The definition of "Effort"?

Maverick-Rubik · Post by **Maverick-Rubik** » Wed Sep 01, 2004 2:44 pm

This has recently come to my mind, but I think that on the "Submit Opinion" page the "Has Followed the Teachings of the Masters" definition of 10 Effort is misleading to those who don't know what "effort" means. I've seen it mistaken 2 or 3 times by oppers for how well their concept was illustrated, not how hard they worked on it (which is what effort should be, ya?).

I think it's time for a definition change...

fyrtenheimer · Post by **fyrtenheimer** » Wed Sep 01, 2004 2:47 pm

..do we all even agree on what Effort's definition is? I'm more worried about the people who grade upon how many "hours" it took.

Zarxrax · Post by **Zarxrax** » Wed Sep 01, 2004 5:41 pm

Its a pretty useless score in my opinion. Unless the creator tells you how much effort they put in, then how can you really know? And then they could lie about it anyways.
Whatever could concievably be worth rating within the effort score should already be encompassed between all the other scores.
When I'm scoring, I'll often rate it about the same as overall, but maybe +/- a little bit just to weight my overall score in one direction or the other...

Org Profile · Post by **Otohiko** » Wed Sep 01, 2004 8:03 pm

I get it pretty well though, and I tend to think it's very useful - in my ops, anyway. It comes in handy when you come across something that was clearly very ambitious and meticulously edited, but there were editing solutions I didn't like and such, tricky as they may have been. In that case, I'd lower the 'editing/sync' mark but raise the 'effort' mark.

CerebralAssamite · Post by **CerebralAssamite** » Wed Sep 01, 2004 9:06 pm

For one I dont read the lines of crap people write about a video, I dont want anything to cloud my judgement if I wish to give it an op.

If i read that someones computer blew up and then the 4th time the did it, it didnt turn out the way they wanted and then they got a virus, you kinda feel sorry for them.
I grade effort on everything, style, music genre, sync, titles(if they have them), mise en scene

hehe love that word.
I try not to let my own personal tases in music cloud my judgement also but if its something I really dont like well, im only human.

madbunny · Post by **madbunny** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 1:50 am

Well since you are basically grading the video on how hard YOU think THEY worked it's pretty subjective, unlike say video or sound quality.

When you read about editors taking three days to work on five seconds of timeline that seems like a lot of work, but the whole idea behind it is to NOT have that effort show through and make it all seamless. So I guess if the video looks like to took a lot of effort, then you should give a low score right? No.. that doesn't seem right either.

Maybe we should either lose it or label it using some more descriptive terms.

fyrtenheimer · Post by **fyrtenheimer** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 6:37 am

madbunny wrote:Well since you are basically grading the video on how hard YOU think THEY worked it's pretty subjective, unlike say video or sound quality.

Maybe we should either lose it or label it using some more descriptive terms.

Might as well keep it. All of those grading options are how you see them, it's all opinionated.

Lyrs · Post by **Lyrs** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 10:17 pm

They can put 100+ hours into making a video, but if it still "sucks" by definiton of it being badly processed, than "effort" is missing.

Quality over quantity.

Flint the Dwarf · Post by **Flint the Dwarf** » Fri Sep 03, 2004 1:04 am

Lyrs wrote:They can put 100+ hours into making a video, but if it still "sucks" by definiton of it being badly processed, than "effort" is missing.

Quality over quantity.

Um no, not really. Some people can work their asses off and still make a bad video. You can put a lot of effort into something, but not have the resources or vision to turn it into something enjoyable... making it come out a mess that only makes sense to the creator.

Really, it's hard to judge effort, because you can't know what people put into a video. But you can usually tell when someone just slapped down some video and put an audio track over it.

godix · Post by **godix** » Fri Sep 03, 2004 11:19 am

I personally based effort on if there's lots of room for improvement or not. If the video had huge glaring errors that could have been reasonably fixed with a little effort then they get a lower score. If I don't have any real complaints, or my complaints are with style rather than technical issues, then more effort wouldn't have really helped and they get a high score. How much time a person put into the video doesn't matter, instead it's all about if they should have put more time in it or not. This does got modified somewhat by other considerations. I'm more lenient with technical problems in a technically complex video just because there are so many more things that can be a problem. I also automatically give peoples first videos a couple extra points just because it takes effort to learn the basics enough to finish a video.

I do see a purpose to the effort catagory. It's a catagory for 'could this have reasonably been better'? Sure, it might be redundant to some other catagories but then again so is overall. If anything was going to be changed in catagories I'd like to see action/edit seperated. I vew those as two seperate, but similar, catagories and frequently would have given different scores to them if they were seperate.