Deleting posts

Arigatomina · Post by **Arigatomina** » Mon Jan 26, 2004 7:41 pm

The mods do babysit. That's the point of having hidden people with control - to keep control. If the community members were capable of behaving themselves, there would be no need for mods. They aren't. Period - they aren't.

This isn't a free state, it's Phade's site. He has his rules set down and joining members agree to follow those rules. One of the rules dictates that posts shall not be used for personal attacks and that courtesy be used with each other. That is a rule.

There is a rule that people not post links to warez. Those breaking this rule are noted and the rule is enforced. If they were capable of not breaking the rule, the mods would not be needed. They aren't capable, so the mods babysit.

When a new member comes in and posts in the wrong section, the babysitters take them and put them where they belong - in the proper section thereby teaching them how to behave. These people are not capable of doing it on their own - if they were, the mods would not be needed. They aren't, so the mods step in.

Obviously flamers are not capable of behaving themselves. If they were, then there would be no problem. A leader would be nice - and we have one. Phade. Our leader has his minions - the mods. They are the leaders and babysitters who rule the wild children. And the wild children are currently acting up - so they need to be taken by the ear and given a time out. This is leadership.

There's no need for the community to pick people to lead - Phade has already done this - the mods and the admin. The only problem is that they are not enforcing this particular rule. Hence the thread.

And I don't think you have to worry about a snowball effect this time. I seriously doubt the mods will so much as tap a flamer on the wrist and say 'be nice.' The point of this thread was to lodge a complaint against the uninforced rule. Because that is all members can do - complain and point out the problem. Any solution is left to the leaders, who have already been chosen and appointed by the owner.

And yes, I know you're talking about free society with thinking rational people capable of living in harmony. But that isn't going to happen here if you say 'let them stop on their own, don't tell them what to do, don't enforce the site rule or you'll be infringing on their rights to flame.'

Euphoria on the org is an amv - it's the closest you'll find to a 'Utopia' around here. ^_^;;

J-0080 · Post by **J-0080** » Mon Jan 26, 2004 9:34 pm

While they may not touch flames, they have noooo problem what-so-ever with removing my wonderful spammlyness.

Katsumi_AMVs · Post by **Katsumi_AMVs** » Mon Jan 26, 2004 9:41 pm

Seriously I prefer your spam than the flames posts

Lyrs · Post by **Lyrs** » Mon Jan 26, 2004 10:58 pm

Paulo wrote:Seriously I prefer your spam than the flames posts

Aren't they one and the smae? i fail to reason how you can not have seen that fact.

Arigatomina · Post by **Arigatomina** » Mon Jan 26, 2004 11:42 pm

Lyrs wrote:
Paulo wrote:Seriously I prefer your spam than the flames posts
Aren't they one and the smae? i fail to reason how you can not have seen that fact.

A nice angle - the only difference is that flames are 'on-topic' because they are in direct regard to either the post, or the person making that post. Also, a flame is hateful while spam is merely chat. Still, both are useless - one is deleted and the other isn't. Acknowledge that both are useless and unpertaining to amvs and you can delete them both.

Flames should be as easy to get rid of as harmless spam is. Unless we *like* the hate and dislike the neutral boredom.

But what does it matter, really? I made another complaint about this exact same thing months back, after watching silently and noting the behavior. If General OT were open, you'd find that huge rant here:
http://animemusicvideos.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=15437
I received a substantial response from the community, nearly 10 pages before the spam set in.

You know what the members said back then? "It's not so bad, it's harmless fun, you'll get used to it."

Know what? I'm still not 'used to it,' it's still just as bad as it was, and it isn't now nor was it ever 'harmless fun.' But people are still spouting 'ignore it and it will go away.'

I've waited almost 9 months for it to go away. I can only imagine how long other members have been waiting. Problems don't go away unless you admit they exist and do something about them. Ignore it and I guarantee - in another 9 months someone else will be posting, lodging a complaint about the same problem. Because it doesn't end until you *make* it end.

J-0080 · Post by **J-0080** » Mon Jan 26, 2004 11:51 pm

How do we make it end, though?

Arigatomina · Post by **Arigatomina** » Tue Jan 27, 2004 12:03 am

J-0080 wrote:How do we make it end, though?

We can't, the mods, admin, and Phade are the only ones who weild the power to enforce the rules. All we can do is remind them until it gets so bad they either get rid of us to shut us up, or start reprimanding the worst offenders.

