Project OrgEditor [Recommendation Thread]

The official forum for Project OrgEditor. Project coordinator: CodeZTM

Re: Project OrgEditor [Recommendation Thread]

Postby CodeZTM » Wed Jul 27, 2011 6:50 pm

When i started this cOntest, it had 3 purposes. B

1). To make editors edit outside their typical standards. This, naturally, can result in great videos.
2). To have fun!
3). Have a more "unusual" contest than most have.

Edit: I also wanted to bring project runway to the org. XD

I have more to say, but I'm on the road ATM, so I will address other posts shortly.
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Re: Project OrgEditor [Recommendation Thread]

Postby CorpseGoddess » Wed Jul 27, 2011 7:33 pm

Okay, speaking as a judge, here are a few things:

I've only been a judge one other time (at last year's AAC, at the last minute, and Bashar nearly killed me with habanero glucose). I did serve on staff with Vlad at this year's Sakura-Con and was REALLY involved with that and selecting amv's to show--so, not really judging, but I did have to show some discernment.

I honestly don't know why Code asked me to judge, I didn't ask him. I *do* know I've enjoyed it immensely. I tend to be overly opinionated and I am a critical person, but I also went to art school and I do understand the difference between criticism and critique. I'm also one of the older editors on the site (39) and I'm fairly even-tempered and thick-skinned, so I don't take things personally, and I try not to let personal prejudices get in the way of things like this. That being said, I feel amv editing is an art form, and judging them is both subjective and objective.

I have no problem with Code revealing which comments and scores were mine after this is done (or at any time), and I don't mind discussing them with any of the editors at any point. And if anybody has a problem with me being selected as a judge for any reason and wants to talk about that, feel free. Like I said, I'm not a wilting wallflower--I'm not gonna go boo-hoo in a corner because you think I shouldn't have been a judge.

I've really enjoyed the competition and I've really enjoyed watching all your videos--the ones I've liked, and the ones that haven't floated my boat as much. They all took blood, sweat and tears on your parts and that's never a wasted effort.
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Re: Project OrgEditor [Recommendation Thread]

Postby BasharOfTheAges » Wed Jul 27, 2011 8:08 pm

CorpseGoddess wrote:Bashar nearly killed me with habanero glucose

I totally <3 you for putting up with that. If you happen to be in the area for future AACs, I could always use more judges and I've been sworn to not cause people physical pain any more. XD
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Re: Project OrgEditor [Recommendation Thread]

Postby CorpseGoddess » Wed Jul 27, 2011 8:17 pm

BasharOfTheAges wrote:
CorpseGoddess wrote:Bashar nearly killed me with habanero glucose

I totally <3 you for putting up with that. If you happen to be in the area for future AACs, I could always use more judges and I've been sworn to not cause people physical pain any more. XD


It was a blast, really. I just didn't expect that thing so be quite so...apocalyptically spicy. I won't be out there this year, but most definitely next, so you can put me down for judging then. If I can convince hubby to come out with me (Purplepolecat), you'll get him as well. :awesome: :awesome:
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Re: Project OrgEditor [Recommendation Thread]

Postby Pwolf » Wed Jul 27, 2011 8:20 pm

CodeZTM wrote:1). To make editors edit outside their typical standards. This, naturally, can result in great videos.
2). To have fun!
3). Have a more "unusual" contest than most have.


These are great but they have nothing to do with what the actual purpose of the contest is. These are just things you hope people come away from it with. When there is only one editor left, what about the contest made them be the last one standing?
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Re: Project OrgEditor [Recommendation Thread]

Postby CodeZTM » Wed Jul 27, 2011 8:36 pm

Pwolf wrote:
CodeZTM wrote:1). To make editors edit outside their typical standards. This, naturally, can result in great videos.
2). To have fun!
3). Have a more "unusual" contest than most have.


These are great but they have nothing to do with what the actual purpose of the contest is. These are just things you hope people come away from it with. When there is only one editor left, what about the contest made them be the last one standing?


Excessive creativity and high standards of quality editing?
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Re: Project OrgEditor [Recommendation Thread]

Postby Ileia » Wed Jul 27, 2011 8:57 pm

Ileia wrote:The scoring issue would be easier to deal with if the point of the contest was more clearly defined. Who should be the winner? The one who does the best throughout the entire contest? Or, similar to reality shows (which the contest suggests it is), is it anyone's game every round and it doesn't matter if you've done well previously?
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Re: Project OrgEditor [Recommendation Thread]

Postby Pwolf » Wed Jul 27, 2011 9:04 pm

CodeZTM wrote:
Pwolf wrote:
CodeZTM wrote:1). To make editors edit outside their typical standards. This, naturally, can result in great videos.
2). To have fun!
3). Have a more "unusual" contest than most have.


These are great but they have nothing to do with what the actual purpose of the contest is. These are just things you hope people come away from it with. When there is only one editor left, what about the contest made them be the last one standing?


Excessive creativity and high standards of quality editing?


THE CONTEST NOT THE EDITOR >.<
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Re: Project OrgEditor [Recommendation Thread]

Postby CodeZTM » Wed Jul 27, 2011 9:37 pm

Pwolf wrote:
THE CONTEST NOT THE EDITOR >.<


I'm honestly not trying to be difficult, but I just didn't understand what you're getting at. Now I think I understand. XD

What about the contest made them be the last one standing? The contest is set up so that those who do better with the theme rounds [AKA: Creativity, how they executed each theme in terms of editing, and originality] get more points. Theme execution is 30 points, which makes it the biggest possible chunk of points to earn.

