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Postby RichLather » Mon Apr 21, 2003 10:04 pm

In the red corner we have a video looking captured, even though it's from DVD (probably went to analog between Rich's house and the convention), using a title animated by hand.


True dat. My journal reflected the pain and suffering needed to output this from the PC to tape. From now on, though, any con that accepts MiniDV as a tape format will get that instead of VHS. Otherwise I'll prob'ly go with MPEG-1 or XviD if they don't mind getting the codec togo with it. And you had me on "title animated by hand" for a sec (Zuh? I didn't put a slate on this!).

I like old-school stuff, and given all the great work that's been done with them, it'd be a shame to let those old-school kind of styles just fade out.


As I continue to learn using Premiere (and soon After Effects) I think my style may begin to change. I sure won't lose the old-school plot-driven editing, 'cos that's been my bread and butter from Day One. It'll just be prettier. I don't have the patience yet for frame-by-frame reworking of the source material, short of a chroma key.

Oh, and we need more in-depth post-contest wrapups like this. I really enjoyed reading it.
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Postby Vlad G Pohnert » Mon Apr 21, 2003 10:24 pm

RichLather wrote:As I continue to learn using Premiere (and soon After Effects) I think my style may begin to change. I sure won't lose the old-school plot-driven editing, 'cos that's been my bread and butter from Day One. It'll just be prettier. I don't have the patience yet for frame-by-frame reworking of the source material, short of a chroma key.

Oh, and we need more in-depth post-contest wrapups like this. I really enjoyed reading it.


Bah, I'm old school and analog was my life, but adapted to digital very fast and not looked back since (in terms of the technology - not the ideas)! Hec my first comeating video in 2000 used After Effects... The way I see it, if your used to the patience of doing very fine and fast cuts with two VCRs then Frame by Frame becomes a piece of cake in terms of patience :roll: Yea...right...I'm sure I've convinced my self of that...

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Postby RichLather » Mon Apr 21, 2003 10:26 pm

I'm glad you did, Vlad. :D

Right now I feel that until I can get faster with Premiere, as well as drop all other hobbies, housework, yardwork, and maybe a marriage, I won't find myself making something like TaranT's winner anytime soon.

Ahhhhhh, we'll see.
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Postby TaranT » Tue Apr 22, 2003 4:02 am

Kai Stromler wrote:These were the only two Masters entries, and there couldn't be a more perfect contrast of the old-school and new-school styles, with some slightly unsettling indications for the future. In the red corner we have a video looking captured, even though it's from DVD (probably went to analog between Rich's house and the convention), using a title animated by hand. Its music track is vocal rock (ok, punk/hardcore, but I'm trying to be general here), and it is heavily focused on plot and pixel changes created by the original animators. In the blue corner we have a video ripped from DVDs of a show made without a single painted cel. The music track is non-vocal techno, and the emphasis is on feeling, atmosphere, and pixel changes created by the video editor. From a creator's perspective, one can see that these two videos were created with approximately equal effort and equal competence. Picking which is better, for anyone with experience and insight, is deadly tough. So you have a great old-school video up against a great new-school video, and for whatever reason, the audience picks the new-school video.

I like old-school stuff, and given all the great work that's been done with them, it'd be a shame to let those old-school kind of styles just fade out. But audiences like shiny things, and familiar things. TaranT's video was great, and there's no knock to be made against it, but its victory here shouldn't be the signal for the final die-off of old-school AMV or anything.

It's ironic - and a bit humorous - to see the term "new-school" applied to me. Especially after the video that I put in the Master's contest at AWA last year. And it's flattering (Thanks!) to be compared to someone with RichLather's years of experience.

I don't see any lesson here about old vs. new school, either. I've won contests with both and I've seen others do the same. My inclination is towards old school, however. I like the "DeMoss Rule" (my words, not his ^_^) to limit a project to two weeks, although I'm usually willing to go to four weeks. I don't have the patience for major reconstructions like Tainted Donuts or Transcending Love, or for an effects vid like Euphoria.

One correction to your comments: the source for Mirage was an analog capture through a camcorder from DVD to DV files. And all the editing was done in DV, too. Not as tech-y as ripping or the AMVApp, but it's what I've become comfortable with. And the video quality is more than adequate as you could tell.

