New topic for "Music Video Guide"

OmniStrata · Post by **OmniStrata** » Tue Jul 29, 2003 11:28 am

Scratch the After FX part, it's got a good instruction manual as is... [so does Premiere, that's for sure...]

HOWEVER, Premiere does NOT show people how to make good "custom" fx that are NOT "built into" Premiere...

What to do, what to do...

AbsoluteDestiny · Post by **AbsoluteDestiny** » Tue Jul 29, 2003 11:29 am

I'm all for new guides really - but I will warn you, they will give you headaches with people asking you about them ^^;;;

The reason there's so much info in the ad&e guide is to cover as many possibilities as possible. It certainly covers a HUGE amount of the issues you might have - most others are caused by not following the guides to the letter.

A year has passed, though, and technologies change so it needs updating because, yet again, there are things that are not answered there.

I will be interested to read this guide when it's done, though

klinky · Post by **klinky** » Tue Jul 29, 2003 11:31 am

Yeah I think it's a problem partly with the readers themselves. But also partly because in order to make the guide as brief as possible(well with out it becoming a book) somethings are going to get cut out.

I myself was writting a guide and I was starting to go into stuff about Video for Windows, the VCM and what they do. Also explaining how the OS works with video. This would let people understand how AVISynth works and how many programs like VirtualDub & Premiere make AVIs.

Too many times it's been asked "How do I compress my video" and then someone says "Compress with XviD". The newbie replies "Where's that?". Someone finds them a link. Then they reply "I installed it and nothing happened.". Then you say "Use VirtualDub to compress it?". Then they say "Where's that?". Then you point them to VirtualDub. Then they come back and say "It's too confusing, can someone walk me through it".

They don't have a solid foundation in exactly waht VirtualDub does, what XviD does. The problem is alot of people don't want to learn. They just want to edit their video and export it. They want the fun, but don't want to do the harder stuff.

I will say that the current guides are a bit too hard for someone who has never edited video. Some people who don't even know how to compress a bitmap to a jpeg are trying to edit AMVs. People who don't know what a Kilobyte is, or anything about bitdepth or resolution. The difference between a file being "huge" in file-size vs being huge in resolution. That's a common misconception.

But it's hard to figure out just how far you dumb it down. The further you "dumb it down". The more you have to explain, the more you have to explain, the more there is to read & if the person won't read the basic help in VirtualDub or the manual in Premiere, I don't think they'll have the attention span to read the whole guides.

This is just proven by the fact that people don't want to read th current guide in it's entirety. They want a quick answer and a quick solution and often they get it by pestering people. :\

Yargh, I don't know how to make it more readable ": O

AbsoluteDestiny · Post by **AbsoluteDestiny** » Tue Jul 29, 2003 11:33 am

TokyoU15 wrote:AD, the only "problem" I see with the guide is that it is rather messy. I mean, sometimes you're at the end of the guide, on the how to compress your video, then all of a sudden you bring up a point that should be noted and send the person back to the middle, beginning of the guide. It confused me a couple of times and made me even lazier. Eventually I sat down and read through it, but not everyone would do that. That's really the only "problem" I see in the guide.

Yeah, I know - that's what I've been doing most - reorganising.

I've also made check-list pages so right at the start you look at these and you can see all the stages you should go through and you can refer back to it at each stage.

OmniStrata · Post by **OmniStrata** » Tue Jul 29, 2003 11:37 am

TokyoU15 wrote:
Premiere Pro is going to be interesting too
ohh yeah! Looks great so far. I love the multi-timeline idea, and of course, the real time editing.

As for the guide, like everyone has said, it is pointless to regurgitate something that has been said and done and very detailed in all aspects.

AD, the only "problem" I see with the guide is that it is rather messy. I mean, sometimes you're at the end of the guide, on the how to compress your video, then all of a sudden you bring up a point that should be noted and send the person back to the middle, beginning of the guide. It confused me a couple of times and made me even lazier. Eventually I sat down and read through it, but not everyone would do that. That's really the only "problem" I see in the guide.

