VERY SLOW ZOOMS & PANS discussion MEGATHREAD

[seasons]

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=131060#p1570131

My mind basically exploded when you pointed out the subtle zoom effect to give the illusion of movement on still frames. It's such a simple and effective trick that it's almost embarrassing to admit I didn't know about it. And yet, after reading a fair number of guides on this, it's the first time I've heard of it. I didn't even notice it when watching the video, and had to have it pointed out to me.

1. When did AMV editors start doing this? This effect was easily within every editor's reach since the dawn of non-linear digital editing software, and God knows that comparatively AMVs made with comparatively static anime from the 80s, 90s and 00s really could have benefited from this very subtle effect. That said, I feel like it wasn't widely used until the 2010s. I'm sure it had been done before, and maybe this is just recency bias naturally leading me to more readily remember videos that aren't as old as other videos, but at some point in the early/mid-2010s, it felt like every other AMV was utilizing this approach as often as possible, which leads to my next question...

2. Can it be overused? Or is every otherwise well-editing AMV that suffers from static scenes still worse than every otherwise well-edited AMV that could be said to ride this effect a little too hard?

3. When applying a slow and subtle zoom to a clip, does it matter if the "camera" is zooming in or zooming out? Most editors seem to prefer one or the other, although I'm not sure that most editors have really given much thought as to why they choose whichever approach they prefer. Is there a meaningful psychological difference in either approach? It's easy to say something like "yeah seasons, zooming in slowly brings you in to the scene and zooming out slowly gives you the bigger picture!" but that's just semantics now. What does either approach actually do to your brain as you're watching it? Surely they can't be completely interchangeable.

4. Is alternating between zooming in and zooming out in the same AMV a good idea? Does this break up monotony or does it make a video feel confusing or disorienting? I've freely mixed up zooming in and zooming out in successive clips and, in hindsight, I'm not sure this was a good idea.

[Zarxrax]

1. Editors have been doing this since digital editing was available. It wasn't necessarily widely practiced though. I know "Caffeine Encomium" did it in 2000, AluminumStudio's "venus in a bottle" did it in 1999, and I'm sure there were several other videos using the technique in the years prior.

It may be because the software people are using eventually made it easier, as a lot of consumer editing software started getting functions to make image slideshows, so this exposed the technique to more people?

2. I think anything can be overused. Sometimes you might want the video to just calm down, and a still image might be appropriate.

3. I've never given it much thought, but I guess it zooming in could be associated with bringing the viewer closer to the place or action being shown. So for instance if a video starts out showing the outside of a building, and then the next clip is from inside the building... I think the zoom in on the outside shot would be more appropriate because it is taking you inside. Likewise, a zoom out could be associated with leaving or creating distance.

4. Dunno, I've always just played things by ear rather than following any sort of theory. I'd say if you like how it looks, its a good idea.

[Ileia]

I'm of the opinion that the AMV community doesn't always use this term correctly because, in most cases, we're not working with a photograph/still image, but just a scene that doesn't have camera movement (or in the direction we want). A couple of AMV subgenres that I do think utilize the Ken Burns Effect are MMVs or the 2006-ish era of Youtube fanart slideshows. I agree with the basic idea that you can create a better flow by zooming/panning as a connective element or you can use it to direct focus on a specific object in the video, but the terminology is still just a zoom or a pan.

[Zarxrax]

I agree with the basic idea that you can create a better flow by zooming/panning as a connective element or you can use it to direct focus on a specific object in the video, but the terminology is still just a zoom or a pan.

I agree that I have never really liked seeing this called "ken burns effect", because pan and zoom so clearly describes what you are actually doing. Calling something a "ken burns effect" requires people to actually look up what that means if they aren't already familiar. Back when I first started hearing the term, for some reason I actually thought it was referring to an artistic effect where the colors were reduced in a certain way Plus there are major differences in how Ken Burns used the effect and how the average AMV editor uses it.

Pans and zooms were also HEAVILY used in Japanese MADs that were made from the still images of visual novels. Those were in existence at least as early as 1999.

[Katranat]

I don't really have much to add to this discussion, other than I want to mention the following video by ssgwnbtd where he uses nothing but this editing style to great effect.

[vivafruit]

Thanks for the ping! This is great. I'll be sure to use it in my next AMVs.

[BasharOfTheAges]

I honestly assumed they were teaching this in marketing / video production courses since the 80s. It's been a staple of low budget advertising for decades, because motion has the added effect of making video seem more engaging with the lowest amount of effort (and therefore cost) to the production team.

[renacava]

from a compositional point of view it could be argued that in a slow push in with the camera since all the objects on screen are becoming larger, 1) the "energy" of the scene is increasing, 2) the deadspace is decreasing too, leading to the characters having less space to move in, less "freedom", becoming trapped, and 3) smaller details are being revealed. it can change the entire meaning of a scene, really, for example: a shot of the countryside slowls zooms until you can see a man sleeping, zooms until you realise he's a soldier, then zooms until you realise he's dead. here an entire story can be told from just a zoom in of one scene. though anime doesn't really have such high res scenes for this exact method, the general idea is the same. and hey, with some masking we could easily recreate this.
overall though i try to imagine it as the viewer leaning forward in their seat.

if you're doing a slow push out, then they're all becoming smaller, energy is decreasing and any "danger" is going further away, it's safer. unless the surroundings are unknown but known to be dangerous, in which case the character is now vulnerable from more sides. the dead space around the characters/subjects are growing, so it'll feel a lot more lonely/free/ominous/serene, depending on the tone of the shot. again this can be used to tell a story, a simple example to mimic the above would be to see a name, zoom out to see it's a soldier's dogtag, zoom out to see the soldier is dead.
again though, pretty much any technique can have a different meaning depending on the shots' tones surrounding it.
it's best to think of any of these techniques as words in a sentence, their meanings change depending on what surrounds them, their context.