But I think I get what you mean. You mean like "the editor who does the best each round" or "the editor that is consistently good"? [Like Ileia said]

In this case, it's hard to answer. The inspiration was Project Runway, which does both. Each round, the judges think "Can we get something better from them?" "Did they have a bad week, but have a consistently positive prior work" and/or "Was this video SO bad that they deserve death?".

The scoring system was implemented to help create a sort of "reliability" to the judges to have a good reason for why they picked a video to move on to the next round. While I trust my judges, I feel like editors are more comfortable with it. Otherwise, it would essentially be "Judge A, please pick the video that you want tossed."

In this case, I think I will return to the previous scoring system where the worst videos each round will be eliminated. I feel like it's more in tune with the original concept of the contest, we can keep the scoring system [but simplify it as a rubric format].

__________________________

Now, to address the other posts! I finally hit a hotel and have a laptop. :)

*Blind Judges: I like this idea and will probably do this. I feel like it's a good idea. I just personally asked them if they wanted to be blind/revealed, and they all didn't mind being revealed, so I went with that. I'll also stick with my method of picking judges. I don't think I've done a bad job of it. I also LOVE the idea of having old competitors being judges. I'll make the offer next year before the contest starts.

*Bonus Round: Not likely. The bonus points criteria didn't work well in the first rendition, and I'm not comfortable with it. The "audition" video might be worth a bonus point or two, based on how well it was created, but that's about it. This was, it serves a nice incentive.

*Themes: I will be having a theme selection committee next year, and I will probably be using them to help me write them so they are easier to read. Then again, I don't think we will ever have something like Round 4's fiasco again. XD I think more like round 3/5 will be more numerous.

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Re: Project OrgEditor [Recommendation Thread]

Postby Warlike Swans » Wed Jul 27, 2011 10:32 pm

You could try round score + 10% of combined total from previous rounds to determine elimination scores. That would give some advantage to people who've done exceptionally throughout, but not an overwhelming one.
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Re: Project OrgEditor [Recommendation Thread]

Postby gotenks794 » Wed Jul 27, 2011 11:05 pm

I said my thoughts in the other thread, but I shall develop them a bit more here. I think the following system is worth looking into:

After each deadline, the judges receive the videos and score them from 1-10 (what the score is based on is up to Code, I suggest more heavily on the execution of the theme, and less on technical merit). A bottom 3 and a top 3 are identified from the scoring totals. The judges would then vote on a winner and a loser. The winner would be announced (possibly awarded with immunity or some other advantage) and the loser is eliminated. When there are fewer than 6 editors left the number of editors placed in the bottom/top could be reduced to 2 or all of the contestants would just be voted on and the 1-10 scoring system eliminated. For the final round (be it 2 or 3 editors or what have you) the judges would simply vote on the winner.

Now, this setup works best with about 20 or fewer contestants (without being moderately tweaked) so that would have to be taken into account.

Another crazy thought: could audience voting ever be considered? Was this done in the original P:E? I feel like it could have been but I don't even remember. Either way, maybe this could work, at least for the finale perhaps?
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Re: Project OrgEditor [Recommendation Thread]

Postby CodeZTM » Wed Jul 27, 2011 11:31 pm

@Warlike: Very good suggestion. In the end, I think that I'll be going back to "worst video per round is out", but it's something to consider. :D

@Gotenks: This is likely to be what I end up doing. Well, the 1-10 thing with the rubric behind it for each round. I will attempt this in our "bonus round" after the competition is over, when attempting to do a quick "let's see how well this works" kind of thing. Audience voting is a novel idea, but hard to execute, and not probably something I'd want to attempt.
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Re: Project OrgEditor [Recommendation Thread]

Postby kireblue » Thu Jul 28, 2011 12:48 am

how about alternating the scoring system. Depending on the complexity of the theme each round, the elimination method may change. For example, the first two rounds could be worst video eliminated. The second two could be decided by overall score. Then round 5 (semi finals) elimination could be unknown (Elimination method will be decided by a coin toss after all the videos have been submitted). And the finals (round 6) could be decided by worst video eliminated.
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Re: Project OrgEditor [Recommendation Thread]

Postby CodeZTM » Thu Jul 28, 2011 11:02 am

That is actually dine every now and then with project runway at times. Sometimes they dot send anyone home, and other times they eliminate two designers with particularly terrible designs robin team challenges.

Speaking of which, how did you like the team challenges? I was thinking of making at least one each year.
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Re: Project OrgEditor [Recommendation Thread]

Postby BasharOfTheAges » Thu Jul 28, 2011 11:33 am

CodeZTM wrote:That is actually dine every now and then with project runway at times. Sometimes they dot send anyone home, and other times they eliminate two designers with particularly terrible designs robin team challenges.

Speaking of which, how did you like the team challenges? I was thinking of making at least one each year.

From an outsider perspective I can say that there's a significant difference between being on a TV show where that competition is your life for a few weeks / months / etc. and this contest where you have all these people making stuff in their free time while living their lives. Pairing someone who doesn't have anything going on with someone who happens to be too busy one week isn't really fair; and god forbid if 2 people get paired that have conflicting schedules. It's like giving group projects to a class where half the people are professional students, and the other half work 50 hour weeks and have kids.
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