Instrumental Anime Project

This forum is for the announcement, organisation and discussion of Multi-Editor AMV Projects.

Postby Otohiko » Mon Apr 26, 2004 10:07 pm

Well, I'm certainly not one to approach on deadlines :roll:

I'd like to see it sooner rather than later, seeing how I already have 2 videos in it :P Though I will be taking my sweet time with the next one, probably - when I do start it.

Speaking of which, uploaded the song to FTP. Non-Bebop and Specific-Bebop suggestions welcome. As much as I'd like to stay away from CB for this, even for visual and story-related consideration, it's the closest thing to match this sort of music. I already have a few wacky ideas for possible graphical quirks I might do with it :P

Anyway, we'll see. Waiting for further guidance and uploaded material to look at...
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Postby jasper-isis » Mon Apr 26, 2004 10:46 pm

For accompanying jazz, Gunsmith Cats might be a good alternative to Cowboy Bebop. Its opening sequence is one of the classiest I've ever seen.
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Postby Otohiko » Mon Apr 26, 2004 10:53 pm

Well, my thing is that it's not entirely jazz, more jazz-rock. Plus it has a kind of structure which lends itself to an epic sort of visual plot - thus another reason I lean to Bebop here.

We'll see. I'm real broke now :roll: But if I shake my friends well, they might come up with some unexpected stuff. Granted, I'm all for a Bebop vid in this - but it'd be nice if I considered all alternatives first. Another series which might have worked is Hellsing, but it doesn't have the kind of athmosphere I'm looking for. :roll:
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Postby rose4emily » Mon Apr 26, 2004 11:04 pm

Anubsx: you can't upload to the Songs folder, you have to upload to the Inbox. I essentially do this to keep people from accidentally overwriting what's already up there and to have some small measure of controll over what's coming into and going out of my computer.

The wildly variable upload and download speeds are probably a function of the bandwidth traffic on my node on the network. It seem to me that my connection slows down quite a bit every time someone opens a LAN party on the floor - but maybe I'm just going crazy as a side effect of sharing a room with someone who usually has hockey on the television and computer at the same time and having to listen to both the real and fake game simultaniously.

There is no set deadline or project length largely because we still have yet to see what most of the people who have contected me on joining this project are going to produce (if anything), because we all have to set this aside for a while thanks to finals and such, and because I don't want to turn away or rush a potentially awesome video over a prematurely set deadline. That all said, I'm thinking that late June or early July might be a good time, giving all university people a month out of school and the high school folks at least a week. The length of the project is going to be determined by the amount of submitted material. If by some freak jump in editing productivity we end up with three hours of usable footage, we'll use three hours of footage. I do think it'd probably make sense to split this into two or three volumes if much more than an hour comes in, lending some consideration to people who don't want to download a gigabyte block of video from my unpredictable and occasionally slow server.

I think I've answered that last question about a dozen times by now. Too bad these forum threads can't have their own FAQ, because reading 200+ posts would really be a bit much for anyone who didn't join the project at its inception, yet the repeated questions kinda puff it out even more.
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Postby ooshna » Mon Apr 26, 2004 11:32 pm

Lmao a 3hour amv man talk about a long download
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Postby pen-pen2002 » Tue Apr 27, 2004 12:24 am

ooshna wrote:I am going to do Schizm using Akira I have alot of ideas in my head and hopefully I can get them to work out well tonight I will convert the dvd to divx.

I wouldn't use DivX for that if I were you. It's not an editing codec so you'll have trouble with frame specific editing. Also it erases a lot of data and you will have to compress twice so your final quality will be kind of crappy. Check the guides and your AMV will turn out much better in the end.

anubisx00 - It sounds fine to me as the vocals are choral in nature. An interesting addition actually, not to mention a very nice song.

aznRAVEr - Is a boy I knew a finished piece? It's in the in-progress folder and I was wondering if you were considering tweaking it. I know you want to start something new but I'd be happy to give you my oppinion if you want it.

