The end of fansubs?

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DTJB
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Post by DTJB » Tue Dec 14, 2004 4:58 pm

I don't think this situation is going to affect fan-subbing that much, even if something does happen because of it. The backbone of American anime fandom was pretty much laid down by the efforts of fans, long before companies like ADV and Streamline Pictures came around. Since then, most U.S. companies use fan-subs as a guide to see which shows would be successful in the U.S. market. I'll be one of the reasons Kodomo no Omocha got picked up was because of it's popularity in the fan-sub community.

One of the major benefits of fan-subs for otaku such as myself is that we get to watch anime that hasn't been (or may never get) licensed yet. If every fan-subber got shut down, our only other option is to become fluent in Japanese and watch everything raw. And not a lot of region 2 anime DVD's have English subtitles on them. Shows like D4 Princess, Rose of Versailles, Maria-sama ga Miteru and Sexy Commando: That's Incredible Masura-San still haven't been picked up yet, and there's no telling if they ever will.
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Post by Corran » Tue Dec 14, 2004 5:49 pm

All the more reason for me to start renting from an online video store such as Net Flix, Greencine, or Blockbuster.

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Post by billy_wires » Tue Dec 14, 2004 11:26 pm

Looks like Corran is the only one who isn't really freaking out about this. Sure, a series may cost hundreds of dollars, but why the hell would you buy the whole thing at once having never seen it? They sell the dvds singularly (occasionally VHS as well :wink: ), and, as Corran said, you can rent them for a small fee. It's not the end of the world, it's just a crackdown.

Even so, there are probably two reasons [MOD42: Website name removed.] is falling under attack:
1. They ([MOD42: Website name removed.]) are extremely popular (less likely). They catalog tons of sites that list even more series, and it becomes easy to get the fansubs. Also, because they broadcast what they do all over the site, search engines like google can pick up the site really quickly. The fanbase for anime is probably a whole lot bigger than any of us realize, and more than likely a lot less ethical.
2. The Japanese companies feel like they are losing money (more likely). These companies produce and release items that cost thousands of dollars to make, and expect to make thousands from licensing.
Forbes Magazine wrote:For exclusive distribution rights to the world outside Japan, ADV pays $1 million to $2.6 million for an anime series and $500,000 to $5 million for a feature film.
However, even though this site appears to be rather ethical and buys the series after viewing the fansubs (as do I: Hellsing, FLCL, Evangelion, Trigun, Cowboy Bebop, and Full Metal Panic just to name a few), the fact of the matter is we make up a small minority of fans, and we make up a small minority of consumers. There are tons of people that keep the fansubs despite the request of the subbers themselves to drop it. There are tons of sites that list licensed series. The company probably feels it is losing money, or they probably wouldn't reach out to attack some free publicity.

That's just my two cents, I guess.
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Post by Scintilla » Tue Dec 14, 2004 11:43 pm

billy_wires wrote:2. The Japanese companies feel like they are losing money (more likely). These companies produce and release items that cost thousands of dollars to make, and expect to make thousands from licensing.
Forbes Magazine wrote:For exclusive distribution rights to the world outside Japan, ADV pays $1 million to $2.6 million for an anime series and $500,000 to $5 million for a feature film.
I don't get that, though. As people have already pointed out, it's often the case that fansubs increase the demand for an R1 release of an anime... wouldn't that make the US companies more eager to get their hands on it, thereby (potentially) making the Japanese companies <i>more</i> money in licensing fees?
And they (the Japanese companies) aren't making money off direct sales to the non-Japanese-speaking audiences anyway... except <i>maybe</i> in the cases of Bandai and Pioneer (Geneon)... :?:
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Post by Corran » Tue Dec 14, 2004 11:51 pm

billy_wires wrote:Looks like Corran is the only one who isn't really freaking out about this.
I not freaking out but I won't lie that I'm concerned. I posted about this in my journal recently. Basically, slightly less than 50% of all the anime DVDs I own are series that I watched fansubbed at one point. The majority of anime I own was purchased from the reactions of others to the fansubs, so they also played an indirect role for me as well. I just wanted to remind people that there is an alternative in case the fansubbing situation gets worse since I didn't see anyone mention anything yet.

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Post by Corran » Wed Dec 15, 2004 12:56 am

Corran wrote:I'm not freaking out but I won't lie and say that I'm not concerned.
...normally I wouldn't double post to edit something but I messd that sentence up badly...

(Despite previewing the post three times. -_-)

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Post by Mroni » Wed Dec 15, 2004 5:59 am

And I would like say corran that your avatar is wackable. Oh yeah and People are going to keep fansubbing so don't worry about the japanese companies. Lets keep an eye on the trials going on here in the U.S


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Post by J-0080 » Thu Dec 16, 2004 2:19 pm

billy_wires wrote: Even so, there are probably two reasons [MOD42: Website name removed.] is falling under attack:
1. They ([MOD42: Website name removed.]) are extremely popular (less likely).
:lol:

Well, 1 out of 2 isn't bad.

Anyway, considering I don't really [read: 4 episodes of 2 shows and 35 of One Piece] watch fan subs at all this doesn't bother me too much, but if I did I don't think I'd be to worried.
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Post by billy_wires » Thu Dec 16, 2004 5:40 pm

J-0080 wrote:
billy_wires wrote: Even so, there are probably two reasons [MOD42: Website name removed.] is falling under attack:
1. They ([MOD42: Website name removed.]) are extremely popular (less likely).
:lol:

Well, 1 out of 2 isn't bad.

Anyway, considering I don't really [read: 4 episodes of 2 shows and 35 of One Piece] watch fan subs at all this doesn't bother me too much, but if I did I don't think I'd be to worried.
HAHAHA. Yeah, I forgot I'm not supposed to say that; a similar discussion is going on elsewhere. My bad.
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Post by paizuri » Thu Dec 16, 2004 6:28 pm

I don't think anyone has mentioned this, but the Akane Maniax OAV, which is one of the properties MFI cited, was released as a fansub before it was even available in Japan. That's just outright piracy seeing as it was never publically broadcast, regardless of whether or not japanese consumers were downloading it.
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