Poll - War of the Containers

[CHAMELEON_D_H]

For some time it seems that .MKV and .MP4 are getting more and more common. My question is' do you even use the added options?

Would you use the subtitels to kareoke a sond, or wont even bother to enabel the stream?
Do you use the 5.1 audio stream or not?
And do you think that h264 is common enough to destribute without too many people complaining that they can't open it?


Please copy, paste and leave the right answer -

Containers - .MKV & .MP4 - Better than .AVI \ What's that?
Video codec - h264 - I'm all for qualty, and ready to run it \ GO DivX 3.11 GO!!
Audio - 5.1 VS 2.0 - Bring it on (5.1) \ How can it be ".1"? \ Both
Subtitels - I kareoke song all the time \ Kareoke is is for hippies!!!


I'm simply asking to know if its worh the trouble to add fetures like dual audio and kareoke subs, and if most people can play h264.

Thanks for answering, comments are always welcome.

[Infinity Squared]

Containers - .MKV & .MP4 - Better than .AVI
To the general public, it matters none. Honestly, often it's only when you look closer do you realise something's better or when you have something to compare with.

Video codec - h264 - I'm all for qualty, and ready to run it
I've been impressed with its quality to size ratio... but if I were to encode in h.264, it'd be plainly for experimental purposes... if I were to make a video that I would consider one of my opus and want to get attention for it, I certainly won't be encoding it in h.264 in a hurry... yeah, not just yet.

Audio - 5.1 VS 2.0 - meh
Honestly... why would you need 5.1 on a stereo song. Honestly, unless you constructed the music yourself, you'd be hard pressed to find a song that would be in 5.1 let alone have actual separate parts of it outputted in the different chanels. Of course fansubs are a different matter, but is that really what we're discussing here?

Subtitels - I kareoke song all the time
I want to do karaoke one day...

Are these being used for anything in particular or are you just curious?

[CHAMELEON_D_H]

The poll is for anybody who wants to use the info. Adding kareoke and compressing with h264 wil requiere new containers. Theres no point in adding subs if no-one will use them, and I've noticed that wonderful AMVs like Forsaken by Clodo came out in many versions - with and without subs. A subtitels stream can save that bandwith. And as for 5.1, maybe its just me but using the 5.1 stream in Mttencacht puts it on a whole new level . yet not everyone has surround in their computer, and many use their surround in their DVDs and leave the computer with normal stereo speakers. So again, is there any need to bother putting 5.1 stream and enlarging the filesize by something that no-one uses.

[Keeper of Hellfire]

Containers - .MKV & .MP4 - Better than .AVI
As long as not using H.264 and the audio source is stereo, .AVI serves it's purpose well, and it has a wide acceptance. MP4 is the standard container for the h.264 codec and will be supported by the industry. I don't see any advantage in MKV for AMV's - I don't need menus, chapters, multiple audio and subtitle tracks or streaming, and I don't believe that it'll be supported by the industry.

Video codec - h264
Ask again in one or two years.

Audio - 5.1 VS 2.0
Why 5.1 if the source (Audio CD) is stereo? Makes only sense if the source is 5.1. So if the music is released on DVD-Audio and mixed in 5.1, why not?

Subtitels
Whoever subtitles an AMV for Karaoke should burn in hell.

[Coderjo]

Containers - .MP4 - Better than .AVI and .MKV
Any recent codec, starting with MPEG1 really, needs to reference more than one frame for roughly 73% of the frames. XivD and DivX use hacks to fit this into the AVI format. The AVI x264 codec also has to rely on hacks to work. MKV may be able to handle anything you throw at it, but I really don't think you will see it accepted by many dedicated players, such as set-top boxes and High Def DVD format players. Why not use the container these formats were meant to be in? .MP4 supports chapters, menus, and subtitles as well, without the burden of having something in some unknown format, since .MP4 supports only a controlled set of audio and video codecs to make it easier to implement.

Video codec - h264 - I'm all for qualty, and ready to run it
I've already used h264 a number of times. So far, I have one AMV released in it, but I have been throwing various footage at the x264 encoder to learn how to best use it.

Audio - 5.1 VS 2.0 - Both
This depends on the audio source. If the source is 2.0, encode it as 2.0 and use that. If the source is 5.1, then use that. I recently encoded a HD commercial to show someone, and even they used 5.1.

Subtitles - meh
I've only timed karaoke subtitles a few times to date. I really don't see the need for it on an AMV, unless the song isn't English. As long as the subs are optional, I don't care that much.

