It's begun!

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It's begun!

Postby JudgeHolden » Tue Jun 02, 2009 5:58 pm

http://www.icv2.com/articles/news/13486.html
http://www.icv2.com/articles/news/14993.html

Nio should be glad he lives in Europe, or this might have been him. :P
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Re: It's begun!

Postby guy07 » Tue Jun 02, 2009 6:12 pm

I'm surprised this isn't happening quicker around the world. With all the attention anime is receiving it's only natural they figure out there's a huge pedo factor in it.
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Re: It's begun!

Postby BurningLeaves » Tue Jun 02, 2009 11:14 pm

I've always found it disgusting how a drawing could be deemed child porn or illegal. People really need to grow up, it's a drawing, obviously no one was harmed in it's creation.. And who really cares if a pedophile looks at it? It's not going to turn someone into a pedophile and if anything it's going to give them something to hold them over other than raping yer kids.
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Re: It's begun!

Postby Otohiko » Tue Jun 02, 2009 11:16 pm

Next they'll go after the midget porn lovers, eh? :roll:

It's all really, really strange. For me, what I don't like is the dubbing of this as 'manga' without qualification. Might make it awkward for people to explain their hobbies in the near future :amv:
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Re: It's begun!

Postby Phlu » Wed Jun 03, 2009 2:21 pm

Personally I think the government should work harder trying to stop real child pornography rather then spend their time on this.
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Re: It's begun!

Postby The Origonal Head Hunter » Wed Jun 03, 2009 5:27 pm

I pose a question.

Would you rather pedophiles take pictures of real children

or

Would you prefer saving the innocence of real children by allowing pedos their drawings?
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Re: It's begun!

Postby meleechampion » Wed Jun 03, 2009 5:43 pm

The Origonal Head Hunter wrote:Would you prefer saving the innocence of real children by allowing pedos their drawings?

That's like saying violent video games keep REAL crazed gunmen from actually going out and shooting people.
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Re: It's begun!

Postby The Origonal Head Hunter » Thu Jun 04, 2009 7:23 am

meleechampion wrote:
The Origonal Head Hunter wrote:Would you prefer saving the innocence of real children by allowing pedos their drawings?

That's like saying violent video games keep REAL crazed gunmen from actually going out and shooting people.

Almost, but not quite. Crazed gunmen don't get the same thrill from blowing pixels into bloody pixels as they would from putting a bullet in a real person.

Contrawise, a pedophile just wants to see a naked kid, real or otherwise.
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Re: It's begun!

Postby BasharOfTheAges » Thu Jun 04, 2009 5:30 pm

The Origonal Head Hunter wrote:
meleechampion wrote:
The Origonal Head Hunter wrote:Would you prefer saving the innocence of real children by allowing pedos their drawings?

That's like saying violent video games keep REAL crazed gunmen from actually going out and shooting people.

Almost, but not quite. Crazed gunmen don't get the same thrill from blowing pixels into bloody pixels as they would from putting a bullet in a real person.

Contrawise, a pedophile just wants to see a naked kid, real or otherwise.

I'm pretty sure it's more than just wanting to see them... The real stuff also can be used for "training" purposes (through imitation) in ways drawn media falls short.

They're subhumans though, so they don't need rights or sane legislation - think of the rhetoric children!
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Re: It's begun!

Postby guy07 » Thu Jun 04, 2009 9:18 pm

I don't really care what form it comes in. Child porn is a big no-no in my books.
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Re: It's begun!

Postby BurningLeaves » Fri Jun 05, 2009 12:48 am

Were not talking about children, were talking about drawn pictures that resemble underage people. It's like that movie... that I cant remember (Kariudo says it's called Minority Report... Kariudo knows nothing of pop culture take it with a grain of salt) where they start arresting people based on crimes they commit in the future.... There is nothing wrong with looking at drawings, you are committing no crime, and even if they deem it illegal you're still not doing anything wrong Not everyone who looks at something like that, and not everyone who would get turned on by the whole loli thing is a pedophile. Just like not everyone who wants to bang a girl in a catholic school girl outfit is a pedophile.

