(Feedback!) New Project A-kon AMV Contest for 2006

[rubyeye]

Some of you might know that this year I participated as a judge for Akon's AMV contest. In light of my past success, and support, at Akon I have been asked to offer any help I can to "coordinate" the contest for 2006. So acting as a liaison, I am pro-actively engaging the community of editors and fans to give me as much input on how we can re-design the AMV Contest in order to gather more interest and make it more fun for both the editors and fans.

Please post any thoughts you have regarding this matter, your impressions about the overall presentation of the contest, how it can be changed, opinions on prizes, submission and judging practices ... anything and everything.


** I'd especially like to hear from fellow TEXAS editors and returning fans to Akon. Since living in close proximity to the convention, you folks make up the majority of attendents.

[ryoneko]

I think a good deal of us would like to see actual catagories implemented into the contest. Most cons these days use at least Action, Drama and Comedy, or more. Generally I find that the comedy videos get the most love or fan reaction, so when all the videos are lumped into 1st, 2nd, or 3rd place....it doesn't leave much room for the other themed videos.

Making a rule to make it a requirement to cut off subtitles would be nice. They're so very distracting to the viewer. The Sango video from Inu-Yasha this year would have been so very lovely if they had just been removed with black bars.

How many videos in all were received this year? I don't know if an official count was ever announced. If there were over 50, perhaps implementing a "finalists" showing of the contest should be used. It seems that same sort of thing happened unofficially this year anyways, since only about 30 videos were shown.

A confirmation on if our video(s) were accepted before the start of the con would also be very helpful.

When submitting our videos we were told to remove any credits, and I figured they'd be added by staff for the showing so they'd be uniform. But at the contest there were still no credits or bumpers. This is kind of sad for the editors, who didn't receive any credit for their hard work. It also makes it difficult when the viewers want to know what anime or song was used.

The trophies you guys had this year were awesome. I'd much rather receive a nice award rather than manga or dvds, though they make a nice added bonus....:)

- A Fellow Texan AMVer

[Elgebar]

Thanks rubyeye for starting this thread and ryoneko for being so quick to post. As promised in a previous post, I have also created a video forum with topics and polls on the Project A-kon forum boards for everyone who would like to provide feedback. (I hope you don't mind, but I borrowed your wording rubyeye...you did such a nice job! )

The new forum location is:

http://www.a-kon.com/cgi-bin/ikonboard. ... ct=SC;c=25

Feel free to post opinions and comments in either location as I will be monitoring and responding to both locations. Additionally, I will be posting a list of the video submissions, creators, and web links (where available) on the A-kon AMV Contest forum within the next week or so.

Lastly, I will commit to the AMV community that we will do our best to improve the Project A-kon AMV Contest and that our re-structure will be governed by majority rule as much as possible, so please continue to send us your feedback. As we draft new rules and policies, we will be posting them on the A-kon AMV Contest forum along with new polls as we begin to define feature/change requests.

Thanks.

[Elgebar]

I think a good deal of us would like to see actual catagories implemented into the contest...

ryoneko, help me understand a little better what you would like to see...

1. Would you like to see winners in each category?
2. Should the video creators determine their own categorization?
3. Should the videos be shown in categorigal order or mixed together for the fan's choice voting?

Making a rule to make it a requirement to cut off subtitles would be nice. They're so very distracting to the viewer. The Sango video from Inu-Yasha this year would have been so very lovely if they had just been removed with black bars.

I completely agree. I really enjoyed that video, and would have enjoyed it much more if there were no subtitles. I will add a poll to the A-kon AMV Contest forum so folks can vote on the subtitles issue.

How many videos in all were received this year? I don't know if an official count was ever announced.

The official counts were as follows:

- 53 videos submitted
- 11 videos cut due to technical problems during the re-encode
- 10 videos cut to reduce the AMV Contest to 2-2.5 hours

If there were over 50, perhaps implementing a "finalists" showing of the contest should be used. It seems that same sort of thing happened unofficially this year anyways, since only about 30 videos were shown.

I also like this idea and so I played the top 3 videos from the fan's choice vote off. I have been thinking about making this permanent and showing the top 5 videos in future years. I just want to make sure that we keep the awards ceremony to an hour or so. I'll post another poll so folks can vote on this as well.

A confirmation on if our video(s) were accepted before the start of the con would also be very helpful.

