just set "Oh Fortuna" in the background and enjoy the slaugtheringNya-chan Production wrote:I vote for godix having this powergodix wrote:Especially if you gave us the power to delete other people's videos.Kaream wrote:Also users should be able to delete videos. It would save alot of space and get rid of useless videos.
Having a catalog is all well and good, but not being able to watch videos isn't going to bring people in either. I'm not suggesting that everyone (nor even a significant amount) will delete all of their videos if they had the option to, but still...a lot of our allure comes from being able to watch and download AMVs.Arigatomina wrote:I just don't get it. These people are clearly just trying to get the local links disabled because they no longer want their creations distributed here. The vid listing remains, so the whole "archive every amv" goal was never affected by the deletion of vids. Space costs money, we donate the money to acquire that space, downloading available vids costs money, we donate the money to pay for that bandwidth, so why do we have to continue paying to host things we don't want you to host for us anymore? At least donators should be allowed to have their own local links removed, by request if you're worried about misuse of the system. I have yet to hear a single reason why the org insists on keeping and sharing other people's vids when they've asked them to remove the local links. If you just wanted to keep a copy for posterity's sake, then disable the local link but keep the file (which, from my understanding, is what you did with the Evanescence/Creed vids).Kariudo wrote:I usually give people the benefit of the doubt, but when someone asks to remaster all of their videos at once...yeah...generally not happening.
In every other hobby I've been active in, when a hosting site refuses to remove a fan's creations at their request, they lose those fans, and get a bad reputation throughout the entire hobby. I don't know why the org continues to get away with it, especially now that it's not the only resort available to amv editors. I know with the last vids I uploaded here, I debated with myself for weeks over whether or not I really wanted those locally hosted here until the death of the org. I'm sure it will be a rude surprise for any tube editors that get drawn here after the redesign. Hobby-related hosting sites just don't do this.
The option to hide vids in our profiles is nice, I appreciate that, but it doesn't change the fact that videos continue to be distributed against the express wishes of the people who made them. The warning on the upload page (which I don't remember seeing in '03) reminds me of the warnings to non-members who upload files to free file hosting sites. They do this to keep making money off the downloaders seeking those files. Why does the org do it? Are you afraid fewer viewers will come here if there aren't as many vids available to download (and preview) in the collection? Because it's the editors who stop uploading due to this policy and without new vids being uploaded, you're going to have fewer amvs, anyway.
Well I have actually seen that the "deleted" video entries were actually there even if they were hidden from outsiders, and thought it could be something along those lines with remastered videos. Though I know the amount of space isn't to be compared, and the effort needed from the mods would be way too big (and/or boring depending on the vid).Nya-chan Production wrote:You can't check until it's uploaded and you can't upload until the original's removed, so the answer is quite obvious ;xPanky wrote:Kariudo wrote:The space thing isn't an issue, and here...there is no such thing as a 'useless' video.
well...maybe except for Godix's junk...that stuff's about as useless as it gets right there.
We may be able to afford more control for creators, but at the same time I feel that we (mods/admins) also need to be able to say no sometimes
Giving users the power to delete their own local uploads would:
-take away most of my video deletion powers you bastid
-make the distinction between remaster and remake near trivial (not like that's all bad though...)
-make abuse of the system even harder to track
-let me say no to 99% of vid info deletion requests
-some other stuff, a llama and some pizza too
My sentiment is based on my background. After you've done any user interface stuff (web or offline), it's hard to not think of users as malicious monsters that want to make you cry.
I'm actually wondering (out of curiosity) when people ask for "remastering" a video, do you (or the other mods) actually check the content is the same or just hope for it to be so?
But they would still have their "right" to do so. You wouldn't protect them from themselves, they could come back after a few weeks and reupload them with no problems.Nya-chan Production wrote:OK, your point is to protect uploaders.
My point is we have to protect uploaders too - against themselves. And also we have to protect the downloaders/the site - can you imagine what would happen if some famous editor got pissed by a little thing and deleted all of his videos (think Nostromo or koopiskeva here)?
I meant protecting from getting rid of their videos forever - they usually delete it everywhere and later on regret it - or at least so I hope.Panky wrote:But they would still have their "right" to do so. You wouldn't protect them from themselves, they could come back after a few weeks and reupload them with no problems.Nya-chan Production wrote:OK, your point is to protect uploaders.
