a nice little sujestion

bum · Post by **bum** » Thu Dec 25, 2003 10:03 pm

Arigatomyna wrote:Are you kidding? Really, that's a scary thought.

I'm sure there are people who download hundreds of vids and only review one or two of them - can you imagine the chaos if everyone started contacting those who downloaded their vids and didn't review them? We yell at people in the Op Exchange for asking for reviews without giving them, and we reproach people in the AMV Annoucement board for complaining that they've had a lot of downloads and no opinions yet - why do we do that? I thought it was because you should review if you want reviews. If you say anyone who downloads something should be harrassed until he reviews the vid, then it makes reviews cheap.

And maybe that wouldn't be such a bad thing. Just imagine if everyone reviewed eveything they downloaded so he doesn't get harrassed by the creators. Every vid would have hundreds of reviews, the top list would have to be bumped up to 60+ to account for the average being so high. And with people feeling obligated to review everything, the reviews would get short, rushed, with less thought put into the scores. And eventually, a review would be like it is on fanfiction.net - "I liked it, nice job" or "it was okay" and nothing more - just a quick note to avoid the harassment of not having reviewed a vid you downloaded. This would take away the competition, would make reviews meaningless, and that could be a nice change in the way amvs are looked at.

But I don't think anyone really wants that to happen - at least not the people who direct new members to the top lists as if reviews mean something, and not to the people who give reviews because others value the feedback as something difficult to come by. If the average was 1 review per download, it would be meaningless after a few short weeks - and you can bet people *would* harrass the viewers if they knew exactly who had downloaded their vids.

Personally, I don't care. Even if I had a list of everyone who'd downloaded my vids, I'd never ask for a single review on any of them. If I want a forced review, I'll do an exchange. And I already try to review what I download, so all it would mean to me is that people complain and try to rush me since my feedback is slow in coming - either I'd have more to delete from my inbox (since I avoid aim), or I'd have to write quicker and more useless reviews. Knowing me, I'd ignore the complaints and keep doing what I do anyway. So really, it makes no difference to me.

It's just something you'd want to really think about before implementing.

okok im sorry for making a sujestion. i just wish people would have the decency to occasionaly spend a minute or two to comment on someones hard work, esspecialy if they download a vid with, say about 20+ downloads and no opps

Scintilla · Post by **Scintilla** » Thu Dec 25, 2003 10:32 pm

I don't see why said complaining people are complaining.

On average, I get 1 opinion for every 100 downloads, and that's only counting direct ones. I didn't realize most people got more.

Arigatomina · Post by **Arigatomina** » Thu Dec 25, 2003 10:36 pm

bum wrote:okok im sorry for making a sujestion. i just wish people would have the decency to occasionaly spend a minute or two to comment on someones hard work, esspecialy if they download a vid with, say about 20+ downloads and no opps

Now wait a minute, I wasn't flaming your idea. I just meant there are a lot of things to consider before you support something like that.

As for the lack of feeback, look at it like this - 60 people download a video and only one likes it enough to leave a review. What's worse, that the creator gets one person saying he liked it, and is left wondering what the others thought, or he gets 50 people saying they didn't like it or care enough about it to bother saying anything to the person who made it? That one reviewer who would have done it anyway is going to get lost amid the rest of the people who just don't care enough to be troubled leaving a bit of feeback. Do you really want a bunch of people who don't care leaving reviews saying as much? Sure, some of them may have liked the vids, but if they didn't like it enough to leave a review voluntarily, do you really want to force them to do so?

Now, everyone who downloads a vid (and wants to download more than 10 vids) has to leave a star rating. That average should tell you what the majority opinion on the vid is. If the star rating is high - 3.5/3.6 and up then yeah, it would be nice to make all those people who liked it to leave reviews since obviously a majority of the people downloading did like it well enough to score 3 and above. But if your rating is 2.3, do you really want to force those people to review the vid when they didn't like it that much? It's like having the star ratings be non-annonymous, so you can ask the people who gave you 4s to review - is that really how you want to appear to those people who liked your vids? As desperate?

[And again, I'm not pointing at you specifically, just talking to anyone who might consider this idea - giving the reverse side of it. It's an interesting idea, but it has its drawbacks as well. It deserves some discussion besides 'no' or whatever one-liners pop up.]

Arigatomina · Post by **Arigatomina** » Thu Dec 25, 2003 10:44 pm

Scintilla wrote:On average, I get 1 opinion for every 100 downloads, and that's only counting direct ones. I didn't realize most people got more.

