AMVs as fair use

[Bauzi]

Larry Lessig did a talk at TED in march (only now posted online) on remix culture, in it he showed a Vampire Hunter D amv to the crowd along with other remix pieces.

Man that´s awesome! I mean: Lessing is somebody big in the whole thing. He created the thermes remix culture and permission culture and made some other stuff too.

I had yesterday my presentation about remix culture in my english class. Too bad that some stuff happens just this week =/ Damn it! This would give cool stuff.

Anyway:

Did you all know that "Prince" threats 3 fan websites because they host lyrics, pictures and record covers? If they get really sued from him the 3 fansites want to defense themselve with fair use. I´m interressted how it turns out and I think the fansites will win.

Prince is a bastard. Fucker... Man I hope he doesn´t find out about this site.

I think it unlikely we will ever have a meaningful dialog with Japanese rights holders to anime unless they themselves decide to allow remixing and not as a result of any conversation we have with them.

North American Anime distributors do have a dialog with the Japanese rights holders and also have some degree of freedom with the works. Is the next step to try to establish a dialog with them?

...

I can only say: Of course we don´t say anything about fansubs. This site stands for material and software you bought. It´s a core in the rules even if not much people do it. Anyway it´s a difference to say: "Oh forget the DVDs and just get the fansub. Here is a torrent!"

Can we present AMVs as a form of fan-device that will renew interest with an older series?

Yes.

Also, what would be the best way to strike up such a dialog, individually contacting them for permission? As an advocacy group representing editors?

Of course there would be an exampel amv good. Something that doesn´t "distort" the original images with wild effects. Something that spreads the fun and is simpel and great:


I can´t think of a better example. They´re like really cool trailers for the anime.

There's a lot of options here, do we gain influence together or do we merely look more commercial in their eyes and more of a threat?

Commerical. I imagine anime studios that request amvs much more often.

[quadir]

my all-around favorite person trythil pointed me to this article,
http://www.wired.com/techbiz/media/maga ... 1/ff_manga

It's about dojinshi in japan and the legal limbo they sit in. In pages 4 and 5 is the real juicy stuff, with an argument made for the community giving multiple advantantages and benefits to the original artists. There's also a conversation with one of the CLAMP people about dojinshi that's heartening.

[BasharOfTheAges]

You'd figure they'd be in less of a legal grey area than we are in terms of plausible deniability since the industry can't really claim that they don't know about doujinshi when entire businesses are centered around selling it and large events like Comiket draw hundreds of thousands of people each year.

[Garridy]

Taken from quadir's latest link.

"This is something that satisfies the fans," Ichikawa said. "The publishers understand that this does not diminish the sales of the original product but may increase them. So they don't come down here and shut it down."

If had to guess, I'd say it might come down to something similar to this for AMV's

[Kionon]

Taken from quadir's latest link.

"This is something that satisfies the fans," Ichikawa said. "The publishers understand that this does not diminish the sales of the original product but may increase them. So they don't come down here and shut it down."

If had to guess, I'd say it might come down to something similar to this for AMV's

Over the years, many of us have made the same claim for AMVs.

I have made it in this very thread.

AMVs do not act as a substitution for the original work.

I am not the only one who has received an opinion or a quick comment about a video that says, "Loved the video, going to go check out the anime now, thanks!" Happens all the time.

[Garridy]

AMV's pretty much dictate what animes I watch/buy nowdays. Saves me from being completely disappointed with a series that I pick up because I can get a little insight into what the series is like. And, ya, like you said I'm not the only one...

[downwithpants]

Taken from quadir's latest link.

"This is something that satisfies the fans," Ichikawa said. "The publishers understand that this does not diminish the sales of the original product but may increase them. So they don't come down here and shut it down."

If had to guess, I'd say it might come down to something similar to this for AMV's

i don't think that's the entire story. its also "don't bite the hand that feeds you." an artist or publishing company suing its own fans is not only likely to lose those potential consumers, but also other fanart-participating consumers who learn about it.

[Jake Furlong]

Lol, I came here set to start a thread about Ted's say in this issue, along with a link, but I noticed the talk that was going on in this thread. Anyway, here's a link towards the .mp4 version of the speech.

Now, back on topic - Personally, I started watching Azumanga Daioh because of AMV Hell 3. Gradually, it grew in one of my favourites and I'm grabbing all the Azu merch I can afford. This is just an illustration of the fact that, just as mentioned earlier about doujinshis, AMV's and generally fan-made content can do things to boost the sales for owner companies.

Lurking around the Org for some time and learning little bits and pieces of history gradually drew me in and I decided to start learning editing this fall, thus creating my very first AMV.
However, even if I registered on the forums this spring doesn't mean that I didn't get a glimpse of last year's "small incident"...
It is my honest opinion that fan generated content should be a reason for pride to the content's owner, it's basically free publicity and it shows that some people love that particular content so much that they are willing to invest time in giving it a "refresh". When you try to control your property to the extent that you threaten with lawsuit anyone that even thinks about modifying it, although you're in your full legal rights, you should expect your image to do a steep drop. As someone quoted in the thread from last year, "what did you solve now, that you've threatened a bunch of fans, other than selling less records next year?" (sorry if I don't remember the quote exactly).

Talk went on earlier in the thread about some kind of unifying in an entity of sorts, so "content remixers" such as us, AMV creators, would have more legal weight. That would be one sollution. Certainly Ted, in his speech talked about something as this and drew a parallel to BMI.
Anyway, point is, basically it all comes down to common sense. Of course, common sense is a very volatile notion from the corporate point of view, but with a little determination and with the "don't bite the hand that feeds you" argument mentioned earlier, I think that things could get accomplished. The corporations are against us? Well, we do have people such as Ted Lessig and Cory Doctorow on our side, from one point of view or another. I feel that the time for a firm position is coming closer.

[quadir]

http://www2.utah.edu/podcast/category.php?id=6

This keynote lecture for the Frontiers of New Media Symposium addresses the changing landscape of media. As media converge and online communities begin to take an active role in the production of media content, Henry Jenkins explores the changing relations between producers and consumers.

It's a 1hour podcast by Henry Jenkins that talks a lot about fanlib's attempt to create a market to sell fanfic.

vidders are creating an organization for transformative works and I've heard murmurs of it also being a "front line" for the editors
http://community.livejournal.com/otw_news/

a unofficial "legal advice" community also done by vidders
http://community.livejournal.com/fandom_lawyers/

[dokidoki]

I had lost this link, but found it again recently. An interview with Gainax reps in 2002

AQ: What is your opinion on anime music videos from a company standpoint and from a personal standpoint? Have you seen any anime music videos?

Mr. Yamaga: What exactly do you mean?

AQ: Like the anime music videos that we are going to be showing tonight?

Mr. Yamaga: I like them a lot. I thinks that they are very well done.

Mr. Akai: I didn't know that they existed. I actually like them personally.

Mr. Yamaga: I feel that copywriting is only for professionals. For people who are doing it for their own enjoyment as a hobby, I feel that the line is very blurry. The reason that copywrite laws are so strict is because it is very difficult to make the distinction whether or not someone is professional or amateur. But as Gainax, they got their start doing similar stuff so it's very hard for them to say, "No, We won't allow that'. They also feel that they don't really want to say that. As Gainax, the corporation, they have to say, 'No, we haven't seen it', 'Nope, haven't heard about it'. That is how they deal with it.