Been Working On New Script. Need Minor Help. B&A Images Inc.

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Been Working On New Script. Need Minor Help. B&A Images Inc.

Postby TwilightChrono » Tue Oct 25, 2011 9:27 pm

Alright, guys. I've been working on a new script for Birdy The Mighty: Double Trouble. Note that it is NOT Birdy The Mighty: Decode. This is the original series. I've pretty much got every I want to do with this source fixed, except one tiny problem.

The colors look really faded. Like, faded, washed out. I would like the colors to be richer, bolder, brighter. I don't know if this is possible, but I would really like help in this and to know if this is at all possible to do without a sat/bright tweak adjust.

I'll also post my script below the images.

Before Cleaning Image:

Image

After Cleaning Image:

Image

Sorry, I couldn't make the second image bigger, still learning this thing.

Here is my script so far:
Code: Select all
MPEG2Source("G:\Birdy The Mighty 1\Combined Footage.d2v", cpu=0)
AMVIVTC(mode=2)
TemporalDegrain()
aWarpSharp2(depth=16)
DeRainbow(10)
Crop(14, 0, -6, -0)
LanczosResize(848, 656)
Crop(0, 88, -0, -88)


As you can see though, the image looks a ton better after the clean, but the colors.........I just want them, richer, bolder and brighter. Like I said, this is what I need the help with.

Thanks for any help I receive.
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Re: Been Working On New Script. Need Minor Help. B&A Images

Postby Scintilla » Wed Oct 26, 2011 6:44 am

TwilightChrono wrote:The colors look really faded. Like, faded, washed out. I would like the colors to be richer, bolder, brighter. I don't know if this is possible, but I would really like help in this and to know if this is at all possible to do without a sat/bright tweak adjust.

Sounds to me like a Tweak adjust is exactly what you're looking for. Why would you like to avoid it?

Also, does it still look that faded on your television set? Compared to other animé DVDs? If not, then you probably don't need to tweak it at all (especially if you ever plan to send whatever video you're working on to conventions).
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Re: Been Working On New Script. Need Minor Help. B&A Images

Postby BasharOfTheAges » Wed Oct 26, 2011 7:23 am

Any reason you chose to use functions like LanczosResize that have been, essentially, deprecated years ago?
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Re: Been Working On New Script. Need Minor Help. B&A Images

Postby CodeZTM » Wed Oct 26, 2011 7:34 am

BasharOfTheAges wrote:Any reason you chose to use functions like LanczosResize that have been, essentially, deprecated years ago?


Since when has LanczosResize been outdated? It's the standard thing that AVSp utilizes in its resize calculator. Unless we're talking about Lanczos4Resize() instead as the better alternative, and in that regard, why not just tell him that instead?
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Re: Been Working On New Script. Need Minor Help. B&A Images

Postby BasharOfTheAges » Wed Oct 26, 2011 10:47 am

CodeZTM wrote:
BasharOfTheAges wrote:Any reason you chose to use functions like LanczosResize that have been, essentially, deprecated years ago?


Since when has LanczosResize been outdated? It's the standard thing that AVSp utilizes in its resize calculator. Unless we're talking about Lanczos4Resize() instead as the better alternative, and in that regard, why not just tell him that instead?

Or one of the Spline options since it seems to be up-scaling the footage.

People can choose to do things for many reasons - The same google I used to find threads on doom9 about comparing functions work just as well for anyone else, so it isn't for lack of information on the subject - I'm not here to judge, just to inquire. That reasoning might influence the suggestion of other functions.
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Re: Been Working On New Script. Need Minor Help. B&A Images

Postby mirkosp » Wed Oct 26, 2011 2:41 pm

CodeZTM wrote:Since when has LanczosResize been outdated? It's the standard thing that AVSp utilizes in its resize calculator. Unless we're talking about Lanczos4Resize() instead as the better alternative, and in that regard, why not just tell him that instead?

It should have been outdated since at least when avs 2.5.8 was out, since spline36resize is just MUCH better (better than lanczos4 too). Spline resizers are pretty much as sharp as the direct lanczos competitors, but with a lot less ringing and border artifacts, hence why they are generally the best option, especially for downscaling. On specific sources using bicubic could be better for downsizing, and using nnedi+some sharpener is probably a better choice for big upsampling, but still...
...nowadays everybody should just use resamplehq anyway, and at most specify the kernel internally (the default one in this plugin is spline36, by the way).
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Re: Been Working On New Script. Need Minor Help. B&A Images

Postby TwilightChrono » Wed Oct 26, 2011 4:55 pm

From what I've been reading in the guide, it doesn't look like Levels is what I need for the color. I don't think banding is an issue either.

Well, if I have to do a Tweak do you guys have any recommended settings? When I used it on all my other sources up until now, it was used in conjunction with a bunch of other stuff:

Old Script:
Code: Select all
Mpeg2Source(File Destination)
Telecide(1)
Decimate(5)
Tweak(cont=1.1)
Awarpsharp(12)
Deen("a2d",3,7,9)
Crop(8,58,-8,-58)
LanczosResize(848,480)


I realize now how unorthadox this script really is, thanks to Code and a few of you here on the org. But before you judge, look at what it did for me at one point:

Spoiler :
Image
Image
Image
Image


That's beside the point though I guess. point being for the above statement is that it worked wonders for Inuyasha.

