The Org Redesign - What's wrong with the org?

Re: The Org Redesign - What's wrong with the org?

Postby Nya-chan Production » Thu Nov 25, 2010 9:44 am

Qyot27 wrote:Aside from pointing out the obvious elephant in the room, I don't really see how the 'IRC is too arcane, just like FTP' argument can fly when IRC (or more precisely, xdcc, which still requires logging into the channel and seeing whatever convos are going on at the time) has experienced a boom over the last couple of years for fansubs because of all of BayTSP's crap discouraging people from using BitTorrent to do it.

Because it's mostly said by people for whom it's "too difficult to learn" - aka they don't want to learn it, be it for whatever reason. There are many versions of clients, some even fairly shiny and new and improved regularly, but they just don't know, because they don't care ^^
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Re: The Org Redesign - What's wrong with the org?

Postby BasharOfTheAges » Thu Nov 25, 2010 10:26 pm

godix wrote:I, and a few others, suggested the idea of making videos viewable without logging on. I happened to be releasing a video recently, so I did a very minor experiment just to see what would happen. When I uploaded my latest video, I also put a direct link to megaupload for the thing. It's the exact same file, and the description of the direct download says that (specifically, it says "Same as local, just for those who don't wanna log in to download"). It's been about three weeks since then, so I just checked it's download stats. These will be a little skewed because, at my request, there is no preview of the video which drives a lot of views. Anyway, at the moment, it has 101 local downloads and 60 Direct downloads.

"Direct" is on top. Yes, people are that stupid/lazy/impulsive for that to be a driving factor.
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Re: The Org Redesign - What's wrong with the org?

Postby MycathatesyouAMV » Thu Nov 25, 2010 11:05 pm

Lol I come back after a day and theres 4 more pages.

Anyways, I just want to be able to post a beta that I'm not gonna finish, it's basically just a mini amv I did for fun that I want to get some comments/critique on is basically all there is to it. I feel like that doesn't belong in the Op exchange forum because people take it as "If I comment him, he'll comment me" etc.
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Re: The Org Redesign - What's wrong with the org?

Postby ngsilver » Fri Nov 26, 2010 1:10 am

BasharOfTheAges wrote:
godix wrote:I, and a few others, suggested the idea of making videos viewable without logging on. I happened to be releasing a video recently, so I did a very minor experiment just to see what would happen. When I uploaded my latest video, I also put a direct link to megaupload for the thing. It's the exact same file, and the description of the direct download says that (specifically, it says "Same as local, just for those who don't wanna log in to download"). It's been about three weeks since then, so I just checked it's download stats. These will be a little skewed because, at my request, there is no preview of the video which drives a lot of views. Anyway, at the moment, it has 101 local downloads and 60 Direct downloads.

"Direct" is on top. Yes, people are that stupid/lazy/impulsive for that to be a driving factor.

I don't really notice any direct correlation when it comes to my own videos. It's basically 50/50 split between local and indirect downloads for being the most when it comes to my own videos. Usually when one is higher it gets about 2x as many downloads. This is for all of my videos, so the inclusion of multiple versions (including the local version) or having the same version doesn't seem to be a real factor.
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Re: The Org Redesign - What's wrong with the org?

Postby Nya-chan Production » Fri Nov 26, 2010 12:10 pm

I have only some indirect stuff and they all lose by a lot.

I suppose it's only about how much you prefer indirect/direct downloads and which communities you are known.
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Re: The Org Redesign - What's wrong with the org?

Postby Panky » Fri Nov 26, 2010 1:22 pm

Although a lot of people are used to download from local (like myself), "Direct" sounds way more appealing than indirect or maybe waiting to get a direct link from this site. Megaupload, Rapidshare and others aren't really that direct since you have to either click buttons, enter captchas or wait some time, but they are still entered as direct links. That's probably the biggest reason why I don't personally bother with 'direct' links.
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Re: The Org Redesign - What's wrong with the org?

Postby Kai Stromler » Mon Nov 29, 2010 9:12 am

godix wrote:When I uploaded my latest video, I also put a direct link to megaupload for the thing. It's the exact same file, and the description of the direct download says that (specifically, it says "Same as local, just for those who don't wanna log in to download"). It's been about three weeks since then, so I just checked it's download stats. These will be a little skewed because, at my request, there is no preview of the video which drives a lot of views. Anyway, at the moment, it has 101 local downloads and 60 Direct downloads.

