Otakon AMV Master's Invitational

dwchang · Post by **dwchang** » Fri Dec 19, 2003 4:17 pm

MCWagner wrote:
dwchang wrote:
Nappy wrote:AWA masters rules limit entrants, but winning at any recognized contest is still a very large group of ppl. But it still doesn't get that many entrants each year (over a dozen or so?).
Uhm..the numbers I heard were 40+ people entering the contest. The growth has been exponential.

Oh HELL no. 40+? Not even close. You might be thinking of the pro contest that got 54 entries, but Master's this last year got 16. Significant upward arc in submissions, but nowhere near exponential.

As I said in the PM to you, I meant total submissions. I know entries obviously get cut for not following the rules (like not putting a coat size) and 16 were shown at the Master's showing on Sunday. As I said in the PM though, I could be wrong and be recalling the total submissions incorrectly, but I *think* that's what Quu told me.

In any case, the main reason I brought it up was to support the case that you're going to need a lot of submissions to have a decent contest with 4 categories which I still believe in regardless.

Org Profile · Post by **Vlad G Pohnert** » Fri Dec 19, 2003 4:22 pm

VegettoEX wrote:I think the fact that most of the people expressing sentiments of caution concerning a new Otakon contest are past Otakon contest winners speaks great volumes. There's a deep love and loyalty for Otakon's AMV contest as-is, and any changes to that are potentially changing the way people might feel about the contest.

If there are extra resources to be dedicated to additional competitions, I'd rather see those resources placed with NON-competing showings. People are thoroughly expressing feelings that they don't wish to be placed on this golden pedestal ABOVE others; creating some kind of STANDARD way and place for EVERYONE to be shown together totally destroys any hint of "elitism" (god, do I hate that word, and I sincerely hope everyone else does, too).

Look at the fan-parody / trailer showings the last two years. There's been an entire ROOM dedicated to showing ONLY AMV and AMV-related (parodies, trailers) programming... and it's constantly packed with people. This should TELL us something. General con-goers WANT to see MORE of this kind of thing.

While trailers are still such a young concept, I'd love to see an organized, non-competiting showing of them. Sure, trailers are starting to seep over into contests and win awards (AWA), but I still think they're new enough that a con could really take a stand with non-competiting showings and let everyone be on equal ground, be shown together, and just have a good time.

Of course, I'm very biased (after seeing The Professional and Obligatory EVA Trailer played at Otakon 2K1 and 2K2, respectively), but watching a crowd that filled MORE than a single room want to see that kind of stuff...

The con is supposed to be for the general con-goers, not the AMV creators... I think if we pay attention to what THESE people want, it's showing they want more, more, more... and they don't care if its competiting, or not.

I can't agree with you more. I'd like to see more resources and budgeting go to develop the existing AMV activities (Contest, panel, AMV room, etc). There was talk in having a FULL AMV track and that would be great. Also, I know Otakon being a huge con has restrictions on space and times so adding another contest will mean the regular one will be cut down...

Vlad

Ashyukun · Post by **Ashyukun** » Mon Dec 22, 2003 11:26 am

I'll toss my hat into this discussion as well. I'm with D-dubya and Vlad, I'd rather see more focus in general put on AMVs in general than to see a 'masters' level contest. As has been said- many people already regard Otakon's contest as one of the 'masters' level contests on the 'AMV contest circuit'. I don't see any reason to make a level above it. There's no shortage of quality entries for it, and I seriously doubt any crowd going to see the contest has been disappointed by what they saw.

Frankly if you're going to add another contest into the mix, I'd rather see you go the other way with it and have it be more of an 'entry level' contest, where only people who haven't either a) made it into the Otakon contest before or b) ever won an award for a video can enter. This would give the newer editors who are just getting started more of a presence at the convention. I really don't think we really need another exclusive contest for the 'better editors'. I'd rather encourage the new and up-and-coming editors than have yet another contest that caters to the better of us (nothing against the better of us- but I don't think we- being somewhat presumptuous and counting myself in said group- really need it...).

AbsoluteDestiny · Post by **AbsoluteDestiny** » Mon Dec 22, 2003 12:39 pm

Ashyukun wrote: This would give the newer editors who are just getting started more of a presence at the convention.

YES!

We really need to look to the new creators more. I for one am not going to be making any videos that surpass the ones I've done already - it's all about the new talent.

BogoSort · Post by **BogoSort** » Mon Dec 22, 2003 12:45 pm

Just to stir up the flames, but how is the end result different for creating 2 such contests where one makes a more elitist-oriented contest, than the old one, and makes a more beginners-oriented contest. I'd assume that they'd devolve down to the same thing(unless of course, the idea is to keep the current contest completely the same as it's been for the past couple of years, which really doesn't seem like a good idea).

AbsoluteDestiny · Post by **AbsoluteDestiny** » Mon Dec 22, 2003 12:56 pm

BogoSort wrote:I'd assume that they'd devolve down to the same thing

Not if it was one contest which also gave awards to the best of the first-time con entrants.

BogoSort · Post by **BogoSort** » Mon Dec 22, 2003 1:05 pm

AbsoluteDestiny wrote:
BogoSort wrote:I'd assume that they'd devolve down to the same thing
Not if it was one contest which also gave awards to the best of the first-time con entrants.

If you're making the rules for the traditional contest mutable, I don't see how it couldn't make the rules be catered towards first time entrants. The thing that I'm concerned about is that if there's a separate first time entrant or beginner's division, that there's still a distinct division between the "beginners" and the "veterans", and that this really sounds more like a different way to sugarcoat something that so many passionately disagree with.

AbsoluteDestiny · Post by **AbsoluteDestiny** » Mon Dec 22, 2003 1:09 pm

Well, many new creators do really well, but equally many miss out because the established creators also do well.

If there were a few awards given to encourage the new creators that came close I think it would be a good thing.

It doesnt have to be a seperate contest, just there for encouragement.

BogoSort · Post by **BogoSort** » Mon Dec 22, 2003 1:14 pm

AbsoluteDestiny wrote:If there were a few awards given to encourage the new creators that came close I think it would be a good thing.

Oh, don't get me wrong, I think that giving awards to new creators is a great thing for encouraging them to submit to what's is percieved to be a very difficult contest to compete in. However, I just found it interesting to note that people dislike the idea when it's presented as giving the veterans their own place to compete so they don't intimidate the beginners, whereas people love the idea when it's presented as giving beginners their own arena to compete without the pressure of the veterans in their faces. It's wonderful how spin changes everything isn't it?

AbsoluteDestiny · Post by **AbsoluteDestiny** » Mon Dec 22, 2003 1:18 pm

Veterans get enough praise as it is, the greedy swines