Wildercon 2004 AMV Contest

This forum is for the announcement and discussion of anime music video contests.

Postby DrngdKreationz » Tue Jul 06, 2004 1:13 am

I guess me and you just have different Ideas of what the word "skill" is. :D
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Postby SD-Chan » Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:10 am

DrngdKreationz wrote:I guess me and you just have different Ideas of what the word "skill" is. :D


If people didn't have differing opinions, could you imagine how boring the world would be! :lol:
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Postby Joykiller » Wed Jul 07, 2004 1:36 am

SD-Chan wrote:
DrngdKreationz wrote:I guess me and you just have different Ideas of what the word "skill" is. :D


If people didn't have differing opinions, could you imagine how boring the world would be! :lol:


I don't know about opinions, but I know that if all every vid on this site had was crossfades and dissolves, etc. that that would be boring as shit.

I think that you are worried that amaturs might get their asses handed to them by someone that can do a bit more then a crossdisolve, so you are sheltering them.

*YOU* are the real minority here. Look at the top 10%. Care to count the vids that offer a bit more then fades to black? Don't bother. They are the majority there I assure you.

To summarise, you're a total retard and might want to re-evaluate how fucking pussified you are.

Please die alot.
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Postby Bakadeshi [AuN Studios] » Wed Jul 07, 2004 1:51 am

Joykiller wrote:
SD-Chan wrote:
DrngdKreationz wrote:I guess me and you just have different Ideas of what the word "skill" is. :D


If people didn't have differing opinions, could you imagine how boring the world would be! :lol:


I don't know about opinions, but I know that if all every vid on this site had was crossfades and dissolves, etc. that that would be boring as shit.

I think that you are worried that amaturs might get their asses handed to them by someone that can do a bit more then a crossdisolve, so you are sheltering them.

*YOU* are the real minority here. Look at the top 10%. Care to count the vids that offer a bit more then fades to black? Don't bother. They are the majority there I assure you.

To summarise, you're a total retard and might want to re-evaluate how fucking pussified you are.

Please die alot.


actually, Fluxmiester's videos for the most part disprove this. He is an example of an editor that can make a winning vid with little to no special effects in it besides simple fades, desolves and croping. Take Souls of Rage and sorrow for instance ^_^

As I always say, use effects where it helps, and leave them out where it will just detract. seems the top 10% voters for the most part agree with me on this.

on topic, I may have a video for this. one of my vids are pure simple edits with no real effects.
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Postby SD-Chan » Wed Jul 07, 2004 3:34 am

Joykiller wrote:I don't know about opinions, but I know that if all every vid on this site had was crossfades and dissolves, etc. that that would be boring as shit.

Agreed and I never said that all videos should only have simple cutting effects. Please fully read a person's post before getting on a high moral kilter :)
Also the rules for the 'Pure'category don't even allow crossfades & dissolves... we're talking REAL basic here ^_^.
If you'd been to the site you'd have seen that it states "The video track cannot have undergone any post-production effects or been altered from it's original state." You can use the cross fades or dissolves that arre already in the anime, but you can't create your own. As such that's why making a truly great video seems difficult to impossible, and is probably what discourages most people from entering...

Joykiller wrote:I think that you are worried that amaturs might get their asses handed to them by someone that can do a bit more then a crossdisolve, so you are sheltering them.


Or maybe it's to show people that effects do not make a video, and if you don't ignore the very basics you can create a great video :D(After all, name any sports personality that got to the top of their game by ignoring the basics of their training?)

Joykiller wrote:*YOU* are the real minority here. Look at the top 10%. Care to count the vids that offer a bit more then fades to black? Don't bother. They are the majority there I assure you.


I never said my opinion was in the majority, nor did i EVER claim that this was the correct way to make videos. I was asked why this was about skill, and I've said my reasons, if everyone's on a level playing field, be they beginner, experienced or hardcore, then surely their natural talent will shine through and not be hampered by the fact that certain people find effects hard to integrate.