I'll second RichLather, too: thanks for the long writeup. I thought about doing the same after Sakura-Con, but I forgot to bring something to write notes on. :roll:
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Postby oxiclean » Tue Apr 22, 2003 12:37 pm

wow, i can't believe it took you guys so long to sign-up. I arrived at the hotel at 9 on Saturday and was registered within 5 minutes.
my poor feet were killing me by the Saturday night though. i had to stand the whole time, because it was so crowded and not enough chairs. awesome con, none the less.
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Postby Kai Stromler » Tue Apr 22, 2003 1:14 pm

New school/old school is just a feel.....varies video to video. Even I've done both (though due to my editing gear most of my few new-school ones look kinda retarded).

TaranT re capture: hehe. I totally misread this one. I originally thought that you had gone all-digital and Rich had captured his from VHS. Just emphasizing even more the role of processing gear (in your case) and post-processing issues (in Rich's). It woulda been cool for comparison purposes if it was, but reality aint always done for our convenience.

I didn't write any notes for this. I just have a ridiculous memory, and a spare ballot to jog it when necessary. If I had done notes I would have listed all the overflow ones too, even the ones that weren't either good or bad enough to get mentioned as it was.

To be fair I tried to bring out the good points of all the videos in the contest, and all the ones in the overflow worthy of attention, but even so there were some for which that just wasn't possible. There were a lot of good videos, and a large field, for a first-time contest at a first-time con.

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Postby imaginaryaerith » Tue Apr 22, 2003 2:42 pm

mckeed wrote:

How was the rest of the drama category? What was the general reaction to the video? Did ppl like my the added audio from the series?


hi. your video made me somewhat obsessed with SaiKano...i personally voted for the Dream Baby Dream/Grave of Fireflies video for best drama cause it made me cry (!!) but i wasn't upset you won cause i certainly enjoyed your video. i think the general reaction was positive seeing as you won but for a lesser known anime at a very newbie con (at least that was my impression) it did well. i liked the audio, i would've preferred it without the subtitles but that's just me (most ppl prob'ly want to know what's being said).

anyway - congrats!

as for the rest i was a lil upset that two Kenshin vids won - the first was loverly, but the second kinda grated on me. course the 'action' category is always somewhat odd. and how did the Anime Girlz clip show get to the finals? the Arjuna vid was pretty awful too - pixelated and obviously a copy of a copy of a copy. good concept but without the right tools it's hard.

*smiles*
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Postby Darkseid » Tue Apr 22, 2003 5:33 pm

I was just curious, did anyone see reaction to the Cobra vid at AB. Think it went into the Sunday morning overflow show. Just curious, thanks.
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Postby AbsoluteDestiny » Tue Apr 22, 2003 5:34 pm

imaginaryaerith wrote:hi. your video made me somewhat obsessed with SaiKano...


plug - http://www.animemusicvideos.org/members ... hp?v=16513
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Postby mckeed » Wed Apr 23, 2003 6:26 am

well, saikano won't dissapoint you when you see it.....It just hits you on a crapload of levels. Its just....powerfull.
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Postby jbone » Wed Apr 23, 2003 6:45 am

mckeed wrote:Its just....powerfull.


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Postby PatrickD » Wed Apr 23, 2003 1:10 pm

mckeed wrote:Well.....i was kinda bummed when i got the email that my video went into the finals that it was easter weekend....damn familily holidays. Now i'm even more pissed that it won best drama. That video was one of those things i had to make when i saw Saikano.


...and now I have to mail your trophy to you. These glass things are HEAVY! ;)
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Kenshin and Arjuna

Postby PatrickD » Wed Apr 23, 2003 1:23 pm

imaginaryaerith wrote:as for the rest i was a lil upset that two Kenshin vids won - the first was loverly, but the second kinda grated on me.


The voting didn't go the way I thought it would...but those are the numbers.

imaginaryaerith wrote:course the 'action' category is always somewhat odd. and how did the Anime Girlz clip show get to the finals? the Arjuna vid was pretty awful too - pixelated and obviously a copy of a copy of a copy. good concept but without the right tools it's hard.


A group of people from various backgrounds, likes, dislikes, and experience judged all 51 entries and rated them from 1 ("I want to rip my eyes out!") to 10 ("Marry me. Be my love monkey!"). The scores were averaged together and then the videos ranked from 1 to 51. After that was done, I knew some videos would obviously be in the finals and some would not...but the middle of the field was a jumble and I wasn't able to determine exactly how many videos I would be able to fit until I actually assembled the DVDs, put in the intro, put in the title screens, and put in the recap.