Ok. This is a great idea, but can be a bit time consuming/difficult for us here on staff sometimes. From year to year, we receive a number of submissions that do not follow the rules and provide limited or no information, or the information provided is scribbled on the DVD/VCD/VHS in the smallest handwriting with the fattest Sharpie folks can find. How about this as a compromise:

1. We provide a downloadable PDF form that folks have to print, fill out and return with each video submitted. (Must be legible)
2. Upon reciept of your video submission we notify the contact email listed on the form with any problems or concerns with your submissions.
3. In order to do this for each submission, would you guys be willing to accept an April, 1st (or 2nd for you superstitious folks ) deadline for video submissions?

When submitting our videos we were told to remove any credits, and I figured they'd be added by staff for the showing so they'd be uniform. But at the contest there were still no credits or bumpers. This is kind of sad for the editors, who didn't receive any credit for their hard work.

Yes, and that was our mistake, not intentional, and we owe each creator a sincere apology. We spent the time to create splash screens before each video with video name, anime name, and creator name; but, when we inserted them they were not rendered as 10 second movies, but as 10 second stills. In our test deck everything ran fine, but on the region-free DVD decks provided to us by the convention the videos would stop on the last frame and pause for 10 seconds before moving to the next video. Once discovered, we fixed this for the awards ceremony and it should not be a problem again. Additionally, we have comendeered a DVD player from the convention and will have it available for testing before the convention begins. Again, our apologies and I assure you it won't happen again.

The trophies you guys had this year were awesome. I'd much rather receive a nice award rather than manga or dvds, though they make a nice added bonus....

Thanks! We currently plan on continuing to give trophies and DVDs to the winners. I don't think we'll be changing that policy unless the AMV community pushes for something else.

Thanks, ryoneko for the great feedback. Please keep it coming in.

[Elgebar]

Here are a few other items I would like to see some feedback on: (Some of these are already polls on the A-kon AMV forum)

- How do you think studio trailers and credits should be handled?

- What is the maximum video length that should be allowed into the contest?

- What is the maximum number of video submissions that should be allowed into the contest?

- How long do you think the AMV contest should be?

Thanks.

[ryoneko]

>_> <_< >_> ....... *replies again*

1. Would you like to see winners in each category?
2. Should the video creators determine their own categorization?
3. Should the videos be shown in categorigal order or mixed together for the fan's choice voting?

1. Yes. A first place winner, and a runner up would probably be efficient enough.
2. Usually, in the contests I've participated in so far, the creators pick the catagory from the list provided by the staff. The staff leaves a disclaimer that if they disagree with the creator's choice, it may be moved to the appropriate catagory as seen fit.
3. This is more of an opinion than anything else, since I've heard mixed feelings. Personally I like the videos grouped by catagory. In Otakon's case, the Comedy is left for last since that's usually what everyone comes to see. :P But overall it gives a much more organized feel to the contest.

I just want to make sure that we keep the awards ceremony to an hour or so.

I've never come across an awards ceremony running too long. It doesn't take much time to show the winners and runner-ups, and to give the prizes. If the case is that there's over ten or so prizes to give, perhaps just show the top winners, but announce the runner-ups without a video showing.

- 11 videos cut due to technical problems during the re-encode

I'm pretty sure this is why my video got hacked - since it didn't have sound during the Showcase. I was positive I used the codecs listed available in the rules, and I sent it very early to make sure if there were any problems, they could be fixed. But alas....

1. We provide a downloadable PDF form that folks have to print, fill out and return with each video submitted. (Must be legible)

Uniform entry forms would be a blessing. It would cut down on the confusion of what is required when submitting immensly.

2. Upon reciept of your video submission we notify the contact email listed on the form with any problems or concerns with your submissions.

This would be simply to enough to put most amv editor's minds to rest. I worried from the day I submitted to the contest showing at the con as to whether or not my mailman either delivered it or some random psycho was using my cd for a coaster.

3. In order to do this for each submission, would you guys be willing to accept an April, 1st (or 2nd for you superstitious folks ) deadline for video submissions?

If it meant a smoother contest and lesser worries - I'd accept this in a heartbeat. Can't speak for everyone else, though. I'm not much of a procrastinator. :P Well...most of the time. I think.

Thank you for the explanation about the credits at the showing. That clarifies a whole lot.

--------------------------------------------

- How do you think studio trailers and credits should be handled?

Uniform title bumpers, stating Editor name, Animes used, and Song Title/Artist is usually suffice enough. Usually they're displayed just before the video begins.

- What is the maximum video length that should be allowed into the contest?

This one's always a hard one....like the Trigun Desperado video, which was over 8 minutes, was an awesome video. But I've also seen long videos that just....drag on for forever. Usually I'd say around 5 minutes being the limit, otherwise fans get restless.

- What is the maximum number of video submissions that should be allowed into the contest?