Joykiller wrote:To summarise, you're a total retard and might want to re-evaluate how fucking pussified you are.

Please die alot.

By resorting to this kind of language it means only two things to me.

1. You're scared of the fact that if you had to only use basic editing, you'd look alot sloppier than you think.

2. You really want attention from people and as such want to troll a perfectly civil discussion and turn it into an arguement... (If it's this option then I apologise to evryone else on the boad for responding, as i'm sure this'll only fuel your fire.)

Oh and Bakadeshi, thanks very much for reaffirming to me that there are people out there who get what I mean. Nice to know i'm not totally alone :D

On Topic:

Hope to see your video Bakadeshi, would be nice to have another entry from the pure category ^_^
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Postby Joykiller » Wed Jul 07, 2004 10:24 am

This is going to be long.....

1st off: Bakadeshi, You know that I value your opinions. That should go without saying. However Fluxmiester's videos are, in my opinion, the exception not the standard. Regardless of that, what you are saying is what I (in my own way) am saying. A video should not be discriminated against for the type or amount of effects that are used, but instead for it's content and character.

It's naive and irritating to see people point their fingers at specific aspects of editing and claim that they have the answer to what is perverse and causing the decay of a given concept. I've personally seen countless videos that used no effects what so ever that were absolutely breath taking. I've also seen videos that had gratuitous amounts of effects applied that were equally entertaining.

I don't really have an opinion of someone that just thinks it would be jolly good fun to have a little contest in a certain style just to see what comes up. I do however have thoughts when someone makes outlandish statements such as this:

Over years I have witnessed how parts of the AMV community have become perverted by the overuse of effects packages


You don't feel like perhaps you are over simplifying the problem a bit here? Why not just have the gall to call it what it REALLY is. Shit editing plain and simple. Over the years I have seen alot of shit editing. I can deal with that. Saying that the community has become perverted via effects packages is analogous to me to the people that claim that Disney World is responsible for the moral decay of today's society. It's just a bizarre and abstract connection in my eyes. You don't seem to be against effects. You seem to be against people that use effects to attempt to sweep a shitty video under a nicer looking rug. Welcome to the club pal. No one likes a video that has a shit foundation and a bunch of nonsensical bling bling to boot. It doesn't make you "old school" or "grass roots" or fundamental or whatever to dislike an over glorified video with no substance. It makes you just like pretty much everyone else. The way that you choose to focus your disgust for said videos is how you are truly different from everyone else. Despite what I am assuming to be your most valiant of efforts, you've made yourself out to be more of an elitist then connoisseur. You are no longer stating a simple preference, but are instead (intentionally or not) attacking a broad variety of people that do not necessarily feel as strongly about this as you do. How? If you want to state that effects packages are perverting the community, then I would assume that you are implying the distributors of effects laden works to be spreading perversion. Nothing like making people feel like shit to get them to side with you 'eh?

SD-Chan wrote:Also the rules for the 'Pure'category don't even allow crossfades & dissolves... we're talking REAL basic here ^_^.

If you'd been to the site you'd have seen that it states "The video track cannot have undergone any post-production effects or been altered from it's original state." You can use the cross fades or dissolves that are already in the anime, but you can't create your own. As such that's why making a truly great video seems difficult to impossible, and is probably what discourages most people from entering...


You are 100% correct. I should have taken the time to view you page before hand. That said I would like to state that my opinion of your contest has immediately degraded exponentially due to your enlightenment.

SD-Chan wrote:Or maybe it's to show people that effects do not make a video, and if you don't ignore the very basics you can create a great video :D(After all, name any sports personality that got to the top of their game by ignoring the basics of their training?)


