Regarding the rules ...

[Sukunai]

I am curious, if there is a less than obvious reason why there is a total prohibition on using downloaded anime in amvs.

I mean, I have NEVER met an anime fan that doesn't watch downloaded anime. Not one.

And we have all heard the discussions on whether it is good bad or otherwise for fans to fan sub.
And fan subbing is all about downloading anime.

Although I think we can agree, it would be mucho cool if anime went from airing, to on sale on dvd within a week of the last show of the season airing. And properly subbed (as not all of us need or like mangled dubs).

Sooo, is there a less obvious justification?

Is it that dvds render better quality content?

Because if it's about copyright, well a person can always just use downloaded dvds

[Scott Green]

Rules are Rules.
[size=0]and I see sense in them..... [/size]

[The Origonal Head Hunter]

Sooo, is there a less obvious justification?

Is it that dvds render better quality content?

#1) Morals, as well as a feeling of "supporting the industry". If the studios get no money for their work, why should they continue making anime?

#2) Tend to have better visual quality as far as AMV making goes.

[Sukunai]

Rules are indeed rules

"#1) Morals, as well as a feeling of "supporting the industry". If the studios get no money for their work, why should they continue making anime?"

I take it then, that you are a supporter of the notion fan subbing is bad?

The debate on this is of course well known.

I for one likely wouldn't be in the slightest way interested in anime in any fashion whatsoever in the absence of the fan sub scene.

I have only known one person from the tape purchase era when a VERY small few animes were available in english dub versions.

90% or higher of the anime I have seen, was watched as fan subbed first, and then bought second.

I simply don't have any interest in buying anime I have no connection to.

That HAS to have an impact on non Japanese speaking anime purchases.

I dare say, anime would not have ANY power to sell in North America, in the absence of fan subbing.
That fan subbing exists in a very quasi legal state is obvious. No argument there.
It's just that the industry can't expect to exist in a non Japanese language environment without it.

Thus, the only logical justification for the "rules" can only realistically be #2

[wurpess]

What OHH said, that and this is technically an illegal hobby. Anime and music companies could come shut us down right now if they really wanted to for copyright infringement. But, it really comes down to if they had a choice between shutting down an AMV community that supports buying all their stuff as opposed to one who illegally downloads all their stuff, they'll probably go for the one who is all about downloading all their stuff. So while making AMVs from DVDs/CDs that we bought isn't much more legal that making it from DLed material, the companies are more likely to turn a blind eye if they know they're still making money.

[BasharOfTheAges]

It makes the site operators feel they are less culpable if a crackdown occurred, which makes sense. If the anime industry was to get uppity, they'd be selectively choosing who's lives to ruin and how badly those people will be taken down. You might let someone that's not actively supporting ripping you off with a slap on the wrist, but when you have people latently saying "here, fuck the industry and download this lolol" you're going to want to kick them in the throat a few times. Whether or not you personally agree or disagree is irrelevant - they'd deal with whatever public face the site is showing.

[CodeZTM]

x2 on Wurpy's statement.

Plus, I'd like to add that buying the footage is a lot better, as you get better visual quality as well extras that downloaded material doesn' t have.

Plus, I'd also like to add that these sites are BRILLIANT marketing sites. Sites like a-m-v.org, I mean. I know that with the exception of Neon Genesis and Chobits, every anime I have bought was due to either a suggestion from this site or from an AMV. Heck, I bought the video Game Persona III because of melle's and CopyCat's vids just last week. Plus, I've bought countless CD's from the music I've heard here.

This is why I think most companies just ignore us. :O

[Sukunai]

Thanks for the input people

I've always looked at forums, and the one favourite rule, no child porn.

Like anyone actually wants it here. But, it's a legal thing, and every site I have ever been on has that same rule. Because to omit it, is just saying, "hey sue my ass into oblivion".

Sites "like torrent site example A" that provide downloadable anime as just one of an alphabetically sorted option from a selection of everything else under the sun, yeah no one wants to support that nonsense.

And sites that allow downloadable anime that has long since been out as retail dvd, and they don't care, well no one here is likely going to actively sponsor them as being friends of anime either.

But as was mentioned, in some many ways, what we do is basically not legal, it's just not offensive.
I have discovered more anime from amvs than I would want to try counting. And I have even been exposed to a lot of good music thanks to amvs.

So yeah, I support places like the org where we expect at least some level of standards

But the day that the anime industry decides to crush the fan subbers, well I guess that will be the day the mutual support dies. I hope that never happens.

[Autraya]

But the day that the anime industry decides to crush the fan subbers, well I guess that will be the day the mutual support dies. I hope that never happens.

that's already happened actually, and it's why the smart fan-sub sites only sub unlicenced anime :\ and will often stop part way through a series if there is a licence obtained.

Also until late last year, I never downloaded ANY anime. That's why I maintained a large network of friends/contacts that share dvd's (and their informed opinions on the series) with each other or visited china town. Not being part of any "anime societies' usually populated by uni students who cant organise a fuck in a brothel, and I actually have a life so spending 3 hours every friday night being subjected to random episodes of shitty new series is not really of any interest to me.

I do download series to see if I like them now, but I always edit from DVD. I'm also a hoarder and seem to collect things tho >.<

[Sukunai]

Myself, I'm massively spoiled, and I know it.

I have a friend, that is single, wants to be single, works as a high paid tradesman, lives at home with parents (yes insert generic joke here ) and buys anime with almost no apprehension.

I get to see a great deal of anime

I also have truly unlimited broadband, and a kicking newsgroup option (I pay for this, is ain't free).

I watch any damn anime I want, and there really is nothing to prevent me from seeing it.

But if anime was marketed on dvd, subbed only, but subbed well (so it wasn't hard to read off the computer), and sold economically (I don't think ANYthing is worth 40 bucks a disk including anime), as well as sold in more locations than random rare oriental businesses (I don't consider random disks in an HMV as a reliable notion), I'd be a lot more willing to invest in it.

Why SHOULD the fans bend over backwards, just so they could be screwed over backwards?
Supply and demand. Only rule that counts.
If we don't need em, they need to make us want them.

Currently, any interested person can download from the net, and stream content from the computer to the tv. It just requires the person to buy the right cables.
Cables usually cost less than a couple of anime dvds Its not an expensive prospect

So it comes down to, what are they planning to offer us as a reason to buy the dvd? No one does anything without a reason.

Judging from the state of affairs with anime on dvd in North America, it appears round 2 is over. The initial dvd years are over. The process fumbled.
They need to rethink how to market to a market that can settle for fan subbed anime easily obtained with a computer.