Kevin Caldwell Set The Standard...Now I'm Gonna Break It...

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Postby The_Mad_Hatter » Tue Dec 03, 2002 7:40 pm

Zarxrax wrote:I just took a look at your stuff, and aside from the clip of sakura sucking her thumb, I'm not really impressed.


Well that's good, the first part isn't that impressive, actually to be perfectly honest the whole front end before the lip synch has been completely changed around. I decided instead to show some quick memory flashes from 0:10 to 0:20 that have additive dissolve transitions that move fluidly with the sound of the music. Makes for a neat effect.

First thing, when sakura closes her eye at the beginning that just looks really weird the way you fade it. Try actually giving it full animation.


Yeah but then you don't notice it...although I guess it can be argued that some of the best edits are the ones you don't notice.

For the lip sync, it isn't really that good either. It especially looks bad where she says "last" because you don't show the L sound properly.


Oh fer cryin out loud, this is as bad as when I made Beginnings and most everyone was bitchin about the first version and how the various network logos (CN, WB, WB Patriotic) flashing between scenes was really distracting and I should cover them...so then I cover them with my own solid static logo and then peeps start complaining about that! o_O

I've found that when making AMVs...you can never truly please everyone...except yourself.

Someone said when you make it look perfect, it looks forced. There is a difference between perfect and forced.


Really? What is it? No see I keep hearing that from people but I don't see an explanation. What do you mean by "forced" See to me there's only two ways, either you match the lip movements as precisely as possible, or you just have the lips flappin when there's talkin...please, try and explain WHAT you mean by "forced", because it seems to me that's just a "i wanna be negative" critique. Which is fine, I really don't mind, but you could at least not be so freakin blatant about it.

It is possible to get perfect lip sync and have it still not look forced.


...

Uh...please 'o great master...tell us, what is your secret? o_O

On the other hand its possible to have less than perfect lip sync and have it look forced.


Did you ever see the movie Mystery Men? Can you guess which character you'd be?

I don't think the accuracy of lip sync has much of anything to do with how "forced" it comes out.


That is not an explanation of what "forced" means.

Also note that in movies and such with a large budget, they DO properly sync the lips to the sounds. Another thing on your lip sync: Anyone can just make a characters lips move.


*Hatter checks back to see where he said that just anyone couldn't do that*

O_o

I could probly lip-sync that scene in 5 minutes.


Oh I bet you couldn't do it any better than me. And BTW you're wrong about the L not lining up right. See I know it lines up perfectly cause there's a lil trick you can do in Premiere. See rather than play the video, set the cursor at the beginning of the clip and then switch to the preview window and start pressing the right arrow key. Basically that way you can watch and listen to the video in slow-mo and you can get your edits to line up perfectly. Granted watching them at full speed it doesn't always look super perfect because you're probably missing some minute changes. Watch the clip a good thirty times in a row and really stare at it, you'll find it really doesn't get any more perfect than the way I have it. See that's what I consider to not be "forced", when the actual footage lines up PERFECTLY to the voices, but to the average viewer watching it it's not always super apparent unless they're paying really close attention.

The magic occurs when MORE is happening than just the lips flapping. When the character is moving, making subtle motions, etc.


I totally agree with that and there will be many segments like that in the video. Keep in mind about 85% of the song is spoken without any straight music parts except for the first 20 seconds or so, after that it's non-stop talking.
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Postby mexicanjunior » Tue Dec 03, 2002 7:56 pm

The_Mad_Hatter wrote:Oh fer cryin out loud, this is as bad as when I made Beginnings and most everyone was bitchin about the first version and how the various network logos (CN, WB, WB Patriotic) flashing between scenes was really distracting and I should cover them...so then I cover them with my own solid static logo and then peeps start complaining about that! o_O

I've found that when making AMVs...you can never truly please everyone...except yourself.



Wouldn't using non-logo DVD footage appease them? O_o
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Postby The_Mad_Hatter » Tue Dec 03, 2002 8:00 pm

mexicanjunior wrote:
The_Mad_Hatter wrote:Oh fer cryin out loud, this is as bad as when I made Beginnings and most everyone was bitchin about the first version and how the various network logos (CN, WB, WB Patriotic) flashing between scenes was really distracting and I should cover them...so then I cover them with my own solid static logo and then peeps start complaining about that! o_O

I've found that when making AMVs...you can never truly please everyone...except yourself.



Wouldn't using non-logo DVD footage appease them? O_o


Didn't have it at the time, although now that you bring it up I fully plan on redoing both my old CCS videos from scratch using the DVD footage I have now.
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Postby Vlad G Pohnert » Tue Dec 03, 2002 8:03 pm

klinky wrote:Actually I think After Effects has been around since the early ninties, Caldwell may have been using that. The effects used in Believe seem more towards that of After Effects rather then Premiere, but yar nevar know! ^_^


~klinky]


I asked. His friend said he used Premiere and Photoshop...

