythil, close but still a little bit off. I appreciate your detailed questions though.
It's more like AMVs have done little for art itself. A broad statement I do admit, but hopefully I can work off it.
Remember, Stanley Kubrick said that editing is born directly from motion pictures, (NOT FILM). Our practice of AMVs is deconstructing something and constructing it into something else. As an editor, Martin Scorsese envisioned the talent of an editor through their ability to take footage (original or unoriginal), throw them up in the air, and construct a foundation based on the fallen pieces. If editing is an art itself, then surely AMVs must be born from that art.
They're not getting drowned out by the noise. They just don't have a big enough noise themselves. AMVs need to be bigger by having bigger ideas.

A video concept is a deceptively simple thing. The best way to describe it is as a vision. What you want the video to be, how you want the viewer to feel, what you want them to think, to understand. In short, why you're making the video.

REMEMBER, everything must come back to the BIG IDEA. (An absolute truth. Once you've dismissed this FACT, you and your work have failed.)

It sounds like you're operating on the proposition "if we evolve towards higher substance then we will gain appreciation and acknowledgment". Is this an accurate statement? Do you think that this is the major barrier? The only barrier?

I do not wish for any of us to gain appreciation and acknowledgment. That kind of thing is for Boochsack. But I do wish AMVs themselves will gain appreciation and acknowledgment through higher substance.
And no this isn't the only barrier. No matter what any medium elevates to, it will always have a barrier. Let's take movies for example. Movies have come a long way in its course of history through evolution, but it has far more obstacles and barriers then it did when it started out. The same for AMVs, its just that I hope AMVs, and other fan-base work don't fall in the same traps the Hollywood franchise has (such as appealing to popular demand, rather than appealing to unique storytelling.) Best to have the people (fans) know what their obstacles are.

NOTE: This has nothing to do with above quote but I feel that I need to justify. Story-telling is dependent on both Substance and Form. Taking footage of Naruto bashing Sasukes face in and putting that to music. That's storytelling. It may not be good storytelling, but its still storytelling.
A lot of editors don't even know that they are telling a story when they edit.
[quote"Koopiskeva"]I do not make an AMV to show a story.[/quote]
Telling a story wasn't the reason why he made an AMV. But he was still telling a story.

This is why I'm encouraging a balance between Substance and Form. Whether or not you give a shit about the story, the story element will still be existent. The problem however, is the quality has a good chance of sucking because its editor didn't pay attention to the BIG IDEA.

I'm having trouble justifying an argument for it overcoming the enormous inertia of "ur cuttin up someone's cartoonz".

Maybe I am just babbling useless shit here. But remember editing is an art, AND IT'S ALSO FUN TOO!!! Fun must evolve, otherwise it just becomes boring.
We are deconstructing and constructing something here.

But this is a discussion. Nothing in this thread is absolute. The only real source for truth, is in the AMVs themselves.

I'll say it again:
The only real source for truth, is in the AMVs themselves.

ServoNote: I apologize for not addressing everyones responses at this time. I'll be sure to respond to everyone when I have more time. Thanks.

[Scintilla]

NOTE: This has nothing to do with above quote but I feel that I need to justify. Story-telling is dependent on both Substance and Form. Taking footage of Naruto bashing Sasukes face in and putting that to music. That's storytelling. It may not be good storytelling, but its still storytelling.
A lot of editors don't even know that they are telling a story when they edit.

I do not make an AMV to show a story.

Telling a story wasn't the reason why he made an AMV. But he was still telling a story.

Fine, you take <a href="http://www.animemusicvideos.org/members ... 0">this</a> and tell me what the hell kind of story I was trying to tell with it.

AMVs don't have to be art, people.

If unique storytelling is what you enjoy doing, then do it.
If appealing to popular demand is what you like, then do it.


I should add that appealing to popular demand (even if you didn't mean to) can be immensely satisfying if you're there to witness said popular demand first-hand.

[Kalium]

Fine, you take <a href="http://www.animemusicvideos.org/members ... 0">this</a> and tell me what the hell kind of story I was trying to tell with it.

It's the story of where many, many hours of your free time went.

[Moonie]

Fine, you take <a href="http://www.animemusicvideos.org/members ... 0">this</a> and tell me what the hell kind of story I was trying to tell with it.

It's the story of where many, many hours of your free time went.

LOL

Just out of curiosity, Servo do you ever think about anything else besides this stuf.
Theres nothing wrong with discussing it I guess but it seems like every topic you make in this section is about AMVs needing to evolve, the future of them and the BIG IDEAL of AMVs...
*sigh*
I miss the more funner or other interesting threads in this section.
Thats one of the reasons i made that AMV Trivia and Easter Egg thread but sadly it
looks like its starting to sink into the sea of forgoten threads. =(
*cough*someone post a new video!*cough*

AMVs are a hobby and while you do get serious when editing, preparing footage and stuf, they are just FUN.
The main point of them is seeing your favorite anime put to music you like
and coming up with lots of creative ways to do so.
There is no right or wrong way to do them.
Its kinda silly to think so MUCH into them.
Well thats what i think about them anyway

Fun shouldn't have to evolve, because it is fun, and has no need for evoluion.

X2


Its kinda funny
In every type of hobby or art there are people that says things have to only be a certain way.
They say things need to follow a certain rule, they should have something, they shouldn't have something, they have too much or too little of something.
They just seem to think it has to go by a set of rules or like Chrono said, go by some kind of industry standard.
Its interesting that while people can write multiple page essays about how things have to be a certain way or need to evolve, the response can easily be summed up in a 1 second video
http://download.yousendit.com/B3C4F5E11ACE8FCB

[Kionon]

AMVs should be about message.

[JaddziaDax]

Message in Something Fishy = wut the hell was this editor on when she made it?

[Bakadeshi]

It really boils down to make whatever the hell you want to make.

There are some editors who may benefit from this post, if they are wanting to make an AMV like a film, where the story telling is the main point. But AMVs don't have to tell a story if you don't want it to. Amvs can focus on whatever you want them to focus on.

Kionon I think touched on what amvs are really usually about, most editors use it to send a message, even if that message is ...say...a bunch of cute girls flashing their undies. Although that could also be a message that this editor is a pervert who likes seeing loli girls in their undies.

[Koopiskeva]

A lot of editors don't even know that they are telling a story when they edit.

I do not make an AMV to show a story.

Telling a story wasn't the reason why he made an AMV. But he was still telling a story.

Untrue. You are simply forming that story in your own mind to fill in the blanks of what it actually is, giving you a better grasp on what it could 'potentially' mean.

[Yok/0]

You know...I felt like I read this thread before.
Yea U know I think I have. It was about how we should push ourselves to the next level beyond...

err wait that was a DBZ episode... I get them both confused since they both seem to interlace/rehearse with one another -_-.

My Defintion of "evolve" is far different from what people are prefering.