Top Ten

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Top Ten

Postby Oleander » Tue May 25, 2010 5:14 pm

Are the Top 10% videos the current trend in amv creation? I have been a site member for about 7 years and have watched amv's for at least 10 and I have to say the current Top videos are some of the best in regard to technical skill but the worst artistically. I'm not necessarily saying that they are bad videos but I remember when watching an amv would pull at your emotions but now it seems like everyone is just trying to show off with how good they can use their favorite editing program. It has been awhile since I have checked out some new videos and I would like to hear some opinions on this, especially from the old timers.
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Re: Top Ten

Postby BasharOfTheAges » Tue May 25, 2010 5:21 pm

Search this general AMV forum for any thread more than say 5 pages long. about the #AMV-review; Over half of them will be bitching about this very topic in one way or another.

It basically boils down to popular opinion... which is lowest common denominator territory. The average viewer prefers what they perceive as "style" over what's traditionally known as "substance."
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Re: Top Ten

Postby Jwalk0 » Tue May 25, 2010 6:02 pm

BasharOfTheAges wrote: The average viewer prefers what they perceive as "style" over what's traditionally known as "substance."


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Re: Top Ten

Postby NS » Tue May 25, 2010 6:06 pm

Flashy and pretty is the new trend. But there are still some that aren't all about that in there, but those videos are the ones that get the most attention and get on the list.
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Re: Top Ten

Postby Oleander » Tue May 25, 2010 7:28 pm

BasharOfTheAges wrote:Search this general AMV forum for any thread more than say 5 pages long. about the #AMV-review; Over half of them will be bitching about this very topic in one way or another.

It basically boils down to popular opinion... which is lowest common denominator territory. The average viewer prefers what they perceive as "style" over what's traditionally known as "substance."


I guess i should have looked more before posting but that pretty much confirms what i was thinking. Maybe there was just more pressure/influence for quality before.
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Re: Top Ten

Postby dwchang » Tue May 25, 2010 9:34 pm

Oleander wrote:Are the Top 10% videos the current trend in amv creation? I have been a site member for about 7 years and have watched amv's for at least 10 and I have to say the current Top videos are some of the best in regard to technical skill but the worst artistically. I'm not necessarily saying that they are bad videos but I remember when watching an amv would pull at your emotions but now it seems like everyone is just trying to show off with how good they can use their favorite editing program. It has been awhile since I have checked out some new videos and I would like to hear some opinions on this, especially from the old timers.


One thing to note is that by default the "Top 10%" is only the top 10% for the current year. You have to manually hit the "All years" link at the top to get the true top 10%. That might be a reason for your confusion. I know I was at first.

Anyway given how rare ops are nowadays, the lists are pretty irrelevant now. It doesn't take that many ops to even break the list lately. Star rating is probably a better gauge of current AMVs. That said, the "true" Top 10% I agree with moreso than the current, but that might have to do with watching very few AMVs lately and also agreeing with your point regarding the trends.
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Re: Top Ten

Postby Oleander » Tue May 25, 2010 9:40 pm

dwchang wrote:
Oleander wrote:Are the Top 10% videos the current trend in amv creation? I have been a site member for about 7 years and have watched amv's for at least 10 and I have to say the current Top videos are some of the best in regard to technical skill but the worst artistically. I'm not necessarily saying that they are bad videos but I remember when watching an amv would pull at your emotions but now it seems like everyone is just trying to show off with how good they can use their favorite editing program. It has been awhile since I have checked out some new videos and I would like to hear some opinions on this, especially from the old timers.


One thing to note is that by default the "Top 10%" is only the top 10% for the current year. You have to manually hit the "All years" link at the top to get the true top 10%. That might be a reason for your confusion. I know I was at first.

Anyway given how rare ops are nowadays, the lists are pretty irrelevant now. It doesn't take that many ops to even break the list lately. Star rating is probably a better gauge of current AMVs. That said, the "true" Top 10% I agree with moreso than the current, but that might have to do with watching very few AMVs lately and also agreeing with your point regarding the trends.


Thanks for the tip, thats much better.
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Re: Top Ten

Postby Phantasmagoriat » Tue May 25, 2010 9:41 pm

Part of it has to do with the belief that hard work should be rewarded. If you watch a video that has a weak concept... but you can tell the editor put a lot of effort into it... chances are you will rate it higher. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with that [I'll leave that up to you to decide] but it probably results in an overall boost in ratings for said videos.
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Re: Top Ten

Postby godix » Tue May 25, 2010 11:29 pm

Phantasmagoriat wrote:Part of it has to do with the belief that hard work should be rewarded.

If you spend two months working out a really difficult turd, one of those turds that feels like you're pushing concrete out your ass, the end result is STILL a huge pile of steaming crap.
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Re: Top Ten

Postby Phantasmagoriat » Wed May 26, 2010 12:00 am

godix wrote:If you spend two months working out a really difficult turd, one of those turds that feels like you're pushing concrete out your ass, the end result is STILL a huge pile of steaming crap.
Yes, but once it's out you will hear the sound of trumpet blasts. People will clap and applaud you. You'll get your gold stars, and a nice pat on the back.
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Re: Top Ten

Postby JudgeHolden » Wed May 26, 2010 12:14 am

Phantasmagoriat wrote:
godix wrote:If you spend two months working out a really difficult turd, one of those turds that feels like you're pushing concrete out your ass, the end result is STILL a huge pile of steaming crap.
Yes, but once it's out you will hear the sound of trumpet blasts. People will clap and applaud you. You'll get your gold stars, and a nice pat on the back.
That's the way it works :awesome:


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Re: Top Ten

Postby Vivaldi » Wed May 26, 2010 12:26 am

Oleander wrote:Are the Top 10% videos the current trend in amv creation? I have been a site member for about 7 years and have watched amv's for at least 10 and I have to say the current Top videos are some of the best in regard to technical skill but the worst artistically. I'm not necessarily saying that they are bad videos but I remember when watching an amv would pull at your emotions but now it seems like everyone is just trying to show off with how good they can use their favorite editing program. It has been awhile since I have checked out some new videos and I would like to hear some opinions on this, especially from the old timers.