Problem? That's an awesome solution AbsoluteDestiny. I'm actually glad I had to go back to check back on things like IVTC and such despite that. That's not a problem, that's a solution. A filter that separates the dumb n00b from the smart n00b...

If you're lazy, you shouldn't be getting into amvs to begin with. The "soul" of the amv truely is being corrupted. I don't see amvs as merely [something for fun]. It can be something for fun AND be a beautiful art form that takes time to master.

It's like a good video game or any other hobby, it can be easy to learn, but impossible to master for some people...

That n00b filter that A&E placed in their guides is great. One of the reasons their guides are and always will be the best guides... If you're not old enough to understand what's being said, (I'm not a video tech person by any means, but still) you shouldn't start on amvs...

my $0.02 ^_^

TokyoU15 · Post by **TokyoU15** » Tue Jul 29, 2003 11:45 am

God damnit Omni, you posted while I was writing up my post >_<.

Anyway, I am thinking of doing the exact same thing myself...an effects guide...but to be more specific...effects that we've seen and we go "How'd he do that?!?!". Custom effects only though. Not simple fades that are covered in the manual. For example, right now I'm working on a bumper that consists of a filmstrip moving while having clips of my videos play in each frame sequence on the filmstrip. I'm sure some people would be curious as to how I did it. That's the kind of stuff we can add to the guide.

Also, a lot of AD's effects on Shameless would be a good example. I know he's said how he did them in the past, but it would be nice to have 'em on teh guide.

Basicly, I want to do an effects guide that doesn't show you on the manual.

TokyoU15 · Post by **TokyoU15** » Tue Jul 29, 2003 11:50 am

Problem? That's an awesome solution AbsoluteDestiny. I'm actually glad I had to go back to check back on things like IVTC and such despite that. That's not a problem, that's a solution. A filter that separates the dumb n00b from the smart n00b...

If you're lazy, you shouldn't be getting into amvs to begin with. The "soul" of the amv truely is being corrupted. I don't see amvs as merely [something for fun]. It can be something for fun AND be a beautiful art form that takes time to master.

It's like a good video game or any other hobby, it can be easy to learn, but impossible to master for some people...

That n00b filter that A&E placed in their guides is great. One of the reasons their guides are and always will be the best guides... If you're not old enough to understand what's being said, (I'm not a video tech person by any means, but still) you shouldn't start on amvs...

my $0.02 ^_^

woa dude, calm yourself now. Don't start calling me a dumb n00b. I've been doing this since 2001 fucker! lol, anyway. did you not notice the quotaion marks? They aren't a problem to ME, but it might to be to SOME. I'm a lazy bastard, that's a given, that doens't mean I don't have the dedication to learn. Like I said, I did what i had to do. I sat down and read everything, I'm not complaining. I think the guide is great.

Not everyone feels like we do Omni. That's the biggest complain I've heard from people who don't understand the guide. So recap...it's not a problem for me, but might be for others.

AbsoluteDestiny · Post by **AbsoluteDestiny** » Tue Jul 29, 2003 11:51 am

maybe we could do with a guide wiki

trythil · Post by **trythil** » Tue Jul 29, 2003 11:55 am

Why bother with an effects guide?

All that'll lead to is more and more people using (abusing) the same old effects. Not to mention that it'll be unnecessarily program-dependent (you can replicate any effect in any program, but such a guide will just further the myth that you need 4d0b3 Pr3m1r3 to do that OMGWTF effect you just saw in some video), it won't list the other 4,000 ways to accomplish an effect, it most likely won't include a discussion of how to effectively use the effect...

The way to learn effects isn't to read some guide. It's to figure out the program you're using, and then figure out just what you want that effect to mean in the context you're using it.

Nemoxs · Post by **Nemoxs** » Tue Jul 29, 2003 11:55 am

I'm planning on putting a FULL error mode in the adobe plan.

and the what is Action/Drama/Fun is already implamented into the guide, as for EX the other guides people seem to have a bit of trouble with so YES i am writing a "noob" guide so that people who just joined understand some of the terms... it'll be like videos for dummies.. with out the dummies.

Well you guys will have to wait to read it, I hope I do a good job for you guys.