I don't think A-kon is big enough yet to limit it to just one, but I'd say no more than two (for the contest). Try and at least try to give everyone a chance. :P The Showcase...who knows.

- How long do you think the AMV contest should be?

However long it takes to show them all - if you don't intend to narrow them down to the top finalists (say the top 30 or so, or if you do catagories, the top 5 to 10 in each).

That's all I have to say for now. XP Someone else pipe up so I can quit monolouging.

-ryoneko

[Beowulf]

I think the best way to improve the contest at A-kon is to just imitate AWA in every way possible.

Have DISTINCT catagories; Action, Drama, Romance, Technical, Free-Form, Judge's Choice, Viewer's Choice, Sentimental

Do everything digitaly. VHS is dead, and has been for at least 3 years. A-kons insistence to use VHS is mainly what causes all these horror stories like "they played my video with no audio".

Have a technical director who actually knows what he's doing. Two A-kons ago I actually yelled at the guy who was running the show because he botched the job SO BAD it was embarrassing. The volume was never loud enough, certain videos didn't even have sound, all the videos looked TERRIBLE due to their VHSness, ect. It was made painfully obvious that the directors of the AMV contest had no clue what they were doing and had no intention of learning. I forget the guy's name because I was so furious but his attitude was basically "yeah well thats the way we do it and so what".

Also, get some real judges. Rubyeye is a great start and a great idea. We need more respected and accomplished people as judges. Having some random guy who knows nothing about editing nor videos, doesn't really give gravitas to the awards that you hand out.

People spend GOOD money and drive for hours to come and see their video on the big screen in front of an audience, and to see it completely ruined in front of a thousand people isn't very fun. This has happend to Wonka and I two years in a row now. We won't ever buy an Akon badge again and have told everyone we know to do the same but it would still be nice if the contest were improved for the good of the land.

[Beowulf]

I just realized that most of that post was me bitching so let me give some constructive ideas:

I think the idea to cut videos over 5 minutes is flawed. Videos should be cut if they are bad, and for no other reason. If a 10 minute video is bad, cut it. If an 8 minute video rocks, keep it in. I really don't see how there could be any source of debate on this issue. Its pretty cut and dry. Good = Yes, Bad = No.

Make every creator submit his/her video in an MPEG-2 file. The resolution needs to be 720x480. The framerate needs to be 29.970, 23.976, or 24. The audio needs to be from a .wav file or encoded into the MPEG-2 at 384kbs.

Tell creators to cut their bumpers. If you cut the bumpers out of all the videos, at the end of the day you would have room for about 5-10 extra videos in the contest. No Bumpers = Less Time Used = More Videos = Happier People.

I've been to Akon 3 times, and I can conservitively say that if I were a judge, I would have cut about 1/3rd of the videos shown. Either they were horrible, or had pounds of technical problems. I think a very good way to improve the contest is to just make it tougher. Don't be affraid to cut bad videos. It add prestiege to the contest. Currently no one cares if they made the Akon "finals" because the finals consist of everything shown. Don't show your audience the sea of unwashed crap that you guys undoubtably get. Cut it down to the very best and show THAT to the audience. If you recieve 150 videos, you should show the audience 35-50.

I hope that helps

[Machine]

I think the idea to cut videos over 5 minutes is flawed. Videos should be cut if they are bad, and for no other reason. If a 10 minute video is bad, cut it. If an 8 minute video rocks, keep it in. I really don't see how there could be any source of debate on this issue. Its pretty cut and dry. Good = Yes, Bad = No.

I was actually pretty cool about this when the Akon AMV Contest director cut me for time. My video was 8 1/2 minutes and was cut out of the contest to make it shorter (VASH:Desperado).

Personally I think that's a load of crap when I know that the only reason I was cut was to make room for about 3-4 more shitty videos.

My video has actually played at several other CONs despite the time length. Not only that but, AKON happens to me one my home CONs here in TEXAS and I got cut from it. It made my whole trip a waste because I was really hoping to see how the AKON crowd would react to it.

But hey whatever, AKON hasn't really handled their AMV contests all too well in the past. And this is coming from someone who has won there two years in a row.

New judges are always a plus, and if they are AMV creators, even better because they know exactly that its Quality of videos vs Quantity. If you have 1 or 2 hrs of great videos the audience will love it. You give them 2 hrs of shitty stuff with only a few good videos....they end up hating the entire expereince.

At least I've always found it pretty grooling when I have to sit through everything that looks the same O_O.

/end ego-rant

[Elgebar]

Beowulf,

I am very glad to hear specifically from you on this subject, and I would assume Wonka would have similar, if not the same, feedback. Thanks for taking the time to express both your opinions and your critques.