I don't see any advantage in MKV for AMV's - I don't need menus, chapters, multiple audio and subtitle tracks or streaming, and I don't believe that it'll be supported by the industry.

I guess ADV, Anime Network, and Apple aren't part of "the industry," then. Apple's QuickTime system supports .mp4, and .mp4 is modeled on the .mov format a bit. I seem to recall Apple putting some HD clips on their site in .mp4 format. In addition, ADV/AN's podcast uses the MP4 container, although they seem to name the files .m4v for some reason. And, as I mentioned above, XviD, DivX, and h264 use or require ugly hacks to make them work within the constraints of the AVI file format.

[Melanchthon]

Containers - .MKV & .MP4 - Better than .AVI \ What's that?
What, no inbetween option?
I'm not too fussed on what mkv has to offer, but mp4 files seem to be better quality than avi files at the same size. I don't know how much of that difference is down to the skill of the editors though, as I haven't been following development.

Video codec - h264 - I'm all for quality, and ready to run it
No other comment, really.

Audio - 5.1 VS 2.0 - Both
I can't play 5.1 and I'm perfectly happy with 2.0, as it's what I listen to the vast majority of the time. Nice bonus if you have the setup for it, though.

Subtitels - Neither of the given choices
I wouldn't mind soft subtitles for death metal or foreign language vids, or anything else with unintelligible lyrics.
Sub streams could also be useful for times when a creator wants to talk about their vid even while you're watching it.

[Scintilla]

Containers - .MKV & .MP4 - Better than .AVI \ What's that?
What, no inbetween option?
I'm not too fussed on what mkv has to offer, but mp4 files seem to be better quality than avi files at the same size. I don't know how much of that difference is down to the skill of the editors though, as I haven't been following development.

That difference should be due to the codecs used, not the container.

I'll definitely have to offer an x264 version of my next video, probably in an alternative container like OGM. No need for 5.1 audio or softsubs though (hardsubs, however, will be playing an important role).

[trythil]

Containers - .MKV & .MP4 - Better than .AVI \ What's that?
What, no inbetween option? :roll:
I'm not too fussed on what mkv has to offer, but mp4 files seem to be better quality than avi files at the same size.

What the heck does that mean?

I can mux the same video and audio streams into both a Matroska and MP4 container. Those files will therefore have the same quality.

The size difference is something around 6.7 kilobytes for a 2 minute video -- in favor of the MP4 container. In other words, the size difference is pretty much meaningless in the context of video and audio.

Anyway:

Containers - .MKV & .MP4 - Better than .AVI - I've been using Matroska since soon after tools were released to the public, and plan to use it and MP4 heavily in future.

Video codec - h264 - I'm all for quality and ready to run it - I've been using x264 since revision 158.

Audio - 5.1 VS 2.0 - eh. 5.1 (or 6.1/7.1) audio really only makes sense to me if the original source was like that in the first place. I'll definitely take advantage of multichannel audio sources when I hear them, though. Modern audio compression technologies can handle them very nicely.

Subtitles - Yeah, I'll use them when necessary. Why not? They don't add much with regards to size, and they can be helpful.

===

don't see any advantage in MKV for AMV's - I don't need menus, chapters

Long multi-editor project videos?

multiple audio and subtitle tracks or streaming, and I don't believe that it'll be supported by the industry.

A shame if that comes to pass.

There is one thing that Matroska does have going for it, and that's the ability to accept almost anything out there. You won't find much else that'll let you do something like H.264 video and Vorbis audio, for instance.
(Yeah, you can do that with MP4, but...)

[Keeper of Hellfire]

I don't see any advantage in MKV for AMV's - I don't need menus, chapters, multiple audio and subtitle tracks or streaming, and I don't believe that it'll be supported by the industry.

I guess ADV, Anime Network, and Apple aren't part of "the industry," then. Apple's QuickTime system supports .mp4, and .mp4 is modeled on the .mov format a bit. I seem to recall Apple putting some HD clips on their site in .mp4 format.

You see the difference between the bold marks? If you read my post again you'll find that I said that MP4 is the industry standard.

[Zarxrax]

That difference should be due to the codecs used, not the container.

I'll definitely have to offer an x264 version of my next video, probably in an alternative container like OGM. No need for 5.1 audio or softsubs though (hardsubs, however, will be playing an important role).

Please no OGM. That container just needs to die. MP4 or MKV please