The Ultimate Showdown of HagarenViper and TwilightChrono

[Inan]

tard, i was reffering back to other conversations but you know what?

anyway hagarens was good, i really like the editing and the clips used and it reminded me that i have to defeat team galactic in pokemon platinum *goes off to play*

[TwilightChrono]

anyway hagarens was good, i really like the editing and the clips used

So did I.

Anyway congrats Hagaren XD

[Hagaren Viper]

was that ur 7th or 8th straight loss?

That was really uncalled for.

Anyway, thanks to those who voted for me, I'm going to upload a MP4 later if anyone is interested. And TC, like heck you're retiring! You can't just introduce me to ICs then leave, ya jerk XD

[Kazemon15]

I'll check these both out. =3

....I wanna IC someone...looks like fun. XD But I wanna wait til I get my pwetty R2 dvds...

[TwilightChrono]

Anyway, thanks to those who voted for me, I'm going to upload a MP4 later if anyone is interested. And TC, like heck you're retiring! You can't just introduce me to ICs then leave, ya jerk XD

Well, I don't know what to say. I'm just sick of getting all this advice from everyone, then when I finally use it, it's a "You can't do that" or a "It doesn't look right"

What happened to:

"Never switch from a high movement scene to a slow scene unless you can transition it well"?

Just curious because I tried my damndest to slow it down with smooth transitions to match the pace of the song and lyrics. I followed that advice to the "T" and here everyone says: "It looks weird" "You can't do that"

This is why I want to retire, because nothing I ever do, no amount of editing, or taking advice will ever make up for the fact that nothing I edit will apparently ever be good enough. Just seems like hypocrisy plays a big role here on the org. Apparently I'm losing because of the advice given here on the org. It's why I keep getting upset. Maybe I should just damn everyone else and do things my own way.

Anyway, I'll consider staying. But if things keep going the way they are, the I frankly will stop.

Hagaren. You and Phan are the only ones that don't renig on the advice you give me. I appreciate that. Phan always leaves such detailed info on my QC's and it helps a lot. And you are always willing to beta test my vids XD

[Kazemon15]

In all honesty, TC, I think this was your best edited IC vid ever.

I liked the hidden emotion you portrayed in it. I agree some fight scenes were kinda off, but it's also understandable, working off of just one disk and such.

As for Hagaren.... Pokemon? You and your poke obsession... XD

It did feel more like an op. I did like the flow. =3

[TwilightChrono]

In all honesty, TC, I think this was your best edited IC vid ever.

I liked the hidden emotion you portrayed in it. I agree some fight scenes were kinda off, but it's also understandable, working off of just one disk and such.

Thanks. I appreciate that.

Since when did AMV's become a thing for criticism. Most people just watch for pure enjoyment, while others watch so they can point out all the errors with it.

Basically, I'm saying that the org is taking a lot of the fun out of editing for me. Because nowadays you have to edit something just pure epic and awesome just to get any kind of praise on your video. Leaving newbies to editing somewhat in the dark, and it's not fair to them. All I've gotten recently is grief though.

Anyway, enough spamming this thread. Congrats Hagaren. Let's try and do it again sometime.

[Vivaldi]

Anyway, thanks to those who voted for me, I'm going to upload a MP4 later if anyone is interested. And TC, like heck you're retiring! You can't just introduce me to ICs then leave, ya jerk XD

Well, I don't know what to say. I'm just sick of getting all this advice from everyone, then when I finally use it, it's a "You can't do that" or a "It doesn't look right"

What happened to:

"Never switch from a high movement scene to a slow scene unless you can transition it well"?

Just curious because I tried my damndest to slow it down with smooth transitions to match the pace of the song and lyrics. I followed that advice to the "T" and here everyone says: "It looks weird" "You can't do that"

This is why I want to retire, because nothing I ever do, no amount of editing, or taking advice will ever make up for the fact that nothing I edit will apparently ever be good enough. Just seems like hypocrisy plays a big role here on the org. Apparently I'm losing because of the advice given here on the org. It's why I keep getting upset. Maybe I should just damn everyone else and do things my own way.

Anyway, I'll consider staying. But if things keep going the way they are, the I frankly will stop.

Hagaren. You and Phan are the only ones that don't renig on the advice you give me. I appreciate that. Phan always leaves such detailed info on my QC's and it helps a lot. And you are always willing to beta test my vids XD

You know, frankly I was thinking alot about that when I was rewatching some of you cascada beta's and some of your old stuff. You have a very unique style regarding hard cuts and external sync. It's not normal, but I always saw too much meticulous effort put toward it to say it's bad. I think your style really came into it's own with Memories Of Hate-Final Resolution. It had just the right mix of your style and conventional guidelines. At first I didn't like it because it didn't fit at all with my preconceived notions of how that song should be edited. But when I viewed it a week or so later with a more objective mindset, it was much, much better than I had remembered. That's when I realized that you weren't editing wrong, you were just editing your own way. I think from now you should just concentrate on perfecting your own style instead of bending over backwards to copy the "accepted" style of pretty much every other editor on the org.

This IC illustrates that perfectly. Hagaren's (no offense to Hagaren) was pretty, proper, and highly generic. But it did everything "right". Your's had mistakes, but I noticed every single cut you made. The editing felt more "vibrant" if you will. I wouldn't have been able to guess the exact tone of the video just from reading the description.

TL;DR
You've had your own style from day one, and I've seen it when it works. When other people try to correct you, they're trying to conform you to a generic style. Don't let them erase what makes your videos, yours. (I've been guilty of this in the past as well)

Also, damn near everyone else on the org is just as amature as you are. There's no big set of amv making rules everyone's keeping from you, so any advice they give you will 90% of the time be pulled straight from their ass. Take it into consideration, but don't let it guide you.