Now I realize this is just one video, without a lot of downloads, and with no preview. So it's hard to say much based on this, but still this strikes me as worth noting. When given a choice, roughly 40% choose to deal with megauploads crap rather than logging into the org. Since the two choices are identical files, things aren't skewed by different quality/format versions or some such. Based on this extremely limited data, I think it's pretty clear a significant portion of viewers do not want to log into the org to download/watch.


I have more data on this, which tends to support this thesis. The last four videos I've done have all been released with both .org and external links (indirect, not direct, since direct wants a link to the actual file rather than a page hosting it), for the following stats:

SH112:
indirect (41)
LOCAL (60)
PREVIEW (58)

SH113:
indirect (23)
LOCAL (35)
PREVIEW (39)

SH114:
indirect (26)
LOCAL (31)
PREVIEW (28)

SH115:
indirect (41)
LOCAL (28)
PREVIEW (41)

The closer totals are likely because these are for the most part pretty .org-unfriendly videos, and more of the traffic is coming from people who run across them from outside searches and don't have an account. Indirect only counts links clicked from here, not actual completion of the download on the external site.

I'm not so sure, though, that godix's conclusion isn't a solution in search of a problem. Obviously, there's a way to make your stuff available to general audiences, even if the implementation sucks (eventually, those links will die due to timeout or copyright claim and need fixing), even with the .org as it is. What this comes down to, essentially, is the question of whether we want to keep access to the reliable, consistent, local server as a member perk, or if we think more people will be brought into the conversation if it's open to just everyone.

The next stage is probably going to be releasing my next video, whenever that gets done, on direct on my own webspace in addition to local and indirect, to see how the inclusion of a legit external direct link to the file changes the numbers. Hosting is cheap enough these days that this may start to be a viable option again, at least for those of us whose works are profoundly unpopular.

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Re: The Org Redesign - What's wrong with the org?

Postby JaddziaDax » Mon Nov 29, 2010 1:21 pm

Random sampling of mine:

Pretty Sparkles: Remixed
DIRECT (689) - AVI version
LOCAL (1238)
PREVIEW (239)

Lovers and Dreamers:
DIRECT (551) - AVI version
DIRECT (562) - same as local
LOCAL (996)
PREVIEW (647)

In the second video, the local servers were down, so I couldn't add the local link right away and opted for the direct link in the meantime. So the direct link has actually been around longer than the local version. The direct link however is in a RAR folder, so this may turn some people away.
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Re: The Org Redesign - What's wrong with the org?

Postby CastielTheFallen » Tue Nov 30, 2010 12:29 am

Jesus Christ that whole chatroom topic was completely asinine.

There is no problem with a chat room in essence, it shouldn't be gone or substituted. Those who don't like the chat room tend to be those who come in, are fucking idiots, and in the process of their stupidity they wind up having the whole room annoyed at them. Or those who simply can't lurk long enough to get into a conversation.

The only problem with the IRC is the 2 faced bullshit that goes on with ops in the room, our rules and how they're enforced, and the way the staff handles these situations. So basically, fucking power tripping bullshit that happens in any and every community where power comes into play.
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Re: The Org Redesign - What's wrong with the org?

Postby Kaream » Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:01 am

BastAmv wrote:
Discount Menu wrote:Also, put in a god damn public social forum. Lack of feedback or public viewership, whatthefuckever, what's keeping this community hog-tied is the fact that you have to go well out of your way to actually make friends in this community.


CodeZTM wrote:
I think we need a new forum section for newcomers to introduce themselves. A "beginners" forum, one might say. I've offered my assistance in getting this set up, and I hope we can get something like this up and working. This way, they can introduce themselves, ask basic questions about the site, and get the endless threads of "WHAR CAN I UPLOAD" and then 4/5 people trolling and Karuido/mirko/mod pointing them in the right direction. The site is intimidating enough without it, and I think it might get some new traffic.

"The Grand Newbie Guide". Kind of like a different version of Kionon and godix's threads, but based around the site's basic functionality and forum attitude. This could be in the aformentioned beginner's forum, and I have no issue with writing it.



Zarxrax wrote:Next, the comment system. Replace the quick comment system with a youtube-like system. Comments should be public. Give the creator the option to disable comments, or make them private only. Should not be anonymous.

Donations. The "pledge" system is extremely confusing, and I believe it actually turns off many potential donators. Get rid of "pledging" altogether, and just let people donate straight up. Make it clear that recurring donations are extremely important. There are so many people who default on their pledge and are then PUNISHED, because they simply did not understand what they were doing. It's not helped by the big wall of text and the fact that many people may not speak english as their native language. Plus, potential payment methods are not even mentioned until after one makes a pledge. Vastly simplify this, and instead of having 3 buttons to choose from, make a temporary waiting period of about 30 seconds, like you see on many file download sites.