Do everything digitaly. VHS is dead, and has been for at least 3 years. A-kons insistence to use VHS is mainly what causes all these horror stories like "they played my video with no audio".

Good news. I agree and VHS is gone. This was the first year we did not render anything to VHS and accepted non VHS submissions. Unfortunately, it came with it's own set of issues, but, all in all, I think it was much better than previous years. Additionally, I have some ideas on how we can improve our processes and bring it up to an acceptable standard.

Have a technical director who actually knows what he's doing.

I think I know who you are referring to and he is no longer involved with the AMV Contest directly. I come to the table with a host of real life experience managing large teams of people and corporate events, so hopefully I qualify on some level. The only regret I have is allowing the contest to run for an additional year without polling the fan base for feedback.

Also, get some real judges. Rubyeye is a great start and a great idea. We need more respected and accomplished people as judges.

I also agree with this statement, wholeheartedly. In fact, I would be willing to accept a few more folks from the video maker pool if they would like to volunteer. You guys know how to PM me.

Having some random guy who knows nothing about editing nor videos, doesn't really give gravitas to the awards that you hand out.

True. I, for one, am a video maker and agree that it takes someone with intimate knowledge of the creation process to appreciate the effort. Unfortunately, I am not doing amvs so much any more, but I used to back in the early days before I got involved in my daily work grind. Perhaps I will capture my some of my vids and post them for you guys sometime.

This has happend to Wonka and I two years in a row now. We won't ever buy an Akon badge again and have told everyone we know to do the same but it would still be nice if the contest were improved for the good of the land.

I am sorry to hear that your experience was so negative and I understand that my apologies (and promises) probably mean very little to you, but I will offer them nonetheless. That being said, I would urge you to reconsider and try us again net year as I want to focus on those people who have had experiences like yours. In fact, if you chose to let bygones be and try us again, I will comp two weekend badges for you and Wonka out of my own personal allotment. Please, at least think about it and feel free to PM me if you would like to discuss privately.

-----------------------------

I just realized that most of that post was me bitching so let me give some constructive ideas:

Thanks again. I appreciate the feedback, and I also think that it was important for me to see the last post as well. Understanding past pains can also help me understand what types of changes need to be made with regards to those who participate in and interface with you guys as amv creators.

I think the idea to cut videos over 5 minutes is flawed. Videos should be cut if they are bad, and for no other reason.

This is a great comcept, but can be difficult to implement. The source of debate on this issue is that length of time is an objective set of criteria while quality of the amv is subjective. Perhaps improving the judges panel would give some renewed faith in any decisions we might make with regards to what gets cut and what doesn't, but I don't think there is an objective way to determine an amv's quality. For example, what I might consider great others might consider teriible or vice versa. If we were to approach it this way, I would probably base it on cumulative judges scoring, lowest scores are cut; and, would like have the judges notes and scores on hand for any video creator who wanted feedback on their videos at the contest showing. Is this akin to the way you were thinking, Beowulf? To be honest, I would like everyone's opinion on it, so please post. The only reason we would cut next year would be to keep the length of time under control, but I can see great benefit in splitting the contest into two parts, with judges finalists being one group. It would depend on the number of quality submissions we get.

Make every creator submit his/her video in an MPEG-2 file. The resolution needs to be 720x480. The framerate needs to be 29.970, 23.976, or 24. The audio needs to be from a .wav file or encoded into the MPEG-2 at 384kbs.

We will be re-writing the entire ruleset this year and I am going to tighten up the submission media, encoding, and formats to something similar if not exactly what you are already suggesting.

Tell creators to cut their bumpers.

We have done this before, but it seems that every year we have a number of submissions who refuse to follow the rules. What we have done in times past is just hack up the video. Do you think it would be appropriate to elimiate any video submitted that cannot follow the rules, or do you think we should continue to try to chop the bumpers of the videos?

I think a very good way to improve the contest is to just make it tougher. Don't be affraid to cut bad videos. It add prestiege to the contest.

Well said and noted. If we decide to take this route, I would like to take the remaining submissions and show them as well. Becuase of the amount of work involved in video creation, I think that everyone deserves to have their video shown at the convention on the big screen and I don't want to discourage newer or more casual video makers from submitting becuase they feel their video won't be shown. Perhaps it is time that we look at breaking out the event into several smaller categories where we can cater to the elite skilled and another seperate event where we can cater to the newer or casual amv creators. What do you think?

Thanks for the great feedback, Beowulf. It is greatly appreciated.