Otohiko - You can never have to many dark AMV's. *looks at list of favorite anime* wait, I'm seeing a pattern here. I'm curios about this new song but I can find it on my collage server :x You not completly alone in your musical taste though. 7 people had about 10 KC songs each. :P
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Postby downwithpants » Tue Apr 27, 2004 12:42 am

ok, i redid the timings and it looks like i have an huffy that matches a sped up version of clair de lune. i'm just trying out avs filters that will clean up the footage now. msharpen seems to work well, and i'm trying to figure out some others.

but now i gotta get back to homework. which i so wisely pushed back to fix my video. :(
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Postby rose4emily » Tue Apr 27, 2004 1:27 am

Pen-Pen/AznRaver: Yeah, it's hard to tell if someone's 'done' with a video or not, so I put them in the W.I.P. folder until I hear otherwise. It's always possible that someone (Otohiko) will want to do a few remasters and little tweaks to enhance a video that very well could be considered complete already.

BTW - Pen-Pen, I just remembered that you owe me an op on "Flying Motionless Above the Waves". I think I'll let it slide, though, seeing as how you say you've been sucked into some big multi-editor project that really cut down on your reviewing time. :)

DownWithPants: If the Huffman works, great. I don't think anyone will detect any pitch difference from a slight pace-change of a song, so I'd suggest using a non-pitch-preserving method of slowing the piece to avoid all sorts of ugly fourier artifacts (the same things that cause the funny overtones on piano notes and cymbals in mp3 files).

Ooshna: I'd personally suggest editing in Huffman or a PNG sequence, depending on your tools and process. I'm quickly becoming a fan of the PNG sequence, because it allows for text-based editing of the microtiming and all sorts of single-frame painting control (great for remastering the DivX source I am myself stuck with using for time being), but the Huffman codec puts the whole thing in one easily managed file as opposed to several thousand, so each has its advantages. If you can't get your DVDs to rip directly into one of these lossless formats with the tools you have, make a REALLY high quality DivX and then convert it to a lossless codec before doing any edits, as most compositing situations (including fade transitions) and effects require not one but two or more re-encodings in a lot of video editors if you are editing using compressed media as source, and each re-encoding contributes to a cumulative loss of data like a video equivalent of radioactive decay.

If the project is really long, it'll be made into a set of files. Imagine trying to get the A&E production of "Pride and Prejudice" (or all three "Lord of the Rings" films, for those who aren't Jane Austin fans) on a single disc or tape - just wouldn't happen. Same thing with this - no single file larger than a CD will be created.
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Postby ooshna » Tue Apr 27, 2004 6:38 am

Ok I have the video converted to two 600mb files compressed with divx I'll use virtualdub and convert it to huffman and then use that as the file to edit the only problem I have is render time. How will using this codec effect it? I had a really bad time trying to render my techno song getting under 1fps on the rubberbanded parts with divx. What should I aspect with huffman or any lossless codec?
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Postby ooshna » Tue Apr 27, 2004 6:43 am

Nevermind I do not have the disk space for using huffy. One half of Akira will take 15GB, until I get a a new drive I'll have to stick with divx.
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Postby Otohiko » Tue Apr 27, 2004 9:02 am

pen-pen2002 wrote: I'm curios about this new song but I can find it on my collage server :x


It's sitting in the inbox - makes me wonder when it'll get moved :roll:

ooshna - well, editing divx is by far NOT a good idea, but if you don't have space for huffYUV, have you considered AVS editing? Or are you using a program other than premiere?

Generally, AVS editing is ideal in terms of space-to-quality-to-speed ratio - unless you're bold enough to do bait-and-switch...

If I work with a longer series though, I might go back to my HuffYUV methods - helps me concentrate. I have serious problems finding what I need and getting distracted when I have too much to work with.

***

FAQ - maybe that should be tacked on to the project page? Would probably help.