This statement confuses me to no end. Are you insinuating that it is impossible for a video to have great effects, AND posses elementary editing techniques? And further more are seriously trying to educate people? If so I would like to be the first one to say go fuck yourself for believing that I require you at all to decide what is good. If you truly believe that you would even be helping out 10% of the people that waste their time on you contest by introducing them to something you seem to believe is divine via it's grasp of simplicity, please wake up. It's completely unrealistic to even consider that the vast majority of those who are even in the "community" or whatever would love a effects free video, but just for whatever reason seen one. Almost everyone has seen them. Most have seen considerable amounts of them. I have faith in peoples abilities to form intelligent opinions without someone like yourself taking what is generally accepted as an event of entertainment, ( AMV Contest ) and using it as a device to educate people to the advantages of your personal view points. All that you are truly doing is attempting to limit what people are able to see. Plain and simple. How do you feel you can broaden someone's horizons when in truth you are only showing them half the picture? I find that patronizing.

SD-Chan wrote:The reason that the 'Pure' category is about skill, is because you have to demonstrate the very basics of editing


So a being able to show you the basics of something is a demonstration of my mastery? I don't even know what to think about such an insolent statement.

SD-Chan wrote:if everyone's on a level playing field, be they beginner, experienced or hardcore, then surely their natural talent will shine through and not be hampered by the fact that certain people find effects hard to integrate.


Here is another thought provoking statement. 'The fact that certain people find effects fard to integrate' has never really hampered anything I have done. In fact the fact that certain people do damn near anything has never been a factor in what *I* do. The truth is that everyone is already on a level playing field here. In reality, if anyone has 'skill' then they can deliver their vision regardless of what program they use. Even if they have to resort to a really cheap editor AND MSPAINT! :0 It's fine to dream that you are leveling the playing field. But in reality, you might be doing the exact opposite.

SD-Chan wrote:
Joykiller wrote:To summarise, you're a total retard and might want to re-evaluate how fucking pussified you are.

Please die alot.

By resorting to this kind of language it means only two things to me.

1. You're scared of the fact that if you had to only use basic editing, you'd look alot sloppier than you think.

2. You really want attention from people and as such want to troll a perfectly civil discussion and turn it into an arguement... (If it's this option then I apologise to evryone else on the boad for responding, as i'm sure this'll only fuel your fire.)


Why would my own fears have anything to do with this? I'm not entering your contest regardless.... And the day this hobby and the possibilities within it start to frighten me is the day I stop altogether. As for attention, I could care less. Of anyone that I may want attention from, you sir are rather low on the list.

SD-Chan wrote:Nice to know i'm not totally alone :D

The fact that you even question this is a sign that maybe what you are doing isn't necessarily 'good for the gander'.

Just a few one other thing that I thought might help you in the future:

SD-Chan wrote:Also, i'm sure many of you have seen that there is also a faction of people out there that get their hands on a copy of after-effects and then damage their video with unneccessary effects, much to their own downfall.


dictionary.com wrote:fac·tion - A group of persons forming a cohesive, usually contentious minority within a larger group.


Are you saying there is a conspiracy here? Or did you just make your best attempt to sound semi-intelligent by using words you don't understand and fail?
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Postby WilLoW :--) » Wed Jul 07, 2004 11:41 am

JoyKiller, why don't you go play somewhere else ? If you don't like that contest don't post in its thread. :?
You can see the "pure" category as a reference to the old editing techniques with VCRs... a kind of tribute...at least that's how I see it.

Back on the topic, any update on the number of participants in all categories ?
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Postby Joykiller » Wed Jul 07, 2004 12:38 pm

WilLoW :--) wrote:JoyKiller, why don't you go play somewhere else ?


You know... That actually kind of hurt my feelings.

I'll admit that I started off in here being a dick, but I was actually trying to have a halfway intellegent debate with my last post.

But if that is how you feel WilLoW out of respect for you, I'll leave the thread alone.

Sorry for bothering you.

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Postby erato » Wed Jul 07, 2004 12:59 pm

Whoa! that was kinda scary. ¬_¬

Lucky i can still sit on the fence safely. Phew . . . -.-
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Postby Suzuki_Akira » Wed Jul 07, 2004 3:10 pm

Well that was enlightening...
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Postby Bakadeshi [AuN Studios] » Wed Jul 07, 2004 8:48 pm

Joykiller wrote:
WilLoW :--) wrote:JoyKiller, why don't you go play somewhere else ?