Loli obsession might be a symptom of pedophilia but it isn't the be all end all and there is a huge huge difference between a normal random kid getting raped by his priest and a drawing of an apparent prepubescent manga character begging for the clocks.

Also hentai can be quite educational, it's taught me all Japanese high school girls are sluts and have retractable penises. Good to know when planning your vacation itinerary.
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Re: It's begun!

Postby Kitsuner » Fri Jun 05, 2009 1:15 am

BurningLeaves wrote:It's like that movie... that I cant remember (Kariudo says it's called Minority Report... Kariudo knows nothing of pop culture take it with a grain of salt) where they start arresting people based on crimes they commit in the future....

Yep, that's Minority Report.
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Re: It's begun!

Postby JudgeHolden » Fri Jun 05, 2009 2:36 am

One thing that is getting missed in this discussion are the wide ranging implications of the above plea agreement. I submit to you the laws that are involved:

"Under federal law (18 U.S.C. §2256), child pornography is defined as any visual depiction, including any photograph, film, video, picture, or computer or computer-generated image or picture, whether made or produced by electronic, mechanical, or other means, of sexually explicit conduct, where the production of the visual depiction involves the use of a minor engaging in sexually explicit conduct; or the visual depiction is a digital image, computer image, or computer-generated image that is, or is indistinguishable from, that of a minor engaging in sexually explicit conduct; or the visual depiction has been created, adapted, or modified to appear that an identifiable minor is engaging in sexually explicit conduct.

Federal law (18 U.S.C. §1466A) also criminalizes knowingly producing, distributing, receiving, or possessing with intent to distribute, a visual depiction of any kind, including a drawing, cartoon, sculpture or painting, thatdepicts a minor engaging in sexually explicit conduct and is obscene, or depicts an image that is, or appears to be, of a minor engaging in graphic bestiality, sadistic or masochistic abuse, or sexual intercourse, including genital-genital, oral-genital, anal-genital, or oral-anal, whether between persons of the same or opposite sex and such depiction lacks serious literary, artistic, political, or scientific value.

Sexually explicit conduct is defined under federal law (18 U.S.C. §2256) as actual or simulated sexual intercourse (including genital-genital, oral-genital, anal-genital, or oral-anal, whether between persons of the same or opposite sex), bestiality, masturbation, sadistic or masochistic abuse, or lascivious exhibition of the genitals or pubic area of any person."

Now for the most important part.

"For purposes of enforcing the federal law (18 U.S.C. §2256), “minor” is defined as a person under the age of 18."

Therefore, if you have ever watched, let us say Bible Black, Mezzo Forte, or really any Hentai, then under United States Federal Statutes you have watched child porn; because more often than not the characters are of High School age. (This includes you Guy07) In addition, by signing the plea agreement the offender has admitted that "Manga", (i.e. Hentai) lacks any serious literary or artistic value. What is all means is that anybody who has ever watched Hentai can be prosecuted. Not only that, but this site can be at risk for linking videos like:



Furthermore, I know that Acen has a Hentai panel in which said hentai are not only discussed but clips shown, putting everybody who attended said event at risk.

Luckily the term "graphic" is used in the wording of the Law, thereby giving general "fan-service" a pass, otherwise everybody who has ever watched Anime or read a manga would be screwed.
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Re: It's begun!

Postby The Origonal Head Hunter » Fri Jun 05, 2009 7:45 am

JudgeHolden wrote:the visual depiction is a digital image, computer image, or computer-generated image that is, or is indistinguishable from, that of a minor engaging in sexually explicit conduct

The key part of that law that should make loli manga passable. 3D Loli stuff I can understand, that shit is too close to real, but you can't show the average person on the street Bible Black, or even "real" loli manga and expect them to believe that is a real, living minor.

Also "possessing with intent to distribute" should clear this guy for it, since there's most likely a statute of limitation on the "receiving" part of it.
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Re: It's begun!

Postby Koopiskeva » Fri Jun 05, 2009 8:10 am

I heard..

Bible Black.

|:>
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