Frankly I'd suggest this has more to you (and probably some other "old timers" becoming jaded over the years rather than some vast slide in quality.

For instance, saying "but I remember when watching an amv would pull at your emotions" is extremely anecdotal: if I could find a person who felt they were emotionally moved by some amvs in the top 10%, would that not disprove your theory? I believe editing styles have become somewhat faster paced and likely more montage styled, but that doesn't make them worse by any means. You're holding new amvs to a standard that simply never existed: amvs 7 years ago were the same arms race of technical acumen as they are now, 90% of it was tripe and the good stuff was conceptually identical to the quality amvs being produced today.

I don't even think the "Style before substance" idiom is applicable here. Amvs are, like film, a fundamentally visual medium. To castigate those who apply themselves to that side of the process is in my mind a grave mistake, and it misses a large deal of the point. An amv that is visually creative, beauteous, or meaningful is extremely substantive. The so called "substance" people are forever looking for is just a mime of theater and film that should not be considered the paramount concern of an amv, let alone the sole aspect to be judged. A visually stunning amv justifies its existence, but one that offers only an "idea" would be better implemented as a fanfic.

Of course, I'm not talking about those amvs in which the concept directly deals with or affects the visual content, but I believe amvs are flourishing in that regard more than ever.
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Re: Top Ten

Postby Megamom » Wed May 26, 2010 1:42 am

The feedback system is outdated for several years, some of the AMVs that are in the current list (Top 10%) would not have to be there (including my Toxic AMV), currently there are better AMVs now, but the system does not why do justice.

I personally think that had previously best AMVs... cos previously more difficult to do, now we have at our disposal many new editing tools that make the job easier, anyone can make a good AMV (technically) but make an AMV to express something? no! :down:

There are many AMVs that do not express anything, good technically, but without a soul! (Publishers of Youtube) :|
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Re: Top Ten

Postby EvaFan » Wed May 26, 2010 2:05 am

Oleander wrote:I remember when watching an amv would pull at your emotions but now it seems like everyone is just trying to show off with how good they can use their favorite editing program. It has been awhile since I have checked out some new videos and I would like to hear some opinions on this, especially from the old timers.


I actually agree but some people just use FX more then others cause they like external work, that doesn't mean they use them solely to show off (usually beneficial to their concept/theme) so you can't rule everyone into that. Though there has definitely been a decline in AMV's that draw out emotions or just have that xyz factor in them.

Bashar pretty much nailed all of this allready though, there are people who prefer style and people who prefer substance in amvs. Guess I'm a substance editor :uhoh: .

But to add to that most of the people watching amv's are teens or preteens. They are the ones that watch transformers and think its awesome just for its giant robot action and fxwork, they could care less about how the story plays out, makes sense, does more then just amaze you. That's just my opinion though.
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Re: Top Ten

Postby Oleander » Wed May 26, 2010 6:28 pm

Megamom wrote:The feedback system is outdated for several years, some of the AMVs that are in the current list (Top 10%) would not have to be there (including my Toxic AMV), currently there are better AMVs now, but the system does not why do justice.

I personally think that had previously best AMVs... cos previously more difficult to do, now we have at our disposal many new editing tools that make the job easier, anyone can make a good AMV (technically) but make an AMV to express something? no! :down:

There are many AMVs that do not express anything, good technically, but without a soul! (Publishers of Youtube) :|


I didn't have any problems with your video.


Vivaldi wrote:
Oleander wrote:Are the Top 10% videos the current trend in amv creation? I have been a site member for about 7 years and have watched amv's for at least 10 and I have to say the current Top videos are some of the best in regard to technical skill but the worst artistically. I'm not necessarily saying that they are bad videos but I remember when watching an amv would pull at your emotions but now it seems like everyone is just trying to show off with how good they can use their favorite editing program. It has been awhile since I have checked out some new videos and I would like to hear some opinions on this, especially from the old timers.

Frankly I'd suggest this has more to you (and probably some other "old timers" becoming jaded over the years rather than some vast slide in quality.

For instance, saying "but I remember when watching an amv would pull at your emotions" is extremely anecdotal: if I could find a person who felt they were emotionally moved by some amvs in the top 10%, would that not disprove your theory? I believe editing styles have become somewhat faster paced and likely more montage styled, but that doesn't make them worse by any means. You're holding new amvs to a standard that simply never existed: amvs 7 years ago were the same arms race of technical acumen as they are now, 90% of it was tripe and the good stuff was conceptually identical to the quality amvs being produced today.

I don't even think the "Style before substance" idiom is applicable here. Amvs are, like film, a fundamentally visual medium. To castigate those who apply themselves to that side of the process is in my mind a grave mistake, and it misses a large deal of the point. An amv that is visually creative, beauteous, or meaningful is extremely substantive. The so called "substance" people are forever looking for is just a mime of theater and film that should not be considered the paramount concern of an amv, let alone the sole aspect to be judged. A visually stunning amv justifies its existence, but one that offers only an "idea" would be better implemented as a fanfic.

Of course, I'm not talking about those amvs in which the concept directly deals with or affects the visual content, but I believe amvs are flourishing in that regard more than ever.


Well you are entitled to your opinion since I was only expressing mine. However, I don't think you can say that I am wrong if you were not around at that time. I only used the top 10% for a random sampling, which is why i posed the question the forum. Maybe if you were around back then you could understand the way I feel.
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