Censorship

This forum is for members to discuss topics that do not relate to anime music videos.

Censorship

Postby CastielTheFallen » Sun Jan 23, 2011 5:00 am

I feel the need to create a topic about the way censorship works around here. The main reason I'm creating this thread is due to the lack of edit button, something that no matter how I think about it, just seems wrong. How many threads have we had now in site suggestions asking for something as standard and simple as a fucking edit button being enabled for everybody, in every forum? Now so far, the only response I've heard to this is "There have been issues in the past regarding people editing posts after flaming/spamming" or something along these lines. Well that's all fine and good, well, no, it isn't. If this is the case, how does this harm things more than it helps? Somebody removed a flame? Good. They either had the sense to realize they shouldn't have said what they said, or they were afraid of being punished. Either way, the problem takes care of itself without the need for a mod or admin to step in.

Now, that said, when I talked to Kio his issue was that he didn't want people getting away with being able to do that. If he was flamed, he'd want that person to be punished or whatever. Fine, you want something done? Take a screencap, or tell a mod/admin and have something done about it. There's always somebody around, right? I mean, this is what I'm told all the time. There are ALWAYS mods and admins around at all times always forever to talk to should you have issue with anything. Right? In all seriousness, if you want something done about an issue like this, you can get it done pretty easily. If the problem takes care of itself, why elevate things just because you got butthurt over a comment that somebody removed anyway? It's nothing more than the admins/mods would do, besides perhaps a warning to go with that, but why bother warning somebody if they've corrected themselves?

Another thing that comes to mind is something I've been noticing in the IRC. Whenever I speak to anybody about drugs in any way, I am always met with warnings from ops saying that talking about drugs is spam or somehow a bad thing or inappropriate to do in the irc. Or that it's irrelevant to most/some of the people in the irc. Take it to PM, blahblahblah what the fuck ever. Well, as far as I know, the IRC is a place to converse with other editors, there should be some type of level of maturity around here, I find it pretty fucking sad that any sort of drug talk automatically gets you flack. That said, it's perfectly fine for Atari and Pas to flood the fuck out of the irc talking about some Starcraft video they're watching. Let me tell you, I am not a starcraft fan, that shit is irrelevant to me, it's nothing but annoying flooding that gets in the way of other conversation in my eyes, but I fucking deal with it.

Where do we draw the lines here as a community? Are we not an artistic community? Too much blood/violence/sex in a video is against the rules here, how the fuck is this a good thing for art? I can understand maybe not hosting hentai videos locally, but anything more than that just feels like my voice as an artist is being hushed. I put this here and not in Site Suggestions because I want some discussion to go on about this and the edit button thread has been made many times by now, it's waste of time to bother posting in there again to me.

Discuss.
Image
DZ|BSP
User avatar
CastielTheFallen
Prodigal Pen-Throttle
 
Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Location: Nowheresville, NJ
Status: Sick & Uninspired

Re: Censorship

Postby Enigma » Sun Jan 23, 2011 6:09 am

Arashinome wrote:I feel the need to create a topic about the way censorship works around here. The main reason I'm creating this thread is due to the lack of edit button, something that no matter how I think about it, just seems wrong. How many threads have we had now in site suggestions asking for something as standard and simple as a fucking edit button being enabled for everybody, in every forum? Now so far, the only response I've heard to this is "There have been issues in the past regarding people editing posts after flaming/spamming" or something along these lines. Well that's all fine and good, well, no, it isn't. If this is the case, how does this harm things more than it helps? Somebody removed a flame? Good. They either had the sense to realize they shouldn't have said what they said, or they were afraid of being punished. Either way, the problem takes care of itself without the need for a mod or admin to step in.


The lack of edit button is quite bothersome, yes. Donating for it isn't really a worthy perk either. The whole "it's not a norm to let you either posts in most forums" is also stupid. Norms are broken and so should this. Because having to post a thread in the mod drop box to change a simple BBCode tag is unnecessary.

Too much blood/violence/sex in a video is against the rules here

This could still be fixed with a simple blood/violence/sex categories. Even tho it'll spawn some overload for VCA contenders and some odd threads in the AMV Recommendations board (not that many people even post there anyway).

Decided to throw my 2 cents, but whatever |:>
User avatar
Enigma
That jolly ol' bastid
 
Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Location: California
Status: Free

Re: Censorship

Postby kenisama » Sun Jan 23, 2011 6:18 am

I understand how you feel, in fact, others have felt the same way. But what I've come to realize is that discussions held over the internet are a moot point.
George Orwell wrote:People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.
User avatar
kenisama
 
Joined: 13 Aug 2004
Location: All Around the World and Back
Status: Ahh Yeah!!!

Re: Censorship

Postby -MD » Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:19 am

I WANT AN EDIT BUTTON ON EVERY FORUM >:|
Image
User avatar
-MD
 
Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Location: Misery
Status: (◕ω◕)

Re: Censorship

Postby -MD » Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:21 am

I meant under every thread ._. oops
Image
User avatar
-MD
 
Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Location: Misery
Status: (◕ω◕)

Re: Censorship

Postby EvaFan » Sun Jan 23, 2011 8:15 am

The restricted art argument seems silly to me, its not like you're not aloud to enter it to the catalog... You're just not aloud to upload it to the org. If you want to release your "blood/violence/sex" art then just provide your own direct links. I think its cause the org doesn't want to be held accountable for what some minor may end up finding that a parent wouldn't want their kid to find. Yes it's silly cause its still the parents fault for not being alert/aware, but the org has every right to take the preventative stance, besides you're not the owner or the one that faces the repercussions in said situation.

