#amv-review log - Because Kio can't figure out cut 'n paste

[Prodigi]

Sidenote: "How did THIS video beat MY video?" is just plain bad sportsmanship. I was surprised you said that, Driftroot. I wasn't aware that your ego had puffed up that much already.

x2

After I read that I kinda stopped

X4

Fixed

The only time a comment like this is valid is if RamonesFan wins an award.

But then of course we don't need to worry about that as the situation shall never arise. (Unless it's hosted by some "in the know" guy on MySpace)

[JaddziaDax]

I'll be keeping my comments to myself for now.

[Fall_Child42]

… As for the choice of music and anime, I happen to LIKE it and as I have no client I’m making this for nor any reason to satisfy anyone here, I did it with what I liked and it’s as simple as that

SEE? Vlad has it down. I think I end up arguing this exact thing every friggin review.

That's always been the point of -review. To treat the hobby at least as seriously as a group of friends discussing whatever hollywood movie they just saw.

If this was the case, I would have punch Driftroot in the arm SO FUCKING HARD by now.

And of course I mean that with the largest amount of friendship possible

(it's how we let each other know we've said something REALLY REALLY DUMB.)

[Ileia]

If the review is meant to be the serious alternative to announcement posts, why is there a need for the hosts and regulars to always mock something in a humorous way? I'm not sure how productive the review has really become.

At the beginning, the reviews were worth the read because they were actually reviews. They've become little more than flame-fests at this point, I haven't read anything that wasn't a bad comment in a good long time. Perhaps they're just always picking out videos that they hate, but either way you're right, they have lost their usefulness.

[DriftRoot]

Yeah, I know that comment was going to come back to bite me...there's a lot that is usually said about videos in #review before the #review actually starts which is often very off the cuff, very subjective, very inflammatory and very innappropriate for public consumption. Most of the time that stuff never shows up in the log which is posted here. I don't typically participate in the pre-show griping. That comment of mine was made before I realized that #review had technically started and I was dreading the possibility that it was going to show up here.

It was what it was: an off the cuff, very subjective, very inflammatory, very inappropriate for public consumption comment that I would never, ever have made if I'd realized we were getting down to the serious business of #review. It's just not right - I think everyone here wants to murder me and is horrifically shocked because of how wrong it was, not only to be said in the first place, but that it came from me.

The second I hit "enter" I remembering thinking "Oh CRAP" and then "Well...hopefully people in the room understand that this is me acting out of character and ignore it like I try to ignore all the other commentary that usually goes on before #review starts." Except - apparently - #review had already started. MY MISTAKE.

As far as where that comment came from...it's not ego, it's not hatred of The Audition or ill will towards its creator...it was my honest reaction when I saw The Audition for the first time. Just - ok, I don't really find this overwhelmingly fantastic or hilarious, so...what did the audience see that I didn't? "How did this beat 'Bustin?" is just a really, really BAD way of I think giving voice to that question. This is a stellar example of how it's not what you say, but how you say it, that gets you in trouble. We spent a lot of the #review trying to figure out why the audience loved The Audition so much, which is basically what I was wondering right from the start.

Vlad's AMV is a good one, my op pretty much says it all, and I really like that he made something audiences obviously enjoy. I don't find anything necessarily wrong with crafting an AMV with the deliberate intent of creating a crowd pleaser - my AMV, 'Bustin, was deliberately constructed with a con audience in mind, after all.

So anyways, because this post is long enough - please, I've tried to explain how and why that comment was made. It doesn't justify it, I regret that I made it for a whole ton of reasons. I'm not perfect, I make mistakes, but I'm trying to explain and apologize for this one. Anyone who is shocked and appalled...please, please PLEASE consider why that is so - because something is being taken out of context, because this just doesn't add up with whatever my reputation is apparently is for not doing/saying this kind of thing. Ok? I wouldn't be posting this reply right now if I thought what I said was ok or was being perfectly interpreted.

I'm sorry Vlad, I'm sorry everyone. I will try harder to say things in a more appropriate way, to pay attention to the clock and keep the non-#review-type commentary out of #review. I made a mistake - on several levels - and I really am doing everything I possibly can to apologize and make amends. I don't know what else can be done. Maybe I'm "done" - I don't know. But I'm literally in tears sitting in my office at work because of this incident and now I have to make a dash for the bathroom before someone sees me.

