State of the Viewers Choice Awards

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Mol
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Re: State of the Viewers Choice Awards

Postby Mol » Fri Feb 23, 2018 6:43 am

I was a bit hoping that it would utilse listing in some way too, and we would get access to post yt stuff as extra D: Too many amvs being made are a bit of problem for such votings but i think the listings don't contain that much as in some years back.

I still wait for simplified drop down menus for org mainpage in a way where it would be easier to find stuff :'(
Still better than that MMO.
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Re: State of the Viewers Choice Awards

Postby Kireblue » Fri Feb 23, 2018 8:32 am

Cenit wrote:You’re forcing people to use a forum they don’t like to nominate videos of their friends. You’re taking away the one reason I still upload to the Org, i.e. all my AMVs can auto participate in the VCA. You require each AMV to be nominated in each category instead of one nomination unlocking all possible categories. Last year some AMVs were in the finals of about 12-13 categories. There would have to be about 100 people actively nominating AMVs to consider all possibilities. But these forums are used by maybe 10. Nominations have always been the weakest phase of the VCAs every year. Whenever there was drama as to why video X wasn’t in the finals it could be traced back to nominations phase missing participation from enough people. Activity is at an all-time low. So now you’re fixing the nominations by forcing forum participation, removing all valid Org uploads and having judges do pre-selections.

Cenit wrote:Have submission forms. Everybody can submit videos of their own. All submissions get judged by the viewers in the first round. Maybe have some judges to submit good videos missing from the list. But every AMV entered should be allowed to participate in the first round, regardless if it's part of the catalog or not.

Have you not realized that I pretty much went with your suggestion? Also, a video isn't required to be nominated in every category. Just like you suggested that we do, we "have some judges to submit good videos missing from the list". Other people had suggested parts of this idea before you, but your input is what tipped the scale towards this decision. So thank you for that.

Kireblue wrote:
KeiichiFace wrote:
MadMegatax wrote:An alternative to the Crunchyroll format is the way that r/anime on reddit is doing awards. From what I understand, they have popular vote determine three entries for a category, and then a panel of judges selects three additional entries for the category. So half are by popular vote, and half are jury selected. Then voting happens like you suggested.


I think this is a good idea. To just have judges choose the entrants gives a lot of space for bias, and I think one of the good things about the viewers' awards is the community involvement.

Kroner92 wrote:I think that the best way is to find a way to people to propose videos ( i just can't came out with a smart idea btw), collect the most shared opinion and then let a jury( made by selected people from different countries) decide. In that way we can listen to every single people who want to vote, but be fair in the final judgment using ( I hope) super partes judges that should just think about the awards interest.


Since so many people have been suggesting this in various forms, I decided to rack my brain a little harder to find a way to combine your ideas into a compromise/ solution. Her'es what I came up with. Since allowing the community to vote on a list of every single AMV made in 2017 is impossible, how about I create a list that consists of only the videos that get posted in the suggestion threads? Whenever someone posts a link to "suggest" a video, I'll update the google form by the end of the day to include it. I'll also turn on the feature that allows users to change their votes if a video gets added later on that wasn't available at the start. The top 6-8 videos will automatically make it to the next round, and the judges will be responsible for nominating 6-8 more videos. The judges will also kick out any videos that get voted on by the community that absolutely doesn't fit a category (like a pure romance video getting trollishly voted on for action)

This idea is pretty much exactly what MadMegatax suggested combined with a manual version of spoondiddly's database suggestion. I think that it was Cenit's way of wording his post that made me think that maybe it wasn't as impossible as i initially thought. This will cause just a little more work on my part, but nothing more than what I was already prepared to do. So what do you guys think? :up: or :down:

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Re: State of the Viewers Choice Awards

Postby Cenit » Fri Feb 23, 2018 8:48 am

You removed every entry from the Org Catalog. From an Org contest. It would be cool if your judges added missing videos from YouTube. But only if the whole catalog was still there to chose from.
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Re: State of the Viewers Choice Awards

Postby Kireblue » Fri Feb 23, 2018 9:02 am

Cenit wrote:You removed every entry from the Org Catalog. From an Org contest. It would be cool if your judges added missing videos from YouTube. But only if the whole catalog was still there to chose from.

