AWA 2010 - Pro downloads active; Expo 4 days left, August 20

[Radical_Yue]

In the end, I just posted because assholes is assholes and I had to other way to pass the time while people were in my living room watching horrible shows.



Fuck Pro, I'm going to watch Doctor Who.

Ya'll can suck it. And by "it" I mean a giant cock. Made of rocks. Hot ones.

Teh Yue is done with this thread =w=

[Pwolf]

I just thought of the perfect example that sums up my idea of what AWA Pro is/was. This will be my last post on the subject, hopefully it makes sense:

So the argument has been made that by entering the contest and signing the waver you are saying "I'm a Judge now, I will be unbiased and watch all the videos..." right? What about audience based judging? By going to the amv contest, you are being volunteered to be a judge. Shouldn't they be held by the same standards we are imposing on AWA Pro participants? We cannot assume they will be unbiased or they will stay throughout the whole contest. We also don't get on the microphone demanding they do then say they are doing the contest a great disservice if they don't judge the way we want them to. To me AWA Pro was about removing the staff and the "less experienced" from the judging pool and only allowing those who entered be the judges. Some contest use the audience, some have a panel, AWA Pro uses it's participants. It consists of AMV Editors who may (or may not...) have a better idea about whats makes up a good video but all the bias and unwillingness to watch a video is still there.

[Vlad G Pohnert]

Actually, I starting to really not like Pro... It' s just not fun anymore bacuse of this thread

Vlad

[Pwolf]

Actually, I starting to really not like Pro... It' s just not fun anymore bacuse of this thread

Vlad

sorry

[NS]

My last 2 cents on it is actually that People don't have to watch every one, but if they don't watch certain ones, they don't vote in that category... yah it would be nice to have everybody watch every single video, but it will never happen unless it's like heavily supervised or something, so might as well just roll with it.

edit: In other words: I agree with some of the people in this thread.

[BasharOfTheAges]

So you're basing your entire argument on someone else opinion?

Nope. My opinion on the integrity of judging is my own. Apparently integrity isn't that common of an attribute.

My last 2 cents on it is actually that People don't have to watch every one, but if they don't watch certain ones, they don't vote in that category...

That'd be a good compromise. And since every video could conceivably be in any category...

[Nya-chan Production]

I just thought of the perfect example that sums up my idea of what AWA Pro is/was. This will be my last post on the subject, hopefully it makes sense:

So the argument has been made that by entering the contest and signing the waver you are saying "I'm a Judge now, I will be unbiased and watch all the videos..." right? What about audience based judging? By going to the amv contest, you are being volunteered to be a judge. Shouldn't they be held by the same standards we are imposing on AWA Pro participants? We cannot assume they will be unbiased or they will stay throughout the whole contest. We also don't get on the microphone demanding they do then say they are doing the contest a great disservice if they don't judge the way we want them to. To me AWA Pro was about removing the staff and the "less experienced" from the judging pool and only allowing those who entered be the judges. Some contest use the audience, some have a panel, AWA Pro uses it's participants. It consists of AMV Editors who may (or may not...) have a better idea about whats makes up a good video but all the bias and unwillingness to watch a video is still there.

1) You usually have more than 60 watchers, so some may afford to not vote
2) They usually stay the whole time, and even when not, you can't afford to lock them up (fire hazard rules etc)
3) They don't sign anything in the first place, we do

That said, I am not against any side, in the end it's just like Moonie said - I'll just vote somehow, right? :<

[ngsilver]

You know, discussion is how change comes about. Perhaps at this juncture change is what may be needed. Perhaps it has come to the point where the majority may feel that there should be a separate contest for adult videos. If that is the case, and in the future that is what happens I will be fine with that. I'd much rather have a format where entrants could feel that their videos are being judged fairly, because at this point I don't feel that is the case.

I said it on my podcast, I do understand some people don't like all content. Heck, my fiancee loaths all forms of pr0n and I would never force her to come out of her comfort zone, which is why I don't show her my adult videos. But I also would discourage her at this juncture to enter Pro because of the kinds of content that is allowed in the contest.

All I can do is advocate, I can't force anyone to do what I'm asking, and neither can the coordinators. However I feel very similarly about the judging situation as Bashar does. It kind of pains me to see that others don't hold the same amount of integrity about their judging stance as I do. I know I have bias and there is no way for me to truly not have any, but I do my best to be as fair as I can be to every video. As a judge I feel it is my duty to watch and judge all videos in the contest. It's the same standard I hold for the judges on the panels for contests that I run. As for attendee voting, I throw away any ballot that isn't fully filled out.

If this discussion has turned people off of this contest then I'm sorry to see you go. But perhaps that is for the best, for you and for this contest. Who knows. But this discussion is something that needed to be aired. If it didn't then no one would have continued it this long.

But I'm all for compromise, and it seems right now the consensus is get on with judging the contest however you choose to judge. So that's what I'll do. I'll post my comments on each video once I get the chance to sit down and give them all a good viewing.

[BurningLeaves]

If my video doesn't immediately grab the attention of someone and they decide to skip the rest of it, that's my fault and that's a risk I've accepted.

While I think it is ideal to watch each video in it's entirety while judging my qualm is more for those who simply noticed the 'L' and 'H' prefixes and skipped them all together. If you start watching and something appears that is too shocking or uncomfortable for you at least you tried and gave the video a shot before voting against it, the way it seems though is people just saw a certain subject matter and dismissed it completely without even bothering to play them. If you were an IC judge and only watched video A before declaring it the winner when there was nothing technically wrong with video B as it had followed all the rules the judges had agreed upon before deciding to judge in the first place it would be completely wrong to be biased.

I'm not trying to say people don't do it, or people shouldn't think that some may pass on it. It's not awa's fault nor that of any other convention that uses audience voting, but I disagree with the mentality that it is acceptable to do when acting as a judge. Does it happen? Yes. Should it happen? No. Yet people keep using the fact that it does happen to justify that it is acceptable.

If awa would like to change it's rules to exclude adult content than that is it's choice but as it is now it does accept such content and if you are unwilling to attempt to judge the contest to the best of your ability in it's entirety you should skip judging all together. This being a contest where all the entries are lumped in together you can't pick the best from the group when you have not seen the whole group. Just because it does happen doesn't mean it should, or that people should be trying to justify biased judging just because it happens.

Actually, I starting to really not like Pro... It' s just not fun anymore bacuse of this thread

I plan on this being my last post on the subject myself but I actually couldn't disagree with you more. I thought the past few pages were a decent, well mannered debate about the subject for the most part. I actually find it really nice to see that not just on the internet, but even on the org people are still able to talk with intelligence and tact while debating opposite sites of an argument instead of it boiling down to. "No your mother can go screw herself!". And possibly since Kholoras posted earlier about sharing this thread with the other awa coordinators something can be imposed, be it separating the adult content to it's own contest or someones above suggestion of a signed specifically stated requirement for the judges to watch all the entries that will help to clear this problem up in the future and make mostly every body happy.

[SailorDeath]

"Ahaha, well too bad Jimmy! Even though this is a competition about a fun hobby, we're going to say FUCK YOU AND YOUR FREEDOM OF CHOICE AND FREE WILL. YOU'RE GOING TO EAT IT AND THEN MY GOAT IS GOING TO FUCK YOU!"

Seems a tiny bit contradictory pullting human rights card, it can be argued that hentai amv creators can claim freedom of expression.