Cowboy Bebop Confrontation (LOOK HERE!!!)

jethropr · Post by **jethropr** » Tue May 31, 2005 6:06 pm

I've always thought that he died because Vicious died.

If I recall correctly, it's been over a year since I've watched CB, Vicious always said that Spike could never die, because only he could kill him. and vise versa.

What I got out of the ending was that neither could be killed by anyone besides each other. So when one died, they both died.

That's my take on it atleast.

He only managed to get a few shots to the shoulder, stab to the shoulder, shallow slice to the thigh, and that's about it...

Again this is from memory, right at the end Vicious delivers a fairly deep slice to Spikes abdominal area, which probably hit some organs.

Apeotheosis · Post by **Apeotheosis** » Thu Jun 02, 2005 12:25 am

I've had so much debate and brooding on this subject that I could literally write a book SERIES on it and be able to run neck and neck with the length of the Harry Potter series.

The question, "Did Spike die?" can really never be answered by watching the anime. There are many things that suggest he DID die, but the relevancy is so minute that it's just too hard to call...which is why Bebop is such a beautiful series. Does everyone remember the scene of Spike talking to the indian? Where the indian tells him about the warrior and the stars? Well, in the end of the series that star flew by, but the question is, who's star was it? Vicious' or Spike's?

Let's take a look at what Spike has been through in the series and then compare it to the damage he took in the end of the series. Do you really think that would've killed him? A few light gun bullet holes and a slash flesh wound? For crying out loud the man has fell from a two(could be more, can't remember) story building that just blew up from a gernade explosion and made it out with a bunch of bandages. It's highly doubtful that he died in my opinion.

To answer the original question of what episode is better, Ballad of Fallen Angels takes the cake in my book. That whole scene...."Walk in the Rain" by Yoko Kanno....mother of F, it's just spine-tingling.

peaches11 · Post by **peaches11** » Thu Jun 02, 2005 3:47 am

Ballad of Fallen Angels is what I consider to be the best episode of any anime ever. IT tells so much abotu every character and has so much conflict and passion in it that it's almost too much. It's brilliantly done all the ay through, and while RFB is good, it's the end.

Yes, Spike died. That bullet wound may have hit something bad, and the sword probably was worse; on top of that he was surrounded by mafia. He had little reason to live anymore, he had killed Vicious and Julia was gone. While he could've gone back to the Bebop, his main goal was done. It really ties up the whole series perectly for him to die. It's bitter, but the ending is a must for the series to be complete. *It makes me cry too*

Apeotheosis · Post by **Apeotheosis** » Thu Jun 02, 2005 1:21 pm

No - he lives on, period.

And the matter of mafia surrounding him doesn't matter. Vicious was dead, you chop the head off a snake, and the rest of the body just doesn't know what to do. Not to mention most of them were sided with Li.

Bardiel13 · Post by **Bardiel13** » Thu Jun 02, 2005 2:44 pm

Maybe it was oh, say... open ended. Kinda like End of Evangelion. There are many theories on how Evangelion ended so why not Cowboy Bebop?

Heero_Yuy84 · Post by **Heero_Yuy84** » Thu Jun 02, 2005 5:51 pm

You left out one big factor here which, while it sounds a bit ludicrous, is a factor writers have often employed...

Will to live.

Think about it for a moment.

The reason he survived all those other times was because he felt he still had something left to do...and that was find Julia again. By the time he finally DOES find her, however, she's dead. With this, he's lost the one thing that's kept him hanging on. So now, there's only one thing he can do...fight Vicious, kill him, and bring everything full circle.

That's the reason he's dead...he had done everything he set out to do...as far as he was concerned, he had nothing left holding him to this world.

Or...in the immortal words of Michael Biehn:

"FORGET HIM, HE'S GONE!"

Bardiel13 · Post by **Bardiel13** » Thu Jun 02, 2005 7:28 pm

Ok, I know how Cowboy Bebop got pretty deep towards the end, but that's, like, EVANGELION DEEP! I think you don't really know or you can believe what you want to believe, sorta like in End of Eva (gads, I'm repeating myself).

Apeotheosis · Post by **Apeotheosis** » Fri Jun 03, 2005 10:53 am

We're already discussed that factor, and of course, it would once again hint towards his death, but regardless, I will not accept his death in all my stubborn bliss.

Hard to believe, but in the long run there was a huge connection between him and Faye. Despite how they act, they obviously had feelings for each other. A few things that illustrated this was Spike saving her in Ballad of Fallen Angels and Faye's subtle jealousy when she first discovers that the girl she's been riding around with just so happens to be the corrupter of Spike's heart. Also when Faye bandaged him up after the HUGE fall, and was sitting there by his side (or at least gave you the feeling the she was) until he woke up.

Ridiculous reason to live on? Not in my hopeless romantic heart.

Bardiel13 · Post by **Bardiel13** » Fri Jun 03, 2005 1:08 pm

And as dramatic it would've been... the whole "will to live" thing would be a bit childish of Spike if he just decided to die, now that his gf was dead. That would be just sad. And not in the boo-hoo kind either.

jethropr · Post by **jethropr** » Sun Jun 05, 2005 3:20 pm

Spike died, nuff said.

lol