AWA 2010 - Pro downloads active; Expo 4 days left, August 20

[outlawed]

It's supposed to be a quality contest, but in fact about 1/4th of those vids can be deemed "Pro". Others are Live Action, trolls and just average videos (sorry to their authors, but it is so) - honestly, most of the AMVNews.ru competitions (however much I don't want to admit it) spark better and more original videos these days. I wonder why this contest has degraded that much and I would maybe like to ask the coordinators - have you noticed this and are you just hoping it will go away by itself or haven't you noticed at all?

That's because Pro has nothing to do with editor quality and entry quality. Pro is just the label they came up with for it. It's about peer based judging which back then didn't really exist elsewhere. It just so happens there was probably a much higher % of the top editors submitting in some past years. There were still plenty of what you would call poor videos back then.

[Nya-chan Production]

in fact about 1/4th of those vids can be deemed "Pro". Others are Live Action, trolls and just average videos (sorry to their authors, but it is so)

Yeah, Live Action videos are never pro.

Nonono, don't get me wrong - I am talking about AMVs only, because I don't consider myself to be able to recognize which LA is "Pro" and which is not, not that I diss LA (in fact most of LA this year stands over AMVs, which is kind of sad too) ^^;;;

[BasharOfTheAges]

It's fucking common courtesy.

That's basically it. If enough people are offended by content, maybe start asking the rules to be changed to limit what's allowed in.

[Pwolf]

If that's how people really feel it should be then I'll probably decline from entering Pro in the future. If not being able to watch every video is degrading the contest then I shouldn't enter. Mind as well remove my video from this years contest cause I can't honestly say I'll watch them all.

My point about Pro is that it's supposed to be a give and take experience. The submission is the give. The judging process is what people take out. It's not supposed to be just another dumping grounds contest. That's why I argue this point.

Maybe I missed something, but every year I submitted, I've never received any feedback from anyone other then an award. I usually don't read the forum posts where people review each video. The only time anyone gives me any feedback on the video I submitted is when I release it on the org. So there really isn't any give or take experience, from my point of view.

On a side note, the very act of someone NOT watching an H amv tells the editor what their opinion is.

Not to be mean or rude, (as that's not my intention for replying to this, plus I consider you a good friend) the message it sends to me is:

"I won't even give this a chance."

It also makes me feel like I wasted my time working on something I had fun making if nobody's even going to consider it. I don't care if my videos win or lose, but I do like to think that it had an honest shot at competing.

That's pretty much exactly what they are saying but they are also saying they don't like the content. You submitted a video that you should know is very nitch and not accepted by everyone, you can't expect everyone to watch it. Even if someone watches it that's not going to guarantee anything cause their bias is going to play a much larger role then your editing. Personally, if I made an H video, I would rather have people who have no bias against it judge it then have people who do. That's just me.

[outlawed]

Maybe I missed something, but every year I submitted, I've never received any feedback from anyone other then an award. I usually don't read the forum posts where people review each video. The only time anyone gives me any feedback on the video I submitted is when I release it on the org. So there really isn't any give or take experience, from my point of view.

You take from the "Judging Process" and by that I mean participating in judging the entries. You yourself said you didn't judge one year because you didn't have time to watch any of the entries. It's hard to take anything out of that experience when you aren't judging let alone watching any of the entries=p

Should I be alarmed? Is this how a lot of people take the judging process? To me the most important thing people can take out of Pro is watching all those videos and making their own critique to rank them for voting. Some people are clearly doing this based on the discussions in this thread.

[Prodigi]

I think my example was terrible... I just don't think someone who enters Pro (or any contest for that matter) should be forced to watch a video they would feel uncomfortable watching just because they signed something saying they are 18+ years old. I think if it was a mandatory requirement to watch every video then there would be a lot less entries cause there are people out there who wont watch certain things. Would a reasonable solution be to opt out of judging but still be allowed to submit?

If you can't watch everything that comes your way then don't fucking enter :\

If I'm an avid religious person, and I start to watch a video in the competition that I find to be highly offensive to my belief system and my religion (I'm using this as an example, I'm not referring to H vids), do I have to sit through it and watch it and judge it on it's "artistic merits" or are my personal beliefs enough so that I can skip over it? I personally believe if something makes you uncomfortable enough regardless of the fact you "signed up" for Pro you should be able to skip it. That said, it doesn't mean you can turn around and vote against it just soully for that reason. If it makes you uncomfortable, don't watch it, but leave it at that.

Now yer just being a nitpicking faggot, sorry.

No. If you read back over everything you've written you are the one who's acting like a tool. Your arguments have less to do with your beliefs and more to do with the fact that you consistently like to pick a fight. Believe whatever you want to believe but don't start throwing around statements like that because all it proves is that you couldn't care less about the topic of the argument and that all you care about is the argument itself. If you were taking it seriously you'd leave things constructive and have a back and forth discussion and instead of going "no, you're wrong faggot, i'm right".

