h.264

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h.264

Postby savemejc » Thu Dec 28, 2006 2:12 am

what is so especial about this codec? and can anyone tell me what codecs work best with adobe premiere???
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Postby Kariudo » Thu Dec 28, 2006 2:22 am

h.264 (the most popular [free] implementaion of this is x.264) is the "next generation" of codec if you will.

it can achieve much better compression ratios compared to xvid (smaller files and better quality) and is used for blu-ray and hd-dvd disks.

as far as editable codecs, this is pretty much all you need to know (read the next two pages as well)
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Postby AthenAltena » Wed Jan 03, 2007 6:08 pm

I've switched to h.264 as my standard for output, looks great and the videos aren't absolutely huge. If you have the processing power to do it I'd highly recommend it.
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Postby CrackTheSky » Thu Jan 04, 2007 3:12 am

The only problem with it is lots of lower-end computers can't play back x264-compressed videos too smoothly, or even at all in some cases. There's a whole thread debating the upsides and downsides of the codec.
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Postby Qyot27 » Thu Jan 04, 2007 7:54 pm

CrackTheSky wrote:The only problem with it is lots of lower-end computers can't play back x264-compressed videos too smoothly, or even at all in some cases. There's a whole thread debating the upsides and downsides of the codec.

The thing to point out though, is what decoder is being used. I can max out x264's settings and still play the result on my old eMachines T1110 (that's 1GHz Celeron, 256 MB RAM, 100MHz front-side bus - it's from 2001), but that's largely because I use CoreAVC as my decoder rather than ffdshow or libavcodec in general. The only constraint is what the bitrate is. Even CoreAVC can't handle stuff over about 2500kbps on my machine, but that kind of bitrate is serious overkill for SD resolutions unless there's a crapload of effects.
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Postby savemejc » Sat Jan 06, 2007 1:37 am

interesting you fools actually seem to know what your talking about. well ill have to do some more research but this codec seems promising....
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Postby savemejc » Sat Jan 06, 2007 1:39 am

note when i say fools i mean people not an actual fool.
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Postby Willen » Sat Jan 06, 2007 4:36 am

savemejc wrote:note when i say fools i mean people not an actual fool.

You've been watching I Pity the Fool or too many A-Team reruns... :P
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Postby BasharOfTheAges » Sat Jan 06, 2007 2:19 pm

I skimmed through the other thread and didn't find any mention of encoding methods. Am I to assume i can use virtualdub to encode (with the proper files installed, of course) or is there a preferred alternative GUI floating around?
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Postby Qyot27 » Sat Jan 06, 2007 2:58 pm

BasharOfTheAges wrote:I skimmed through the other thread and didn't find any mention of encoding methods. Am I to assume i can use virtualdub to encode (with the proper files installed, of course) or is there a preferred alternative GUI floating around?

Which other thread?

As for using VDub to encode, it's strongly recommended not to, because many of the features that allow H.264 to achieve the much smaller sizes that it can don't like to play nice with VFW (which VDub uses to encode), even moreso than the B-frames in XviD or DivX - especially because those two are limited to 2-3 at the most, and H.264 allows up to 16, and the B-frame pyramid, and mixed references, which make for a trifecta encoding nightmare when using H.264 inside of AVI or VFW-based MKV (which is why most H.264 releases are either in MP4 or proper ISO-based MKV - both of those handle those features the way that they're supposed to).

Basically, as far as GUIs go, there are several, including (remembering strictly off the top of my head here), StaxRip, RealAnime, a GTK-based one for X11, and MeGUI. Out of those, I've only ever used MeGUI to any extent. And of course there's the command-line interface. New versions of MeGUI allow you to update without having to keep track of everything it depends on, which is nice.

MeGUI can be gotten here (along with current ffdshow, Haali's Media Splitter, and Media Player Classic builds):
http://x264.nl/
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Postby Willen » Sat Jan 06, 2007 8:33 pm

I also want to add that the official x264 (with VfW) build is old and the current versions have dropped VfW support altogether. Unless you find the current VfW build (not supported by the x264 community in large), you are out of luck trying to encode with it in VDub. The VfW build is easy to get, but there are reasons why the x264 dev team decided to abandon VfW support.
doom9's x264 FAQ wrote:Q19: Can i use VirtualDub or any other VFW based editor to encode with x264?
A: Yes, using a x264 VFW specific build but VFW support was removed because it was no longer manteined and because VFW and AVI are not properly able to handle h.264 features without some "hacking" that could compromise compatibility and playback.

I'm surprised that there is still a core set of users that refuse to let go of the AVI container (and VfW applications like VDub) and move onto newer formats like MP4 and MKV. I can understand the arguments about ease of use (the VDub interface is familiar) and the wide support for the AVI container. But IMO, if you are going to use a newer codec like x264 or any other H.264 implementation, it's time to move on to a newer, more robust media container like MKV or the industry standard container for H.264 video, MP4.

/end rant
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Postby DJ_Izumi » Sat Jan 06, 2007 9:02 pm

Seems to me, instead of staying with AVI so you can keep using VirtualDub and VfW, it'd be better to upgrade VirtualDub to actually work with DirectShow video...
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Postby Willen » Sat Jan 06, 2007 9:14 pm

DJ_Izumi wrote:Seems to me, instead of staying with AVI so you can keep using VirtualDub and VfW, it'd be better to upgrade VirtualDub to actually work with DirectShow video...

Avery Lee, the creator of VirtualDub has stated it's not going to happen. VDub is a VfW application and is staying that way. Supposedly, DirectShow is more of a playback API than an editing one, and he abandoned work on a DS VDub when signs were looking like it wasn't going to happen.

I wonder if someone will pick up the gauntlet and come up with a DirectShow equivalent to VDub...

In the meantime, there is MeGUI + AviSynth and a whole other realm of applications.
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Postby DJ_Izumi » Sat Jan 06, 2007 9:16 pm

Willen wrote:I wonder if someone will pick up the gauntlet and come up with a DirectShow equivalent to VDub...


Someone's going to have to, the lack of DShow capable tools is becoming a bigger and bigger problem. Or at least tools capable of handling h.264 and MP4 as easily as Vdub handles AVIs.
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Postby Qyot27 » Sun Jan 07, 2007 6:22 am

Willen wrote:I wonder if someone will pick up the gauntlet and come up with a DirectShow equivalent to VDub...

I doubt any solution that can truly replace VDub will be a framework-based one (like VFW, DirectShow, Quicktime, or gstreamer). My guess would be more that the program would get module-ized, and that the encoding would be controlled by external means much like MeGUI is, with the GUI serving mainly as a nice frontend. It may be fully compatible with editing and encoding via DirectShow or other means, but I don't think that would form the real core of the program's abilities.
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