Although the creators of the Arjuna and Anime Girlz videos put in a decent effort, those were very, very close to not getting in the finals. There were more than a handful of videos that were not in the finals due to horrid video (and/or sound) quality...and those were almost another two casualties.

Also, I'd like to correct a previous report. NO videos were disqualified from the contest. If a video was disqualified for too much violence, it wouldn't have been shown at all. (...and given the young ages of some people watching the AMV contest, we will probably be tougher with our "family friendly" rule next year.)
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Postby dokool » Wed Apr 23, 2003 7:57 pm

Patrick,

Wouldn't the four MPEG2 on CD-ROM entries have been disqualified? I remember the term "...will be used as coasters or target practice" on the rules.

I'm surprised at the seemingly wild differences in quality, especially since you guys pretty much limited things to three formats. Perhaps you should put in the rules next year about entries obviously created from fansubs or bootleg copies (I definately saw the green M from a certain HK company)...

In the spirit of Kai's post, these are derived from v. quick notes that I took at the competition, during the Novice videos. I only took notes on the Novice videos because there were so damn many of them, and my memory turned out to serve me better when I voted for Journeyman and Master. Formatting on notes cleaned up in some parts, identical in others. Many of my observations were gut reactions (don't come to my door with torches and pitchforks, any of you creators), many of my observations were on crowd reactions.

1. <b>Rurouni Kenshin OAV - Crawling In The Dark</b> - Words during FFX theme were a bit unnecessary. "Use my heart and not my eyes" was a good clip. Great cuts on the last chorus.

2. <b>Zoro's Promise</b> - Iffy Quality, and definately an overused song. Felt like an LPZ video with better cuts.

3. <b>Final Fantasy Heroes</b> - Jaggies! Not enough about the <u>characters</u>, it's mostly scenery (buildings, weapons, etc)

4. <b>Life@War</b> - Lips moving was a big distraction. Speedup was a nie touch, but footage reuse wasn't. Some transitions smoother than others, some quality better in certain parts. "Chaos effect" (using the handycam) was unique

5. <b>Evangelion - Excalibur</b> - <u>good</u> but random. (Have been listening to an mp3 of this remix non-stop since I found it)

6. <b>Don't Walk Away</b> - "gonna get inside you" - ROFL! "don't walk away" - good change between 1st and 2nd (not quite sure what this was referring to)

7. <b>The Blossom's Lament</b> - Not bad, but enh. Why the combat?

8. <b>Rocket Man</b> - seen it (it's Orged, my opinion tells all)

9. <b>Dreams</b> - Some guy in the row behind me screamed "But wait, there's more!", which I believe got a bigger laugh than anything in the video itself. False endings - IIII. "Does this song EVER END!?!?"

10. <b>Uber Depressing Video</b> - Is there a context to the subtitles? (crossed out)

11. <b>What If...</b> - I could swear that I've had the thought to do this anime/song combo at one point in my life. Who is this about, anyways?

12. <b>Dream, Setsuko, Dream</b> - Better quality than Life@War. Good vid.

13. <b>Final Fantasy Rhapsody</b> - Lots of chuckles in audience throughout. Am impressed that he stuck through to the end of the song.

14. <b>Fight!</b> - <b>BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!</b>

15. <b>Father's Pawn</b> - Booooo. That is all.

16. <b>Push It Kenshin</b> - I had this vid labeled as "average," for some reason. Maybe since it won, I'll give it another look.

17. <b>Fine Again</b> - My video, so no notes taken. I distinctly remember the sound of my heart shattering when the applause was more subdued than in many of the other videos.

18. <b>Arjuna's Book of Days</b> - Interesting mix. Laid back. Quality is iffy. Skips at a few parts?

19. <b>Searching</b> - Got a few laughs

20. <b>Anime Girls - Becoz' I Love you</b> - Gah.

21. <b>Oishii</b> - Fan service + shots to groin = funny

22. <b>I, Koshi...</b> - As Kai said that Greg said, it's timed excellently. I like it.

-DOKool
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Postby mckeed » Wed Apr 23, 2003 8:15 pm

dokool wrote:10. <b>Uber Depressing Video</b> - Is there a context to the subtitles? (crossed out)


Yes there was context to the subtitles, apparently enought ppl figured it out. If you can watch the series, do....then all will make sense. What does crossed out mean?
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