My point is we have to protect uploaders too - against themselves. And also we have to protect the downloaders/the site - can you imagine what would happen if some famous editor got pissed by a little thing and deleted all of his videos (think Nostromo or koopiskeva here)?
Now, see the current process of deleting local links or remastering, if someone gives "X" excuse even if it's true or not, it gets deleted? Then what's the whole point behind requesting it to begin with? It's like people could always use the same excuses, true or not, and get across the reviewing process.
I don't believe the intention is bad, but it lacks execution.
Nah, that's only part of it. The main point is that the org shouldn't be doing this (from a legal and ethical 'honor among thieves' standpoint) and will only hurt itself if the new tube generation of editors come here and encounter it. It's bad business. Reputable non-for-profit fanwork hosting sites don't do this. You'd never get away with this if you were hosting scanlations or fanfics or fanart. The org is the only fanwork hosting site I've ever seen that not only does it, but somehow manages to avoid anyone even complaining about it outside this forum. I'm sure part of the reason the org doesn't have a bad reputation because of this practice is simply that most people don't realize that the "you allow this site to hold and make publicly available the video file you provide" line means it will be publically available forever. They don't understand until they ask for something to be deleted and by then they're either too comfortable here or too desperate to look for an alternative amv site. I don't believe that's going to work with the tube editors. They're used to having control over the distribution of their own videos. They'll know that the tube won't stop them from deleting their own vids. So once the org pulls the 'you uploaded it, that makes it ours' bit on them, they'll be perfectly fine going back to the tube and venting their anger to anyone who will listen. It'll be even worse if they find out *why* the org does this. Because fans have a right to keep downloading the file no matter what the creator says? I don't see that going over very well with anyone in any hobby.Nya-chan Production wrote:OK, your point is to protect uploaders.
I missed this. Sorry. ^^; I like this reason. This is enough to justify keeping the files up unless the creator has a darn good reason to want them removed. I wish this was the only reason you'd given me.Kariudo wrote:As the org is now, I can't turn off local links for everyone but the creator. Heck, it's even hard to delete a local link without a deletion request. There was a fair bit of coding that had to be done just to hide the evanescence, seether and creed videos.
You have some valid points, but I still think you misunderstand me - people come here for downloads these days and when they don't get them they get pissed as well. What about that?Arigatomina wrote:Nah, that's only part of it. The main point is that the org shouldn't be doing this (from a legal and ethical 'honor among thieves' standpoint) and will only hurt itself if the new tube generation of editors come here and encounter it. It's bad business. Reputable non-for-profit fanwork hosting sites don't do this. You'd never get away with this if you were hosting scanlations or fanfics or fanart. The org is the only fanwork hosting site I've ever seen that not only does it, but somehow manages to avoid anyone even complaining about it outside this forum. I'm sure part of the reason the org doesn't have a bad reputation because of this practice is simply that most people don't realize that the "you allow this site to hold and make publicly available the video file you provide" line means it will be publically available forever. They don't understand until they ask for something to be deleted and by then they're either too comfortable here or too desperate to look for an alternative amv site. I don't believe that's going to work with the tube editors. They're used to having control over the distribution of their own videos. They'll know that the tube won't stop them from deleting their own vids. So once the org pulls the 'you uploaded it, that makes it ours' bit on them, they'll be perfectly fine going back to the tube and venting their anger to anyone who will listen. It'll be even worse if they find out *why* the org does this. Because fans have a right to keep downloading the file no matter what the creator says? I don't see that going over very well with anyone in any hobby.Nya-chan Production wrote:OK, your point is to protect uploaders.
To take a less pushy approach, this policy is outdated and unnecessary. Even if Koop deleted all the local links for his vids, people will still be sharing them on the tube. Fans would still be able to watch them. People will still share links to them in lj groups via megaupload/mediafire/etc, so fans will still be able to download them. If someone has to go against the creator's wishes in order to give fans what they "deserve", then let it be random jerks uploading things they didn't make. There's no need for the org to dirty its hands.
I fully support all the arguments in his post. I've even bought some of these points up myself. Not only would the OT forum allow users to blow off steam, have fun with each other and goof off, but it'd also be a place for introductions and lamvs/other videos that aren't amvs.Discount Menu wrote:Sto being awesome.