Actually, this thread already seems like a whole forum in itself :roll:
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Postby pen-pen2002 » Tue Apr 27, 2004 9:15 am

Jasper-Isis - The video makes a lot more sense to me now. The story is very complicated so you won't get across details but you conveyed the spirit of it. You could try to make it more obvios somehow that theyre trying to get maried or you could put something in at the very end to show she's still alive (I wasn't sure.) But I kind of like the confution of the second half. It really adds to the drama. So it depends on wether you want "Oh my god that was scary" or "man that's tragic" you might have both depending on wether they've seen the series. Maybe I should check it out. I thought it looked happy and fluffy, but if there's more stuff like that I might be interested.

ooshna wrote:Nevermind I do not have the disk space for using huffy. One half of Akira will take 15GB, until I get a a new drive I'll have to stick with divx.

Ha! I export with the original high quality VOB's and my hard drive is only 18 gigs! Here's how: You rip your DVD useing DVDdecrypter (or pieces of one if your low on space.) It should only be around 6 GB or so for a full DVD. Do you have more than one? If so find just the VOB's (1 GB each) that cotain the movie and get rid of any special features. then create a DVD2AVI project file (less than a megabyte) and create an avisynth script for that that remove interlacing if needed and does whatever other pre proccesing you want. Open it in Vdub and make a compressed version using a codec that has every frame as a keyframe (NOT DivX) PICvideoMJPEG is best. put quality at 5 or 6. Once you have done this you can delete the VOB's (saving all that space.) Once you have done this for all your source you make a music video with the compressed avi (it will look crappy) when your done, or if you want a WIP :wink: just re rip the dvds to the same folder and substitute the Avisyth file for the AVI in premire (or whatever you use.) Viola! Wonderful quality and you hardy even need to make preview renders because the editing is nearly realtime. Hope that helps. This is the bait and switch Otohiko refered to, and it works perfectly.

See guides for details.
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Postby ooshna » Tue Apr 27, 2004 9:59 am

pen-pen2002 wrote: Wonderful quality and you hardy even need to make preview renders because the editing is nearly realtime.
See guides for details.


Orgasm

I'll try that out I hate rendering so much. I am uploading what I got done with my divx source its only like 30 secs but can someone tell me if it looks ok?
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Postby Otohiko » Tue Apr 27, 2004 10:02 am

Sure... just as soon as rose4emily moves it to the outbox.

Bait-and-switch does sound very attractive. I just tend not to trust technology, so I avoid it, fearing that I screw up :P
But, as I did with AVS editing, I'll probly get around to it one day.

And, if you want the official guide description of how to do bait-and-switch, go here:

http://www.animemusicvideos.org/guides/ ... etb.html#3
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Postby rose4emily » Tue Apr 27, 2004 10:41 am

Files moved, permissions set.

Concerning the "A Boy I Knew" video: why the black border? Is that just a side effect of the tools or process it was made with, or is it intentional? Since it's on all sides it seems to me to be something of a waste of screen and file space that could be filled by the actual picture in the video.

It does also make me wonder about the .wav vs .mp3 audio for these videos. Normally, you'd want to use .mp3 for wider playback availability and better compression, but where we have to stitch these together, the .wav starts to make sense. I know that some of us are limited in our choice of video codec, but I think the .wav/.mp3 option is pretty universal, so we might want to call a standard on it. Any opinions?

I'm still rooting for editing a .png sequence (about 1GiB for the 13+ minutes of footage in ThirdStone) myself - the picture stays really clean, the extra editing power is incredable, and there's no way to be more frame-specific than storing each frame in a separate file. It's not really something you would rip to, but it's a great way to work with the video after cutting the clips you plan to use out of your original source. Then again, maybe the real reason I like it so much is that I can rearrange, re-use, and skip over them by editing a text file instead of messing with an actual video editor every time I want to make a three-frame edit. Kinda like avoiding code builders and WYSIWYG(sort of) web design packages.
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