Proposal for Honest Op week

[BasharOfTheAges]

I just want to run this idea by as many people as possible and see what the AMV community at large thinks of it.

Ok, we all know that opinion scores here are inflated in pretty much every category. The reasoning for this (in my opinion) is because people either only op videos they really like or op vids in the exchange forum where they are afraid to give a bad mark, lest the exchangee decides to spaz and leave a revenge op (then there are the rabid fanboys/fangirls that I don't even want to get into a discussion about). The number of average and below Average videos I have randomly downloaded shows me (and, I’m sure many of you) that high averages are ridiculous.

So, my idea sprang from this conjecture: "What if a lot of honest people started leaving a lot of honest opinions for a lot of these mediocre and bad videos?"

My plan will be that a designated week (TBA) would be an honest op week, where everybody that wanted to participate could download and honestly op 5, 10, even 50 random videos.

The key to the plan is to op honestly (no short ops that can request moding because the recipient doesn’t like the score he/she got), and randomly (not the same person, or they might see this as an attack on them, and that is not the point of this).

I really don't know where the idea came from; I’m not some great editor that has aspirations to make any top video list, but I do notice the problem of inflated scores and it bugs me for some reason.

So, anyone that is interested in this idea please let me know. Tell your friends, spread the word, and we could make an impact no matter how small it may be.

[Farlo]

i always op honestly, but i never op videos that i view that are mediocre.

[AMV_4000]

i always op honestly, but i never op videos that i view that are mediocre.

more then me, i never op honest.. i just act like i watch the vid *im usually sleeping or in the bathroom* then i give an op on how i feel... if im mad, you get crappy scores, if im happy, you get crappy scores, so you may be lucky and get... crappy scores!

[Flint the Dwarf]

i always op honestly, but i never op videos that i view that are mediocre.

i op videos i like or hate, new or old.

Which is it, Farlo?

Anyway, most of my reviews were given to whoever asked in my few free review threads, and I was honest with all of them.

[Arigatomina]

My main problem is the focus (attack) on mediocre and bad videos. Yes, that is the quickest way to lower the site average. That doesn't change the fact that the average is high because of inflated reviews given to *good* videos, not to bad ones.

We're punishing the people who don't get ops because we like to give the 'better than average' vids straight tens (when they should be getting 7-8s).

I don't think you should go to the bottom to fix a problem that starts on the top. If we give lots of low reviews to bad videos, that won't stop the average from being high - the good videos will continue to get overly high reviews - and since they get a lot more reviews than any other video, the average of *their* scores is what has weight on the overall site average.

Now...if you plan to flood every bad video with low scores, say...4000 per year, you can lower the site average by 2 points in each category. That's assuming people give out straight 1s to these 'mediocre and bad' videos. If you're only doing 4s and 5s, you'll need a lot more reviews.

Personally, I can't imagine you finding enough people to give that many low reviews on a yearly basis. And it would have to be a lot of reviews all the time - otherwise the inflated 'all 10s' wouldn't be affected at all by this project.

Statistically, that's a sure-fired plan to lower the overall average. But don't forget you're planning to flood flesh and blood creators with low reviews - not because you want to help them improve, but because you don't like the numbers on the overall chart (which has nothing to do with the poor/mediocre creators, since they don't get reviews anyway).

[AMV_4000]

Blah
Blah
Blah
...4000 per year

thats quite a good point, i may not have read anything you wrote but i concur, 4000 per year!

thats how all of my all 10 ops got on the org *thats why euphoria is still up there.. and thats why most of the vids that are up there are up there...*

soon, the top video will be.. A Field Trip!

(boobies... wow...)

[James Sharp]

I always give honest opps..and the standards for my opps come from my experience level comparison. so as i get better. i give "better" more detailed opps. but my scores i give have come down considerably.

[James Sharp]

and secondly a huge problem lies in the fact that there are alot of first time amv makers out there that either get great scores because its there first time and people dont wanna sound like dicks. or they have there friends give there shitty little video straight tens. i will see a vid with one or two opps. and a score of like 9.5.. and i will think wow a diamond in the rough. but all that it really is is a peice of shit that some jackoff made because he saw his friends do it. Then they get pissed off and bitch you out because you gave them generous 5's and 6's... by no means do i consider myself a good amv maker.. but least i put the effort into making somthing thats not a pile of steaming crap.