SO, in regards to the tweaking, what do you guys suggest? Or should I just play with it? And yes, when played on a TV they still look faded and washed out.
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Re: Been Working On New Script. Need Minor Help. B&A Images

Postby EvaFan » Wed Oct 26, 2011 5:44 pm

Why not just mess with the saturation settings in tweak untill you like the colors yourself?
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Re: Been Working On New Script. Need Minor Help. B&A Images

Postby TwilightChrono » Thu Oct 27, 2011 12:37 am

EvaFan wrote:Why not just mess with the saturation settings in tweak untill you like the colors yourself?


How would I go about doing this? Messing with the settings?

Tweaking it to 1.0? 1.2?

Still learning.
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Re: Been Working On New Script. Need Minor Help. B&A Images

Postby mirkosp » Thu Oct 27, 2011 6:05 am

I would suggest you to leave colours intact in the lossless and just correct them as they please you while editing. It's a thing if you want to give the video a certain look, but you should do so with more control and limited to the amv. Barring levels errors in the master, you don't want to touch the colours in any way since you don't know how it's meant to look, whereas the paid professional dudes who actually coloured the anime would know about it.
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Re: Been Working On New Script. Need Minor Help. B&A Images

Postby BasharOfTheAges » Thu Oct 27, 2011 6:31 am

TwilightChrono wrote:
EvaFan wrote:Why not just mess with the saturation settings in tweak untill you like the colors yourself?


How would I go about doing this? Messing with the settings?

Tweaking it to 1.0? 1.2?

Still learning.

you do realize that "messing with the settings" really is what the vast majority of people do, right? it's not some mystical knowledge that if you stare just right, comes to you in a flash. It's all just trial and error. Once you have a basic understanding of what types of functions do what, requests like this thread really come off as "i don't want to waste my precious time figuring values out, somebody do it for me" even if that isn't your intention.
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Re: Been Working On New Script. Need Minor Help. B&A Images

Postby EvaFan » Thu Oct 27, 2011 3:28 pm

http://avisynth.org/mediawiki/Tweak

Lazy:
Tweak(hue=x,sat=x,bright=x,cont=x)

If you don't intend to change one of them just take it out.

Example:
Tweak(sat=1.1) increases saturation very slightly. Saturation is 0-10 with 1 being no change and 0 being grayscale.

Brightness and hue have different maximum variables on the positive and negative end and their defaults are 0.0. For example since brightness's maximum is 255, your going to see very little change by increasing it to 0.1 whereas saturations cap is 10 so +.1 is likely still noticeable. IMO you should never have to mess with hue or contrast for anime sources.

Of course you could find all this out by taking a few mins to read http://avisynth.org/mediawiki/Tweak
You can get general help with alot of plugins there.

The only problem with using tweak is that the whole source is effected. If your unsure whether or not this is a good idea just do it in your editing program so you can decide what scenes and when you want it. If your unhappy with how the source looks as a whole then just use tweak.
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Re: Been Working On New Script. Need Minor Help. B&A Images

Postby TwilightChrono » Thu Oct 27, 2011 4:09 pm

BasharOfTheAges wrote:
TwilightChrono wrote:
EvaFan wrote:Why not just mess with the saturation settings in tweak untill you like the colors yourself?


How would I go about doing this? Messing with the settings?

Tweaking it to 1.0? 1.2?

Still learning.

you do realize that "messing with the settings" really is what the vast majority of people do, right? it's not some mystical knowledge that if you stare just right, comes to you in a flash. It's all just trial and error. Once you have a basic understanding of what types of functions do what, requests like this thread really come off as "i don't want to waste my precious time figuring values out, somebody do it for me" even if that isn't your intention.


Like I said I have been reading the guides to do it myself, I'm just confused at how it all works. It's hard for me to get some things. So sometimes further explanations are needed. I'm actually making an attempt to learn this myself, just some help is needed, explanation wise.
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Re: Been Working On New Script. Need Minor Help. B&A Images

Postby Mister Hatt » Sat Oct 29, 2011 4:53 am

Unrelated even tho I think tweak is terrible and that projectors at cons tend to oversaturate if anything so being a bit flatter may give a better result; lanczos was NEVER deprecated or outdated. It is an alternative to spline that, like bilinear/bicubic/sinc/point resize filters, has it's own use case and good reasons for that. Spline filters do give a better result for most footage, but there are most definitely good reasons for lanczos filtering. I also saw that some joker mentioned that lanczos4 is deprecated? I'm not sure if you have any idea where these numbers come from but lanczos itself is an alias to alnczos3, and is roughyl equivalent in samplepoints to spline9, while lanczos4 is equivalent to spline16. Spline filters do give you more sharpness, and less ringing and whatnot, but that doesn't mean the alternatives are old or forgotten. I can think of almost a dozen reasons for most of them.

tl;dr lanczos isn't deprecated, it just doesn't give the result most people want for anime
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Re: Been Working On New Script. Need Minor Help. B&A Images

Postby Enigmo » Wed Feb 15, 2012 1:31 pm

If you really wanna do some advanced color changes I'd just tell you to take it into Vegas or AE.
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