Kionon wrote:As I see it our goals should be:

1) Make it easier to find videos.
2) Make it easier to download videos.
3) Make it easier to participate in the forums.
4) Make it easier to go from viewer -> editor.
5) Make it easier to navigate on the site.
No need of reading anything else I said, you'll just waste your time. :aimkissyface:


YES WE CAN.
First off, let me say I didn't expect this day to come in a million years, so I'm really happy with the new ideas and taking this community to the next step. 8-)

Also, I suggest all the mods and admins to take a look at Discount Menu's post on page 2, post 6.

What, Chatrooms?
This is all I stand by. 8-)
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Re: The Org Redesign - What's wrong with the org?

Postby Kaream » Thu Dec 02, 2010 7:19 am

And yeah Beta testing sub-forums sounds like one of the most useless things.
Rather make a random sub-forum where everyone can interact and keep the community flowing.
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Re: The Org Redesign - What's wrong with the org?

Postby Begi » Thu Dec 02, 2010 2:03 pm

BastAmv wrote:And yeah Beta testing sub-forums sounds like one of the most useless things.
Rather make a random sub-forum where everyone can interact and keep the community flowing.


How the fuck will a random sub-forum " keep the community flowing"? Are you fucking stupid? That doesn't help. The main point we were trying to get across with the beta test subforum topic was to try and encourage editors to interact with eachother about AMVs and encourage people to actually make better videos.

The option to watch videos without having to log in is a good idea. I think the preview option would be more appropriate because the fact that the viewer might want to watch a video in it's entirety would actually attract the viewers to register and become members. Also, you could still be able to give star ratings so I think it would work out much nicer.
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Re: The Org Redesign - What's wrong with the org?

Postby Kaream » Thu Dec 02, 2010 10:44 pm

Begi wrote:
BastAmv wrote:And yeah Beta testing sub-forums sounds like one of the most useless things.
Rather make a random sub-forum where everyone can interact and keep the community flowing.


How the fuck will a random sub-forum " keep the community flowing"? Are you fucking stupid? That doesn't help. The main point we were trying to get across with the beta test subforum topic was to try and encourage editors to interact with eachother about AMVs and encourage people to actually make better videos.

The option to watch videos without having to log in is a good idea. I think the preview option would be more appropriate because the fact that the viewer might want to watch a video in it's entirety would actually attract the viewers to register and become members. Also, you could still be able to give star ratings so I think it would work out much nicer.


The only thing I disagree with is the beta testing sub-forum. And Nikola shut the fuck up <3 , in any case you're late and we've been talking about this for ages.
A random sub-forum would encourage "editors to interact with each other" in every way, doesn't have to be about amvs on this site all the time. I know a couple folks get sick of that. A sub forum will encourage closure more fun around the community . I swear this would make the org a much better place rather than a beta-testing forum.
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Re: The Org Redesign - What's wrong with the org?

Postby Begi » Thu Dec 02, 2010 11:28 pm

BastAmv wrote:The only thing I disagree with is the beta testing sub-forum. And Nikola shut the fuck up <3 , in any case you're late and we've been talking about this for ages.
A random sub-forum would encourage "editors to interact with each other" in every way, doesn't have to be about amvs on this site all the time. I know a couple folks get sick of that. A sub forum will encourage closure more fun around the community . I swear this would make the org a much better place rather than a beta-testing forum.


Thanks for twisting my post.
"encourage editors to interact with eachother about AMVs"

If this site wasn't for AMVs, I'm pretty sure the name of the damn website wouldn't include the words "anime music videos" in it . The donator's forum is pretty much everything unreleated to AMVs (even though I am not a donator and don't really know what goes on there). If people are sick of AMVs, why in the living fuck would they come to this site? That makes no sense at all.
And please explain how a random sub-forum would help? If you wanna chat with editors about random bullshit, there is a chatroom for that. If you don't wanna use the chatroom then you should probably give a few bucks to use the donator's forum. We don't want your bullshit spammed all over the front pages of the forum.
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Re: The Org Redesign - What's wrong with the org?

Postby AaronAMV » Thu Dec 02, 2010 11:45 pm

Begi wrote:We don't want your bullshit spammed all over the front pages of the forum.

i found this rather amusing
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