On a side note, the very act of someone NOT watching an H amv tells the editor what their opinion is.

Not to be mean or rude, (as that's not my intention for replying to this, plus I consider you a good friend) the message it sends to me is:

"I won't even give this a chance."

It also makes me feel like I wasted my time working on something I had fun making if nobody's even going to consider it. I don't care if my videos win or lose, but I do like to think that it had an honest shot at competing.

I see where you're coming from but I personally disagree. I think it's less of making the statement "I won't even give this a chance" and more like making the statement "this is something I'm not comfortable with, and for that reason I can't in good conscious leave feedback, either positive or negative, on this piece of work".

I think with most people who won't watch the H videos it's less because they don't like H vids, but rather that they make them uncomfortable. Should we really have to put a rule around it saying "if you enter then you have to watch everything" and either: a) lose all editors who are uncomfortable about H vids, or b) force people to be put out of their comfort zone?

I see the merits in H vids. I think a lot of editors who don't watch them would agree that it's less because "H videos suck" and more because "I'm not comfortable with the content". H videos are just like any other type of video, and they have their merits and they do deserve feedback. But I think forcing people who aren't comfortable to provide feedback is just counter-intuitive.

I don't care what anyone else thinks, but I won't be forced out of my comfort zone. If that means in future a "you must watch all entries" rule is enforced then I guess I won't be entering Pro anymore. That's just how I feel and I won't be forced to change.

[Nya-chan Production]

(kholaras's thoughts ATM: "Maybe it was a bad idea to mark those L and H vids after all.")

[Pwolf]

Maybe I missed something, but every year I submitted, I've never received any feedback from anyone other then an award. I usually don't read the forum posts where people review each video. The only time anyone gives me any feedback on the video I submitted is when I release it on the org. So there really isn't any give or take experience, from my point of view.

You take from the "Judging Process" and by that I mean participating in judging the entries. You yourself said you didn't judge one year because you didn't have time to watch any of the entries. It's hard to take anything out of that experience when you aren't judging let alone watching any of the entries=p

Should I be alarmed? Is this how a lot of people take the judging process? To me the most important thing people can take out of Pro is watching all those videos and making their own critique to rank them for voting. Some people are clearly doing this based on the discussions in this thread.

Not to sound elitist or "better then thou" but personally don't really get anything out of watching videos or judging them. The only reasons I like entering pro are because it's blind and there's a level of participation outside of just being a contestant. But I don't expect every editor who enters the contest to watch every video or to submit a video that's never been released. My whole argument about this is that I think that's an unreasonable expectation to put on someone. That's my opinion. If the rules stated it has to be done a specific way, then I would follow the rules or not enter. "Common courtesy" is only what you want it to be. To me it would be common courtesy to be accepting of those who might find some content to be too uncomfortable to watch and accept that and also accept that some people aren't going to be able to watch every video due to what ever reasons they might have.

(kholaras's thoughts ATM: "Maybe it was a bad idea to mark those L and H vids after all.")

I agree, they shouldn't have been marked... because then at least the viewer would've watch the video and can decide at that point if it's something they don't want to watch.

[SailorDeath]

I see where you're coming from but I personally disagree. I think it's less of making the statement "I won't even give this a chance" and more like making the statement "this is something I'm not comfortable with, and for that reason I can't in good conscious leave feedback, either positive or negative, on this piece of work".

The point I was making wasn't what they're thinking, it was the message that it sends to me. I can honestly say that's how I would feel if someone skipped watching a video I've made based solely on its content.

I don't care what anyone else thinks, but I won't be forced out of my comfort zone. If that means in future a "you must watch all entries" rule is enforced then I guess I won't be entering Pro anymore. That's just how I feel and I won't be forced to change.

That's my point exactly, if you feel uncomfortable about hentai, then don't enter a contest that allows it.

[outlawed]

you can't expect everyone to watch it. Even if someone watches it that's not going to guarantee anything cause their bias is going to play a much larger role then your editing. Personally, if I made an H video, I would rather have people who have no bias against it judge it then have people who do.

As has been already proven we can't expect everyone to watch all the entries but we can hope for and advocate that as a community. Since H entries and other content which someone might find objectionable (like if a video were flagged ultra-violence) are in the contest regardless, judging bias has no bearing when comparing a no view to a view. A score of 0 can only go up. Now if you want to argue that this content is not appropriate for Pro and should have another contest that argument makes sense but so far no one has been willing to make that argument.

I'm not keen on flagging videos. But the comfort zone comments are one of the reasons disclaimers exist. It sounds like they flagged more than just 18+ vids though? I keep posting all this junk in here because I think if a bunch of people are being made uncomfortable and this is not working out and submitters have been turned off then maybe it's time to segregate the 18+ videos to a separate contest?