Adding in all 1,189 videos that were cataloged last year to each category voting form would be a almost impossible task. But if there are videos cataloged on the site that you feel deserve a nomination, then feel free to post them in the category threads. Here is the link to the filtered search function so that you only see the 2017 videos 2017 Cataloged Videos

This is currently the only way to allow every video that was created in 2017 a equal opportunity to participate.

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Re: State of the Viewers Choice Awards

Postby Cenit » Fri Feb 23, 2018 9:18 am

Nope. Put all my AMVs in all categorys they could possibly compete in. They're in the catalog, you can find them easily. I worked hard on each and everyone of them. They absolutely deserve to be nominees. Even if they don't. Do this for everyone who asks for it. Then change the name to Staff Choice Awards. I think that is all that can be done with this current system.

What i was suggesting were submission forms. For me to add cool shit that is missing from the catalog. OR if you have to remove the entire catalog, for me to throw my own hat in the ring. Because these are supposed to be the VCAs, not the friendship awards.

Kireblue wrote:feel free to post them in the category threads.

Not doing this. No matter how much i love an AMV i would never suggest it for 12 categories. There's no one that needs my affection that badly. But i would very well vote for a single AMV in 12 categories, given how bad the other options are.
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Re: State of the Viewers Choice Awards

Postby Rider4Z » Mon Feb 26, 2018 9:07 pm

I'm open to bribes if you don't get any nominations.

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Re: State of the Viewers Choice Awards

Postby Kionon » Mon Feb 26, 2018 11:20 pm

Cenit wrote:It’s super awesome that Kionon at some point thanked you that the forum is still around but he and your other mods are basically the only "community" left.


1. I apologise, I accidentally messed up your post, Cenit, but I fixed it. I meant to quote you, not in anyway censor or edit your post.

2. Please don't include me in this spat. I didn't do anything to be involved in it.

3. She. Maybe this was a typo or an oversight, or you just didn't realise, but I want to make this clear for other readers.
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Re: State of the Viewers Choice Awards

Postby l33tmeatwad » Tue Mar 13, 2018 12:49 pm

While I welcome the idea of change to help improve the VCAs, the new system seems to actually make some of the flaws of the old system worse, which I say having no horse in this race. Overall I think the time between now and next year should be used to think of a system that actually improves things overall.
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Re: State of the Viewers Choice Awards

Postby Kireblue » Tue Mar 13, 2018 1:41 pm

l33tmeatwad wrote:While I welcome the idea of change to help improve the VCAs, the new system seems to actually make some of the flaws of the old system worse, which I say having no horse in this race. Overall I think the time between now and next year should be used to think of a system that actually improves things overall.

Which flaws do you believe were made worse?

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Re: State of the Viewers Choice Awards

Postby l33tmeatwad » Tue Mar 13, 2018 4:06 pm

Kireblue wrote:
l33tmeatwad wrote:While I welcome the idea of change to help improve the VCAs, the new system seems to actually make some of the flaws of the old system worse, which I say having no horse in this race. Overall I think the time between now and next year should be used to think of a system that actually improves things overall.

Which flaws do you believe were made worse?

Ignoring the fact that most ppl don't watch all the videos posted each year...at least before there was a list of all the videos from that year all in one place. There are often videos you forget about, so limiting nominations to just what you remember the next year or see in the nominations threads may leave some videos out based on them just people either forgetting about them or not even thinking they qualify because maybe they came out through Akross 2016, but were actually released in 2017.
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Re: State of the Viewers Choice Awards

Postby Kireblue » Tue Mar 13, 2018 4:28 pm

l33tmeatwad wrote:
Kireblue wrote:
l33tmeatwad wrote:While I welcome the idea of change to help improve the VCAs, the new system seems to actually make some of the flaws of the old system worse, which I say having no horse in this race. Overall I think the time between now and next year should be used to think of a system that actually improves things overall.