You know... That actually kind of hurt my feelings.

I'll admit that I started off in here being a dick, but I was actually trying to have a halfway intellegent debate with my last post.

But if that is how you feel WilLoW out of respect for you, I'll leave the thread alone.

Sorry for bothering you.

-Drew


Yea... I think you went a little over the top too, but I've come to expect that from you as how you are, so it doesn't realy bother me much.


However....
SD-Chan wrote:
Also the rules for the 'Pure'category don't even allow crossfades & dissolves... we're talking REAL basic here ^_^.

If you'd been to the site you'd have seen that it states "The video track cannot have undergone any post-production effects or been altered from it's original state." You can use the cross fades or dissolves that are already in the anime, but you can't create your own. As such that's why making a truly great video seems difficult to impossible, and is probably what discourages most people from entering...


Well scratch that idea of entering my AMV.... ALL of my videos have some use of crossfade. Even though its done purely by adjusting Opacity band, no actuall Transistions or Effects from Premeires presets, were used in the vid I was going to enter. I also use photoshop images. Awell. I guess to avoid confusion, and debates from Joykiller, You should have probably named it something like what WIllow said, the VCR method, or described it as such. Limited only to what you have available when editing using the two VCR method.

Also I went to the site and didn't see the rules, only the entry form. perhaps a link to the rules on the entry form would be nice. We shouldn't have to hunt for them, because most people won't. gotta keep the lazy bums and the idiots in mind too to eliviate possible future frustrations when designing these things ;p :lol:
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Postby DrngdKreationz » Wed Jul 07, 2004 9:24 pm

Yeah I would have to agree the 2 VCR or "Retro-style" AMV would have been better. and Not said as much along the lines of the Highest "skill" maybe then I might have said you know what.. .That sounds like it could be fun. Give me a break from doing the crazy shit i do all the time. and just have good clean fun...

(slight off topic spam)
U know one of these days im gonna put what I wrote in my journal to the test. heres a cliff not blurb. (take a 1 dvd source, 1 audio CD (or just 3-or 4 songs) . 10-20 editors. give 75 percent the 2VCR method (not even fades) and the other 25 have no limit to what they can do and then take a survey of the difference between the 2 groups.

I'll just take a quick survey via PM (no need to spam this thread) if anyone would be interested in participating in something like this
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Postby SD-Chan » Thu Jul 08, 2004 5:03 am

Wow....

This is what happens when i ignore a thread for half a day...

OK, first of all I'd like to apologise for my views or opinions inciting a potential off-topic arguement. It was never my intention and I'm sorry that I may hev put people in positions they didn't feel comfortable with.

Also I'm sorry that you don't wish to enter the contest JoyKiller, even into one of the standard categories, and I hope there are no hard feelings.

WilLoW has got the feeling I wanted to express for the 'Pure' Category down, but because the original debate I'd had with my friends and cohorts came from a different angle, I didn't think of explaining it as and old-style VCR2VCR challenge.
I used to edit vids and projects form when I cut 8mm at the school lab, so I should have realised that the feeling I wanted to portray was more along those lines than the tack it had eventually evolved from.
Once again, my apologies :)

Back onto Topic:

I've got about 15 registrations now, whihc I'll post the usernames of by about 11pm (GMT). I very grateful to everone who's entered and I'm impressed with the diversity of both anime and styles of music :D

I'd given directions to the event info before, but here's a direct link (should have done this really ^_^)
wilderAMV Rules & Registration
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Postby OtakuForLife » Fri Jul 09, 2004 11:23 pm

For the pure catagorey can I send in this one.
All the effects are from the show and I reverse speed once.

http://www.animemusicvideos.org/members ... hp?v=28749
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Postby OtakuForLife » Fri Jul 09, 2004 11:25 pm

lol , I sent you that one for the contest anyway :)
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