More likely, it will be ignored for 9 more months until this thread begins again. I really wish OT hadn't been deleted now - I think it would be nice to quote some of the people who replied to me back then. I wonder if they'd still try to assure me that flames were only made in 'jest' and were 'playful rebukes' rather than harrassing bits of nastiness. I'm tempted to look through my folders and see if I made a copy of my old post - I can ask them again and see if they still insist on pretending it doesn't exist. And I have an idea it might be different now that I'm not quite a 'noob' - I doubt dwchang would tell me to shut up and leave as quickly as he did back then.

trythil · Post by **trythil** » Tue Jan 27, 2004 1:02 am

J-0080 wrote:How do we make it end, though?

Invoke a final solution: Delete all non-Arian posts.

(I'm going to Hell for that one.)

Anyway, here's the perspective from someone I know that you would consider to be a flamer. This will not make sense in some places, and thus should not be subjected to logical analysis. Take it as you will; I'm sure that, between the absolutely tasteless pun of mine and what's to come, you'll hate me. But, hey, oh well.

If someone is acting like an idiot, I believe that they should be informed of their idiocy. Sugar-coated speech is something that I refuse to concoct or consume; that is, if I tell someone "you're an idiot because of these reasons", I expect someone else to say "no, you're the idiot because you messed this up".

I also find sarcasm on trivial subjects -- people typing using excessive 'Net shorthand, people trying to use cruddy MPEG-1 bootlegs for AMVs, Vic's DVDs, most anything related to this hobby -- funny, regardless of who it's aimed at. This is just me, though, and I don't think many others share this view.

Flames, to me, are drawn-out, unwarranted, explicit personal attacks. I use explicit because I think people have become far too sensitive about what they consider to be inflammatory material. It's a Web forum. What you read may not be what the author intended.

Having said that, I'm going to confuse the issue and say: if someone were to post a thread about the death of their parent, and someone attacks them, the rest of their family, and their dog for it, I think that that's unambiguously a flame.

I don't think someone posting "hey, this is off-topic, read the forum description" is a flame in that context. "Hey, this is off-topic, read the forum description, you crying sack of shit" is.

Now, I don't believe I've ever done something like that.

Arigatomina · Post by **Arigatomina** » Tue Jan 27, 2004 1:36 am

Agreed, so what are these?

go to fucknig hell you stupid n00b and try looking at the fucking guides before i cut your balls up. serisly, do you have to me so fucking anoying ? god i hate n00bs

--given in response to a question that had already been answered in the same thread

Read the stickys and the guides dipshit. They put them there for a reason

--given to someone who had posted only once before, based on his user name more than anything (as admitted later in the thread)

THIS IS HOW YOU MAKE A FUckING AMV, YOU BITCHES!!!!!

--this was a joke, but read it as a new member scanning through a thread

Hey, just be glad I'm not the one who started getting up your behind about spelling and grammar. You'd hurt so much, you'd never want to poop again for the rest of your life.

--that's an example of a nice one....

Except for one, those are taken from one section - the General AMV section - all of which are on the first page. Now take that and multiply it by however many pages you have in that section. It makes for a lot of nasty useless posts. Then go into the other sections and start looking at the flames - they're everywhere. No, considering the number of posts on the forum, 3 per page per section isn't a bad average. But it makes the place a nasty hostile environment for new members. Considering our latest admin is quoted to have said "we're so friendly you don't need welcome threads" - I don't think these flames are the sort of greeting we want to give new people.

And you *don't* have to sugar coat things. Just refraining from excessive cursing, and threats of bodily injury (or penetration in one person's case) would be enough to keep it from being quite so nasty. The biggest problem isn't that people are flaming - it's that members are supporting them. It's that people are making excuses for it and trying to rationalize it. So once again, no one seems to get how hostile the place is except for the outsiders coming into it.

No, Trythil, I don't hate you.

I don't recall you being one of the flamers who've been most active lately - or any flames you've given. If you have, I must have missed it. If anything, you've just proven me right - how could I complain about that? Members are still saying 'it's not so bad, it's just trial by fire, they deserve to be treated that way, you'll get used to it.'

Thanks. ^_^ I'll take that as a 'shut up until someone brings this up 9 months from now' post.

Flint the Dwarf · Post by **Flint the Dwarf** » Tue Jan 27, 2004 1:44 am

trythil wrote:Invoke a final solution: Delete all non-Arian posts.

I believe you mean "Aryan".

The things I have to put up with.