I think i may have just vented there for a sec... i feel better

[BasharOfTheAges]

My main problem is the focus (attack) on mediocre and bad videos. Yes, that is the quickest way to lower the site average. That doesn't change the fact that the average is high because of inflated reviews given to *good* videos, not to bad ones.

The thing is.. I am asking people to op random videos. Statistically, if enough random videos are given honest opinions (ones that are honest in score and helpful to the creators) it should help with the average.

I'm not saying that the majority of videos here suck. But i don't think the majority of the videos here are deserving of the high averages. It makes people who recieve average marks for an average video seem, well... far less than average.

I'm not suggesting that people look for bad videos with the intent of ripping the creator a new one, but to instead chose enough random videos that, by the statistical facts that are in place here, they will op videos that are not great. A fair amount of them, in fact.

[Kaiba57]

Why don't we just change the averarage score to be a 7 instead of a 5 I believe that this would make it a lot easier for everyone. I mean that a lot of people aready op so that a 7 is somewhat average, and insteading of asking the majority of the org change the way they op, I think that it would be better to just to change the average instead.

[James Sharp]

well good point. but i think if they were to do that it would bring down some of the really "great" vids.. and people dont give honest opps in the first place. and that would not stop it. that just means that normaly someone gives a video an 8 when it deserves a 5. with that method they would just give it a 10 if the average was changed to 7...does that make any sense??

[Arigatomina]

The thing is.. I am asking people to op random videos. Statistically, if enough random videos are given honest opinions (ones that are honest in score and helpful to the creators) it should help with the average.

I'd definitely support that. The only problem with that would be getting people to leave reviews, especially the people who typically leave 'strict' reviews. Most of the ones I've received reviews from are people who spend an hour or more per review. You can't expect them to review as often as other people would.

My main problem with your post was this line:

So, my idea sprang from this conjecture: "What if a lot of honest people started leaving a lot of honest opinions for a lot of these mediocre and bad videos?"

A random sample may include the videos being inflated (the rare good and excellent videos, only a fraction of the total vids here if you glance at the top 10 list). But most will be the ones you've listed - the mediocre and bad.

[Arigatomina]

...that just means that normaly someone gives a video an 8 when it deserves a 5. with that method they would just give it a 10 if the average was changed to 7...does that make any sense??

Makes perfect sense to me. I did an experiment when they changed the top 10 list to use 8 as average (comparing scores to the inflated 'overall' score). I raised almost all my reviews by 1 point (it *should* had been 2 points according to the 'average', but I wanted to stay a little stricter than that). The result? My reviews that were close mixes of 9s and 10s were suddenly all equal. And the overall average on the site raised by about .13 in all categories (I'd changed over 350 reviews, so it had a visible effect). I didn't like it, and neither did the creators I'd originally given the reviews to. I changed them back a week later.

My point - the website already uses 8 = average for ranking the top 10 list. So if you like 7 and 8 being average, you're already getting what you want. Just hope those who still use 5 as average don't go adjusting their reviews to fit the 'norm.' It really screws with the overall average and makes it impossible to rank high quality videos - anything over an 8 now would be equal at a 10 max.

I think it's better to support lowering the average, than raising the 'low-scoring' reviewers to fit the norm.

[Al'x]

I really don't see why there are a few people that have to keep all their given op scores averaging at 5.5, and where most people give a 10, they only give a 8. You aren't helping anybody! You are just making the person you gave an op to wish that somebody who scores like most people do had left an op instead of somebody who thinks leaving all low scores will somehow help this site. If you leave scores which reflect the site average, whoever you gave an op to will appreciate the opinion more. Even if 5.5=average scores does help the site if everybody does it, in reality this doesn't actually help since there will always be people who give 8=average scores.

[BasharOfTheAges]

I really don't see why there are a few people that have to keep all their given op scores averaging at 5.5, and where most people give a 10, they only give a 8. You aren't helping anybody! You are just making the person you gave an op to wish that somebody who scores like most people do had left an op instead of somebody who thinks leaving all low scores will somehow help this site. If you leave scores which reflect the site average, whoever you gave an op to will appreciate the opinion more. Even if 5.5=average scores does help the site if everybody does it, in reality this doesn't actually help since there will always be people who give 8=average scores.

A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step...