[Fall_Child42]

Oh it's not only that that would have made me punch you in the arm. :\

[ngsilver]

Personally, I feel no real need to explain, defend, or anything my stance on the whole stupidity factor. I've taken classes that have pounded crowd dynamics and the differences between individual mentality and group mentality into my brain. I was fairly bored by it and really don't think it needs to be re-iterated here to prove the point. Goto any convention (or really anywhere) where a group of people are clumped together and you can observe the effects for yourself.

My original comment in the announcement thread still stands, I did enjoy the video. And it does seem that most have overlooked the good things that were said about this video even in the review. Though I must admit, they were few and far between. As is what happens when the majority of those discussing it openly admitted that they didn't like it. Of course this can also be chalked up to putting the video under a microscope, as it what happens in a review.

As for me, I made my comments fully aware that each one can be used against myself. How long did I spend only putting out crowd pleasing videos? Did any of my Dance videos really stand a chance when put under a microscope? However when viewed at a con the crowd would go wild. I knew it, and the fact that the source was easily and freely available cheapened the whole experience even more (and the quality as well.) The same can be said for anytime I am also part of a group. If I had seen this video with a huge crowd of people all enjoying it, perhaps I would have enjoyed it even more. However at home, by myself, I just didn't get it.

IMHO

[Vlad G Pohnert]

DriftRoot: I never did think your comment was truly meant to say what it did nor mean that exactly. We are all human and we all sometimes say something in the wrong way or in the wrong intent (and you don’t seem from your posts as a person who would), so I am hopefully no one else sees this beyond that. Honestly, I hope you don’t get too worried or depressed over it and I hate to thing only depressing and negative things will come out of all this (and I really did love Bustin” in so many ways).

ngsilver: And I fine with that reasoning...


In terms of the discussion as a whole, I think the review discussion is a very interesting and good idea, however as pointed out I think it needs to be understood that it should be taken into account that as such it's a "published" discussion and not something people talk about in the back street away from public ears. That and maybe in a more constructive and diplomatic way. For instance, well written movie reviews are civil about it and point out strengths and weaknesses without the need to resort to "it totally sucked or only bunch of idiots watch it, etc, etc)...

I don't expect everyone to like my stuff, nor am I expecting it to be awesome and liked. In fact, if people feel it does not work or it failed to deliver, then I'm fine with that if that is what they say and why, but this can be presented in a more civil tone without resorting to speculations or labeling groups with bad names, etc

I would also hate to resort to a moderated debate just so people are forced to behave. I for one would like to think that we of the AMV community are all people who can debate or comment on something politely (and from meeting most of you and having discussions, you are – so why not do the same in forums or IRC?).

Again, I do appreciate the comments, I was very aware that this type of video may not be to everyone's liking or expectations. Honestly, I make my videos for me as a hobby and also the chance of having the satisfaction of put a smile on someone else’s face via being clever, well made, funny, etc. that is what I see as important. That is WHY I release them and enter them in contests in the first place.

I do understand music choices and anime are subjective, however I think when doing these reviews one must also take into consideration that AMVs are not a project that need be successful and make money and thus follow some sort of formula (like movies, TV, etc), but creativity that does not bound us to the restrictions of mass appeal or sales... So long as both sides (creator and audience) are aware of that, then there really is not problem.

Vlad

[JudgeHolden]

If the review is meant to be the serious alternative to announcement posts, why is there a need for the hosts and regulars to always mock something in a humorous way? I'm not sure how productive the review has really become.

At the beginning, the reviews were worth the read because they were actually reviews. They've become little more than flame-fests at this point, I haven't read anything that wasn't a bad comment in a good long time. Perhaps they're just always picking out videos that they hate, but either way you're right, they have lost their usefulness.

I would like to take this moment to say "I told you all that this is what they would become." At the time I was scoffed at.

[Kitsuner]

If the review is meant to be the serious alternative to announcement posts, why is there a need for the hosts and regulars to always mock something in a humorous way? I'm not sure how productive the review has really become.

At the beginning, the reviews were worth the read because they were actually reviews. They've become little more than flame-fests at this point, I haven't read anything that wasn't a bad comment in a good long time. Perhaps they're just always picking out videos that they hate, but either way you're right, they have lost their usefulness.

I would like to take this moment to say "I told you all that this is what they would become." At the time I was scoffed at.

"They called me mad! Me! MAD!"