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Postby The_Mad_Hatter » Tue Dec 03, 2002 8:08 pm

Sorta OT in this thread, but on the topic of tools, using Paint Shop's Animation Shop works really great for frame by frame editing, especially if you don't have the latest version of Preimier that let's you right click on frames and edit them.
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Postby SSJVegita0609 » Tue Dec 03, 2002 8:12 pm

The_Mad_Hatter wrote:Sorta OT in this thread, but on the topic of tools, using Paint Shop's Animation Shop works really great for frame by frame editing, especially if you don't have the latest version of Preimier that let's you right click on frames and edit them.


That's actually a good point. I started using it for titles and now I'm doing some frame by frame in my new X video. It works surprisingly well. You can get a 30 trail version on cnet for those of you who don't have it.
The best effects are the ones you don't notice.
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Postby Dannywilson » Tue Dec 03, 2002 8:21 pm

Just a question Hatter? what was the purpose behind the whole window-looking-like-a-razorblade-hole in Plenipotentiary? I just wasnt to know, it was distracting, and didn't add much more than a novelty effect to the video. other than that, that video was good, but kinda dragged.
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Postby Hakura » Tue Dec 03, 2002 8:24 pm

Eh man...from what you say I expected more....you want to see awsome editing with far better use of frame by frame editing, see Vlads, "Transending Love" (sorry if thats spelt wrong) now THATS a noteworthy video ^^
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Postby The_Mad_Hatter » Tue Dec 03, 2002 8:31 pm

Dannywilson wrote:Just a question Hatter? what was the purpose behind the whole window-looking-like-a-razorblade-hole in Plenipotentiary? I just wasnt to know, it was distracting, and didn't add much more than a novelty effect to the video. other than that, that video was good, but kinda dragged.


Well that's your opinion. And the three people who actually left actual opinions...they disagree with you. ^_^

BTW, you're going to the special hell and you've made the angels cry. :(

Also, I clearly stated the reason for the frame in that video...really you couldn't have missed it. And it really is a truly innovative as well as original idea for those who have no other source for their clips than cable television with distracting little network logos.
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Postby SSJVegita0609 » Tue Dec 03, 2002 8:35 pm

I oped it, and I definately said the border didn't work.
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Postby Dannywilson » Tue Dec 03, 2002 8:41 pm

Ok, just for that, you're getting an opinion. An HONEST opinion. I reviewed your video impartially, and also read the Author's comments section through twice just to make sure I hadn't missed any more of your wonderful little secret comments. I reviewed your video impartially, but if you keep making enemys on this board dude, I can't say that for all of them.
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Postby The_Mad_Hatter » Tue Dec 03, 2002 8:44 pm

SSJVegita0609 wrote:I oped it, and I definately said the border didn't work.


You were the only one who said that. Here's quotes from the other two opinion givers:

"Well....the way you covered up the Cartoon Network logo was very creative..I wish I had thought of that for some of my older videos. That helped boost your orginality score. The sound quality was good as well as the footage, which is a tad surprising considering that you got it off the t.v The song went well with the footage...gave it a feeling of tension and suspence while I watched it."

"This was a good vid. I think someone stated before me that your method of covering up the CN logo was indeed creative, and I'd have to agree. The song also matched the mood of the video very well."

As I mentioned earlier though about Beginings, I got people bitchin when I didn't do anything with the logos, people bitchin when I covered the logos with another logo, and in your case I got bitchin about when I sneck out the logo completely...bottom line...as I said, there's no pleasin everyone, but I think the frame method I came up with is one of the best ways around using TV footage.
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Postby Dannywilson » Tue Dec 03, 2002 8:51 pm

I can give quotes from the amount of opinions I have on my videos all day long, that doesn't make them true. I had one reviewer that fucking compared me with KC, :roll: and honest to god, I think that person was smoking crack when they reviewed the video. There's a point when good flattery ends, and asskissing begins.
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Postby SSJVegita0609 » Tue Dec 03, 2002 8:55 pm

The_Mad_Hatter wrote:Well that's your opinion. And the three people who actually left actual opinions...they disagree with you. ^_^


I was simply disproving this point. And now 2 of 4 people didn't like it.
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Postby The_Mad_Hatter » Tue Dec 03, 2002 8:58 pm

SSJVegita0609 wrote:
The_Mad_Hatter wrote:Well that's your opinion. And the three people who actually left actual opinions...they disagree with you. ^_^


I was simply disproving this point. And now 2 of 4 people didn't like it.


Well you just pat yourself on the back and give us a smile. ^_^

Personally, I like the border, even if the footage didn't have goofy network logos...I probably would have still done it. But then, more than anyone else, I made the video for me...not you or anyone else.
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