(PS, I probably would have voted for you had it not been for the aspect ratio, regardless of the scene with envy.)

[TwilightChrono]

You know, frankly I was thinking alot about that when I was rewatching some of you cascada beta's and some of your old stuff. You have a very unique style regarding hard cuts and external sync. It's not normal, but I always saw too much meticulous effort put toward it to say it's bad. I think your style really came into it's own with Memories Of Hate-Final Resolution. It had just the right mix of your style and conventional guidelines. At first I didn't like it because it didn't fit at all with my preconceived notions of how that song should be edited. But when I viewed it a week or so later with a more objective mindset, it was much, much better than I had remembered. That's when I realized that you weren't editing wrong, you were just editing your own way. I think from now you should just concentrate on perfecting your own style instead of bending over backwards to copy the "accepted" style of pretty much every other editor on the org.

This IC illustrates that perfectly. Hagaren's (no offense to Hagaren) was pretty, proper, and highly generic. But it did everything "right". Your's had mistakes, but I noticed every single cut you made. The editing felt more "vibrant" if you will. I wouldn't have been able to guess the exact tone of the video just from reading the description.

TL;DR
You've had your own style from day one, and I've seen it when it works. When other people try to correct you, they're trying to conform you to a generic style. Don't let them erase what makes your videos, yours. (I've been guilty of this in the past as well)

Also, damn near everyone else on the org is just as amature as you are. There's no big set of amv making rules everyone's keeping from you, so any advice they give you will 90% of the time be pulled straight from their ass. Take it into consideration, but don't let it guide you.

(PS, I probably would have voted for you had it not been for the aspect ratio, regardless of the scene with envy.)

Thank you. THANK.....YOU!! This is probably the one and only response I was really looking for.
This made me feel so much better when I read it, and the way you described everything, really made me feel like you were actually paying attention to my feelings and that you got what I was saying. I...I can't say anything......speechless. Seriously, I'm boggled at the moment.

I really don't think I should conform to traditional methods of editing. Cause then we all lose our sense of originality, and we can't really call our videos our own. I think that's the best way to some it up. What's wrong with having different styles? What's wrong with a little unorthadox editing here and there? Thank you Vivaldi. You really truly get it. Ahhh, man!! I feel so much better for some reason. I don't think I said what I wanted to say right though

I think, when you watch an AMV, look at it from as Vivaldi said, an objective mindset. Think outside the perverbial editing box and try to feel what the editor wanted to do. I really don't think that there is a correct way to edit or an incorrect way, and I really think that sometimes, AMV editor's tend to forget that. I know I have on some occasions. Again, thanks Vivaldi.

[LittleAtari]

Also, damn near everyone else on the org is just as amature as you are. There's no big set of amv making rules everyone's keeping from you, so any advice they give you will 90% of the time be pulled straight from their ass. Take it into consideration, but don't let it guide you.

I'm sorry Vivaldi. I've probably never said this to someone concerning AMVs, but you're wrong to an extent.

AMVs are montages and montage theory along with other design theories are actually taught in universities and practiced by professionals. There are general guidelines on how to do things because the mind does perceive things a certain way. We are drawn to things that have more movement. We are drawn towards text. When making posters for a movie, there is a science behind it in the coloring and placement of objects to keep things balanced, make them more appealing, and draw focus towards one thing. The same goes for montages (AMVs). There is a wrong way to do things.

A song does have an atmosphere to it and any footage shown with it in a montage should compliment that because you are trying to make it so that the two work flawlessly together. You can hit every beat in a song, but depending on how you hit it, some people will say that it's oversynced. In Kazemon's Switchback, while the pacing needed work, she managed to hit every single beat, including using lyrics as a beat, without it coming off as over synced because in general she was going along the lines of hard cut -> fade -> internal sync -> overlay. If she had gone hard cut -> hard cut -> hard cut, it would've been considered oversynced because the eyes wouldn't be able to visually grasp everything going on.

In general, I dont have too much knowledge when it comes to montage theory and I hope someone can explain this much better than I can. My point is, there is a science behind visual design. If you remember one of my old betas for Cascadathon, you told me to make sure I dont confuse my viewers as to what I want them to focus on. So I actually went back, took things I learned in my visual design class and implemented them in my track. I added more movement to things that I wanted there to be focus on and made other things have less movement because I didnt want there to be focus on them.

As for TC's style, I wont go into it here because I dont think I should analyze someone's style in public, but I will say this: Had I been in this IC and edited perfectly, I dont think I would have won because of Hagaren's source. It's Pokemon. Who edits with that? People may call it generic, but it may as well have been the opening to a new season of Pokemon. TC's editing was good and really showed maturity. It was perfect in editing, but the scene selection with Envy just didnt cut it and the AR was wrong. This was an IC and so TC could've chosen to not edit that part of the song if he didnt have the more scenes handy. Had the AR been right, without the Envy scene, there's a big chance that I would've actually voted for him.

EDIT:
As for going back and watching something over, once you've seen the video, you know what to expect and grasp it better because you are familiar with it and you almost never have that convenience.

Also it seems that TC posted while I was typing this post so I will need to probably change this post.

EDIT2:
I just wanted to add something. As far as AMVs go, sure they are made for the fun of it and you can edit however you like. You can over sync or be an effect whore or anything for yourself though. When you are asking to be judged, making an AMV for the general audience, or collaborating with someone, you just dont have that freedom.