Random thoughts on the passing scene

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Vivaldi
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Random thoughts on the passing scene

Post by Vivaldi » Wed Jul 29, 2009 10:06 pm

How could one possibly be motivated to initiate the creation of a collab? It seems to me that should one like a song enough to edit to, they would also know exactly how they want it to be edited, and thus not want to put their vision in the hands of someone else? I can see using a song you don't care about simply as an act of comradeship. But I can't wrap my mind around people who would offer up one of their favorite songs for desecration as a sacrifice to relieve boredom. I've yet to find a single song I like enough to edit to, but not enough allow another editor's vision to occupy the same video as mine. And not for lack of trying, I assure you.
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Nostalgia can create an interesting conundrum. One presumibly likes to edit to music they enjoy. Nostalgic music often has a huge emotional impact in both a heavily sentimental sense, but also a circumstantial one. It's an obvious choice to edit to, but the circumstancial nostalgia makes it seem so very wrong to associate it with anything other than the events surrounding it's discovery. At the same time associating it with what's already happened is unthinkable, as in your minds eye, the way events transpired the first time are irreplaceable. Something you should never hope nor dare to replicate. Still yet, you almost feel obligated to create something with this one important part of your life that affects you so much.
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When you think about it, Sync in the literal sense is a very arbitrary way to judge how good a video is, don't you think? I only consider it the normal way of things because that's how I've always know it, but what makes it right or natural per-se? It's a method to create a certain reaction the viewer to be sure, but one would think it'd be a technique used much more sparingly than it is. In a video with vague sync, would attention been be drawn to any places where the audio video sync is 1:1? Heavy sync isn't the natural state of a video, or the "most basic ability to be able to use" in a video. It's a vastly over-exposed technique that's vastly underestimated as well. Nobody delves into the possibilities of simple audio\visual sync because we assume it's at it's limit, and we've moved on to newer and greater things for "advanced" editors to use. People don't realize "editing" isn't synonymouswith "Sync"


I'm pretty sure that between the three of those snippets there's at least some possibility for argument discussion. The front page just seemed kinda boring to me. :/
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Re: Random thoughts on the passing scene

Post by Kionon » Thu Jul 30, 2009 12:29 am

I'll be honest, I have my disagreements with some of what you said, but I just don't have the motivation to write a response.
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Re: Random thoughts on the passing scene

Post by Qyot27 » Thu Jul 30, 2009 12:51 am

I would counter that sync is part of the natural state of video, but the problem is that we tend to zero in on just a few types of it rather than the broader spectrum.

Even in the case of a finished product, say a mundane scene in a coffee shop, the audience has to make a connection between the actors, their dialogue (if any), and background music that all exists in the scene. That can be argued to be sync, even if it is completely different from action or mood or internal sync as we conceive it in a music video. It's sync because your brain is understanding the information being placed in front of it, and the scene is harmonious within itself. If it didn't have sync, we would more than likely reject the experience - although it might be useful as a technique in a greater scene montage (an example of this to a really minor degree is the way the brain reacts to seeing dialogue not fit with the actors' mouth movements - such as in dubbed films or older media with overdub or audio delay issues, sometimes it can be really hard to watch). In fact, I've been thinking about that sort of setup in terms of the kind of film editing I hope to get into. Not an entire movie of that sort, but just a short sequence - it would mean nothing to people if it wasn't juxtaposed against something 'normal'.
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Vivaldi
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Re: Random thoughts on the passing scene

Post by Vivaldi » Thu Jul 30, 2009 11:14 am

The main problem seems to be that sync has become such a subjective term. The example you mentioned is interesting. I guess that would be called mood sync, or associative sync, or even just continuity editing.

What I'm more focused on is that the community right now treats pure rhythmic sync as the baseline of determining a video's value. Too much of a focus on rhythmic sync changes a video from being more than the sum of it's parts, to simply being a literal visual representaion of the music, something that can already be done procedurally.

I can see what you're getting at by saying a degree of continuity should be considered the "natural state" of a video. I'd assume that videos, like music, create their reactions in the viewer via tension and release. A perfectly harmonious scene, such as you described, would create a sense of relaxation or complacency in the viewer, which could be argued to be the natural state. In the Rhythmic sense, perfect sync would also create complacency, a video that relies to much on this loses the possibility of tension, and thus the possibility of emotional impact beyond the sum of it's parts.

If audio\visual continuity is the most basic relaxed state for a video to exist in, I think the org as a community should encourage that as the most basic skill for a beginner to master, rather than something as easily abused or as sporadically useful as rhythmic sync.

Kionon wrote:I'll be honest, I have my disagreements with some of what you said, but I just don't have the motivation to write a response.
Fair 'nuff, the title of this thread was quite accurate, so I can't really say any of my theories\musings hold water.
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Re: Random thoughts on the passing scene

Post by godix » Thu Jul 30, 2009 6:46 pm

A) Not all meps are all one song. Granted, most MEPs are centered on the music but not all of them are. Some meps focus on a theme, genre, or something other than the music. A well known example would be AMV Hell, that's centered around being funny rather than using specific songs.

B) Just because a video has nostalgic meaning to you doesn't mean it would be meaningless to someone else. Using the song that was playing on your first kiss might make you tear up or something, but assuming you're an at least decent editor then others would see a decent romance vid. Nostalgia adds to the meaning, it isn't the *ENTIRE* meaning. Plus there's community nostalgia you can tap into for that would apply to most viewers, Retrospect is an example of that.

C) Videos need sync to work, otherwise it's just random visual that has nothing to do with the song. However there is more than one type of sync and a lot of sync can be very subtle. AMVs do tend to go for the in your face beat sync though.

The common theme of your comments is that not all videos are as you describe. You hit on some popular trends but there's plenty out there that doesn't follow the trend. Look around more.
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Re: Random thoughts on the passing scene

Post by Vivaldi » Thu Jul 30, 2009 7:44 pm

godix wrote: The common theme of your comments is that not all videos are as you describe. You hit on some popular trends but there's plenty out there that doesn't follow the trend. Look around more.
:? I kinda figured the implication would be that I'm talking about specific situations. I know you can't generalize a whole community.

a) I'm talking quite specifically about the mindset of people who initiate collabs with the intention of essentially splitting the editing of a normal amv in two.

b) Anything has the potential to be made great, I'm talking more about the personal crisis involved and the effect on your relationship with the source material. (With things that are probably only emotionally important to you.)

c) I'm talking only about Beat sync, the kind people always tell new editors they need "more of". I'm not even arguing for the exclusion of it, just more intelligent and less abusive use of it.

If all my bases aren't covered, you can probably assume they're at least in the back of my mind somewhere.
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Re: Random thoughts on the passing scene

Post by Megamom » Fri Jul 31, 2009 11:12 am

Well...

Godix says... There are more than one type of synch, I edit when I am carried away by the music, by the feelings that make me tell the sounds, is something very profound that I can not explain. There are people who do not understand my AMVs (The language is a big problem) they do not understand my ideas, because they can not feel like I am, and can not feel what other people feel that if you like my AMVs.

Well... is my little opinion, in this thread! :lol:
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Re: Random thoughts on the passing scene

Post by Bauzi » Tue Aug 04, 2009 5:52 pm

I think "desyncing" a scene or a motion can be harder than syncing itself :| Lately I try to desync, because I just don't want this kind of sync, because it looks perfedic or doesn't fit to the editing of the video. It's interessting how you can distract the viewer's concentration on the actual sync. Just that he can focus on different things in the video.
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