I've always considered the average op/download ratio to be 1/100 - that's what the older editors say as well. Sure, the more well-known editors will go away from that since they tend to publicize the vids more, and they get feedback from con viewers, steady fans, etc. But even those tend to drop off back to the 1/100 average once the 'newness' wears off. I don't think it's anything to worry about.

Annoying, maybe when you're new and ready to hear how people are taking your work - eager to get feedback for improvement and help. But there's the op exchange. 1 op for 1 download. If you play it enough you can get lots of ops, all you have to do is return the favor and leave feedback yourself.

bum · Post by **bum** » Thu Dec 25, 2003 11:20 pm

then again thier are people like me strugling with 56k where downloading 40megs just aint a reasonable option, esspecialy if you share the phone line with the one used for the phone

Arigatomina · Post by **Arigatomina** » Fri Dec 26, 2003 1:51 am

bum wrote:then again thier are people like me strugling with 56k where downloading 40megs just aint a reasonable option, esspecialy if you share the phone line with the one used for the phone

Ah, but I refuse to accept that excuse. ^_^

I'm on 52.3K and I've done 466 reviews in the last 7 months, with about 78 more vids in my folder to be reviewed as soon as I get a chance to do so. Sure, it's a lot slower than those with faster connections, but not impossible. And I don't even use Opera to resume my downloads - I start from scratch every time my connection dies and still manage to get and review plenty of vids. A good way around the shared phone line would be to let the long downloads (the 60mb = 6hr downloads) go at night when no one is using the phone. ^.~ Or do exchanges with people who use direct links and don't mind you using a download manager that will let you resume hours later when you get back online. It's possible.

Still, if you can't get online for more than an hour or two at a time, you can always use the free op offers. Those tend to pop up ever so often - quite a few are going right now. ^"^

SarahtheBoring · Post by **SarahtheBoring** » Fri Dec 26, 2003 2:21 am

Or you could stop obsessing about reviews and just make videos.

Ops to me are a bonus - they're sometimes useful, they're nice to see, but they are not the point of all of this.

"People should spend a minute" etc. - That's their decision, and I don't think it's fair for you to tell people what they should be doing with their time.

If you like doing reviews, fabulous. If you don't, I don't think you're committing some horrible sin against those poor poor editors. You act like you slave away for years without getting anything in return. You got a video in return, people. Enjoy it.

/tiredranting

Arigatomina · Post by **Arigatomina** » Fri Dec 26, 2003 2:31 am

SarahtheBoring wrote:"People should spend a minute" etc. - That's their decision, and I don't think it's fair for you to tell people what they should be doing with their time.

I agree. ^_^ I tend to be grateful to the people who spend hours (dial up) and then 4-5 minutes of their time just watching my vids. Anyone who takes *extra* time to tell me what they thought, well, definitely a big bonus. Unless I'm doing an exchange where they *have* to review, I don't expect it. I'm glad just having people see what I enjoy on the off chance that someone else might like it just as much as I do.

SarahtheBoring · Post by **SarahtheBoring** » Fri Dec 26, 2003 2:38 am

Arigatomyna wrote:I'm glad just having people see what I enjoy on the off chance that someone else might like it just as much as I do.

*thumbs-up* You know, it took me a hell of a long time to realize this, but it's very true. 8)

Back to reading flamewars for entertainment...

bum · Post by **bum** » Fri Dec 26, 2003 8:35 am

Arigatomyna wrote:
bum wrote:then again thier are people like me strugling with 56k where downloading 40megs just aint a reasonable option, esspecialy if you share the phone line with the one used for the phone
Ah, but I refuse to accept that excuse. ^_^

I'm on 52.3K and I've done 466 reviews in the last 7 months, with about 78 more vids in my folder to be reviewed as soon as I get a chance to do so. Sure, it's a lot slower than those with faster connections, but not impossible. And I don't even use Opera to resume my downloads - I start from scratch every time my connection dies and still manage to get and review plenty of vids. A good way around the shared phone line would be to let the long downloads (the 60mb = 6hr downloads) go at night when no one is using the phone. ^.~ Or do exchanges with people who use direct links and don't mind you using a download manager that will let you resume hours later when you get back online. It's possible.

Still, if you can't get online for more than an hour or two at a time, you can always use the free op offers. Those tend to pop up ever so often - quite a few are going right now. ^"^

ok thing is that im using a realy crap net conection (actualy its the best in australia, but the deals suck) and ive only got 120hours before i have to start paying an extra $1.50 / hour, and seeing that would piss my perants off