Which flaws do you believe were made worse?

Ignoring the fact that most ppl don't watch all the videos posted each year...at least before there was a list of all the videos from that year all in one place. There are often videos you forget about, so limiting nominations to just what you remember the next year or see in the nominations threads may leave some videos out based on them just people either forgetting about them or not even thinking they qualify because maybe they came out through Akross 2016, but were actually released in 2017.

At the top of each of the category threads, there was a reminder that you can still use the catalog to see all the videos that were posted on the site last year. And each thread had a different link that took you to a predefined search query for 2017 and that specific category. For example, here is the action one
Kireblue wrote:Best Action Video Thread
*And don't forget, you can use the org's search function to filter cataloged videos by year and category

And here is the Video of the year one that shows all of the videos cataloged in 2017 regardless of their category (just like how the old voting system did)
Kireblue wrote:Video of the Year Thread
*And don't forget, you can use the org's search function to filter cataloged videos by year and category

Do you feel that these links weren't predominant enough in the post? For next year, we could also provide links to an equivalent query on AMVNews since they also have a search feature. Turbo actually did a great job at posting videos in the threads from that.

Do you feel that making a faux button at the top of each post (that links to the search page) would fix this problem? And are there any other things that you feel were made worse?

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Re: State of the Viewers Choice Awards

Postby l33tmeatwad » Tue Mar 13, 2018 4:43 pm

The link about searches was buried in the sea of text and the search vs a list is a bit more obnoxious to go through. For example, action alone would require going through 30 pages just to see everything. While I would rarely consider anything about the main site simplified, the VCA process was pretty streamlined and easy follow with very little clarification needed from page to page.
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Re: State of the Viewers Choice Awards

Postby Kireblue » Tue Mar 13, 2018 5:17 pm

l33tmeatwad wrote:The link about searches was buried in the sea of text and the search vs a list is a bit more obnoxious to go through. For example, action alone would require going through 30 pages just to see everything. While I would rarely consider anything about the main site simplified, the VCA process was pretty streamlined and easy follow with very little clarification needed from page to page.

Thank you for posting your critique. I'll look into ways to have a list of all the cataloged videos available for next year's VCAs. One possible solution could simply be using the site's old voting system to generate the webpages with the categorized lists, and then posting those links in the forum even though the old system wouldn't actually be active. Probably could have even done that this year if the suggestion had been made during the nomination period.

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Re: State of the Viewers Choice Awards

Postby spoondiddly » Tue Mar 13, 2018 11:53 pm

I've actually been using the spreadsheets of links because the YT playlists stopped working after a recent Failfox update a couple days ago. The playlists had been rather useful up until then, and it's my fault sticking to this blasted browser. Links were easy enough to find, considering they were in massive bold just before the checklist of nominees, and needed to check them anyway since not all videos had YT links and it's more convenient than searching for the nomination post.

It is sort of a shame the previews aren't through here, but also must save a lot of bandwidth.

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Re: State of the Viewers Choice Awards

Postby Kireblue » Wed Mar 14, 2018 1:32 am

spoondiddly wrote:I've actually been using the spreadsheets of links because the YT playlists stopped working after a recent Failfox update a couple days ago. The playlists had been rather useful up until then, and it's my fault sticking to this blasted browser. Links were easy enough to find, considering they were in massive bold just before the checklist of nominees, and needed to check them anyway since not all videos had YT links and it's more convenient than searching for the nomination post.

It is sort of a shame the previews aren't through here, but also must save a lot of bandwidth.

I'm having that problem as well on Chrom. I hadn't realized that they stopped working till you mentioned it in this post. So thank you for that. I've just added urls to each playlist in the threads, and I'm currently looking into what is causing them to not work anymore. Hope to have a fix in place by the end of the day

Edit: Also added playlist links to the spreadsheets

Edit 2: Figured out why the playlists stopped working. Will fix them shortly

Edit 3: All playlists have now been fixed


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