AnimeUSA: Winners determined by judges or the audience?

[Brad]

I realize that doing my idea does set a certain "weight of importance" on the judges, but don't we do that already when we're talking about judge-exclusive contests? I mean basically, it's always been one or the other for individual awards (I realize there are contests that have judge awards and audience awards and I'm all for that). So for the awards where it's just pre-selected judges, we're already giving them that voting weight. I'm just saying, why not try to combine the two different aspects to see what kind of results you get. You'd be melding the opinions of more experienced judges with the general audience vote to come up with a (hopefully) more well-rounded pick. I just think it'd be interesting to try.

[Vlad G Pohnert]

I realize that doing my idea does set a certain "weight of importance" on the judges, but don't we do that already when we're talking about judge-exclusive contests? I mean basically, it's always been one or the other for individual awards (I realize there are contests that have judge awards and audience awards and I'm all for that). So for the awards where it's just pre-selected judges, we're already giving them that voting weight. I'm just saying, why not try to combine the two different aspects to see what kind of results you get. You'd be melding the opinions of more experienced judges with the general audience vote to come up with a (hopefully) more well-rounded pick. I just think it'd be interesting to try.

Sure.. Make Vic perform the experiment.. If it does not work I'll know not to use it for the contests I run

[dwchang]

I realize that doing my idea does set a certain "weight of importance" on the judges, but don't we do that already when we're talking about judge-exclusive contests? I mean basically, it's always been one or the other for individual awards (I realize there are contests that have judge awards and audience awards and I'm all for that). So for the awards where it's just pre-selected judges, we're already giving them that voting weight. I'm just saying, why not try to combine the two different aspects to see what kind of results you get. You'd be melding the opinions of more experienced judges with the general audience vote to come up with a (hopefully) more well-rounded pick. I just think it'd be interesting to try.

Well this is me just theory-crafting, but I've rarely seen a video win by a margin larger than a few hundred votes so theoretically after just that a few judges voting will be enough to pick the 'real winner.' In essence, the audience's vote still didn't matter.

Take this for an example:
500 total votes (I'd say that's a reasonable mid-level contest)
5 judge votes worth 500 votes.

Video A: 120
Video B: 80
Video C 200
Video D: 20
Video E: 80

Theoretically if just two or three judges voted for Video D or another video that's pretty far down in audience tally to win.

I guess what I'm saying is although you're 'averaging it out,' you're still giving heavier precedence to judges and from a mathematical standpoint, you still effectively make the audience vote meaningless. In fact, in some cases, we shouldn't even have to count them since the Judges can overrule any total by the audience. Frankly I've seen that happen at places (including ACen) and it's a bit disconcerting.

Again I realize I'm just theory-crafting, but to me it shows an inherent problem of fairness in the system. Then again, a lot of the times I disagree with the audience, but to a larger degree the convention itself is for fans and the contest is to show them things (even if we submit) so I just don't like the idea of devaluing their opinion.

Like I said, I like Vlad's solution of letting both sides have something (i.e. ownership). People like ownership and feeling like they made a difference.

[Koopiskeva]

How about, having the editors go up on stage for a deathmatch. |: ?

[Miracle_Falcon]

I dunno, I liked the judge voting last year. Though I guess I'd be interested to see if the judge votes were actually pretty much equivalent to or totally different from the audience votes... I'd like to suggest an audience winner and a judge winner in each category, but I think that'd lead to too many repeats. So that's not really a good idea...

Meh, don't mind me, I'm just rambling. For the record, my vote is that I like it as is, but that's just me.

[Warheart]

Actually I would just use both. Judge for the actual important prices and then special audience prices. Niotex used that method on the Acon 06 worked pretty well in my opinion.

And in case you have to chose, always the judge's one due to the fact they at least know what's important. It's sad to see how stupid the results of the audience desicion happen to be.

[Brad]

I realize that doing my idea does set a certain "weight of importance" on the judges, but don't we do that already when we're talking about judge-exclusive contests? I mean basically, it's always been one or the other for individual awards (I realize there are contests that have judge awards and audience awards and I'm all for that). So for the awards where it's just pre-selected judges, we're already giving them that voting weight. I'm just saying, why not try to combine the two different aspects to see what kind of results you get. You'd be melding the opinions of more experienced judges with the general audience vote to come up with a (hopefully) more well-rounded pick. I just think it'd be interesting to try.

Well this is me just theory-crafting, but I've rarely seen a video win by a margin larger than a few hundred votes so theoretically after just that a few judges voting will be enough to pick the 'real winner.' In essence, the audience's vote still didn't matter.

Take this for an example:
500 total votes (I'd say that's a reasonable mid-level contest)
5 judge votes worth 500 votes.

Video A: 120
Video B: 80
Video C 200
Video D: 20
Video E: 80

Theoretically if just two or three judges voted for Video D or another video that's pretty far down in audience tally to win.

I guess what I'm saying is although you're 'averaging it out,' you're still giving heavier precedence to judges and from a mathematical standpoint, you still effectively make the audience vote meaningless. In fact, in some cases, we shouldn't even have to count them since the Judges can overrule any total by the audience. Frankly I've seen that happen at places (including ACen) and it's a bit disconcerting.

Again I realize I'm just theory-crafting, but to me it shows an inherent problem of fairness in the system. Then again, a lot of the times I disagree with the audience, but to a larger degree the convention itself is for fans and the contest is to show them things (even if we submit) so I just don't like the idea of devaluing their opinion.

Like I said, I like Vlad's solution of letting both sides have something (i.e. ownership). People like ownership and feeling like they made a difference.

Well I'm obviously not interested in making the audience vote "not count" otherwise what would be the point in the first place? o_O I don't know what the best weighting system would be, but I think some kind of mix of the two to pick the same award should be attempted. The kind of scenario I'd be looking for is when the audience REALLY rallies behind one video in a category where the judges are split on and are unenthusiastic about any one video. In that scenario, the audience would be the deciding factor. And in other scenarios obviously the judges helped make the main decision. It'd just be a way to mix it up.

[Bauzi]

I like a twin system like Anime Boston uses. Audience vote determines the category winners and the Best in Show, a judging panel chooses Best Editing, Best Concept, and Judge's Choice awards.

Both major viewpoints are covered that way.

Yeah. For me as editor Viewer Choice Awards are most of the time just annoying especially when all the categories are mixed together (I mean: videos that held the places 1-3 win). In general you just don´t stand a chance against Fun vids when it comes to "Audience: Best Of Show".
It´s not really the fault of the audience. The audience sees tons of vids and what do they remeber out of so many vids? Right! The vids that have an impact on them. I don´t want to say that you can´t have an impact for them with other genres, but I´m the opinion that it´s much more easier with a funny vid. Often you need concetration, practice and a second look to see the true value of an amv.

It´s alright to have audience judged contest/categories, but please please let some judges choice events in it. Just for the sake to not annoye editors. Every point of view should be pleased.

[Adv1sor]

Is this a show, for the fans, or is this a showcase for the editors?

If it's a show, for the fans, then let the fans decide the winners.


I say, let the fans decide the winners of each category and you, as the contest coordinator, award one AMV with the "coordinator's choice award." Or the Vic Bond AUSA trophy

[VicBond007]

I say, let the fans decide the winners of each category and you, as the contest coordinator, award one AMV with the "coordinator's choice award." Or the Vic Bond AUSA trophy

I believe that this has been tried already...
http://www.hookiedookiepanic.com/comic.php?ID=29