IMHO I don't like the rule at all other than the no hentai/sex part, that one makes some sense. The reason I don't agree with it is cause there is no clear definitive for the ruling involving blood/violence/gore. Some mod probably just watches the video and decides it's fate and then most videos just slip by unnoticed until someone drops it in the mod box anyway or posts it in the announcement section. Most kids see worse in movies and games these days regardless. I can't count how many times i've heard the little kid voicing over Left for dead 2 that has blood and gore and flying limbs.

I don't go on the IRC channel so its not fair for me to comment on that part.

I agree that a free edit button would be great everywhere but there are fair arguments on each side and don't care to get involved in it. I just want it cause I make simple mistakes all the times.

Isn't there a way to just be able to show at the bottom of the post that it has been edited and by clicking on that the original post is shown to meet both sides of the argument?
"The people cannot be [...] always, well informed. The part which is wrong will be discontented, in proportion to [...] the facts they misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions, it is lethargy, the forerunner of death to public liberty. What country can preserve its liberties, if it's rulers are not warned [...] that this people preserve the spirit of resistance? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time, with the blood of patriots and tyrants."-Thomas Jefferson
User avatar
EvaFan
 
Joined: 21 Mar 2004
Location: Somerset, KY
Status: (*゚▽゚)o旦~ ー乾杯ー♪

Re: Censorship

Postby BasharOfTheAges » Sun Jan 23, 2011 11:19 am

The gore thing is unique... Mostly in that it's rare to see the kinda gore that is actually banned from local in anime at all. Most civilized countries treat it the same way fundies treat nudity and sex. Japan keeps it out of their all-ages anime, so you really only see it in rare cases and guro hentai.

To the IRC stuff - there are rules about discussing illegal things. They're basically "don't do it." Doesn't seem so difficult to understand, but I guess it is.
Another Anime Convention AMV Contest Coordinator 2008-2014 & Head of the AAC Fan-works Theater - follow us on Twitter: https://twitter.com/#!/AACFanTheater
:sorcerer: :sorcerer: |RD: "Oh, Action!" (side-by-side) | |
User avatar
BasharOfTheAges
Just zis guy, you know?
 
Joined: 14 Sep 2004
Location: Merrimack, NH
Status: Extreeeeeeeeeme

Re: Censorship

Postby CastielTheFallen » Sun Jan 23, 2011 11:27 am

BasharOfTheAges wrote:To the IRC stuff - there are rules about discussing illegal things. They're basically "don't do it." Doesn't seem so difficult to understand, but I guess it is.


Since when is it illegal to talk about drugs? Last I checked, it wasn't.

but its all cool when alcohol is the subject matter at hand, GOTTA GET YOUR DRINK ON AMIRITE?!
Image
DZ|BSP
User avatar
CastielTheFallen
Prodigal Pen-Throttle
 
Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Location: Nowheresville, NJ
Status: Sick & Uninspired

Re: Censorship

Postby Fall_Child42 » Sun Jan 23, 2011 11:46 am

A report button does please both sides of the edit button argument and offer some additional benefits.

On one side of the edit button argument people want to edit their posts, add information and make small corrections.

Some will say "use the preview function." We are human, sometimes we make mistakes, and sometimes we forget some information until after the post has been made. It would be nice to add or correct that information later. I still condone the preview function, but there are cases when being able to change the post after the fact would be very helpful.

Those against the edit button say it would allow people who are flaming to get away with it since they could change their post before a mod sees proof they did anything wrong. This does make sense, however I believe the "Report this post button" solve this problem.

I do not know how the report post button work on the org, but Ideally it should send a copy of the post to the mod's inbox.
A Report this post button that sends a copy of the post directly to the moderator's inbox, would mean that even if the post was edited later the mods would have a copy of the initial offending post. They could look at it and decide what actions need to be taken. If this was combined with a small indicator at the bottom of any post that allows everyone to see that it's been edited (much like the video information page on the org) Then the mods would know that the person has been backtracking.

How does the report this post button work?
Does it send a copy of the post to the mod's box or just a link to the post?
If it does not send a copy, would it be difficult to change it so it does?

If it sent a copy, I think the argument supporting a lack of an edit button would disappear.
Image
User avatar
Fall_Child42
has a rock
 
Joined: 11 Aug 2004
Location: Jurassic Park
Status: Veloci-tossin' to the max!

Re: Censorship

Postby BasharOfTheAges » Sun Jan 23, 2011 12:00 pm

Arashinome wrote:
BasharOfTheAges wrote:To the IRC stuff - there are rules about discussing illegal things. They're basically "don't do it." Doesn't seem so difficult to understand, but I guess it is.


Since when is it illegal to talk about drugs? Last I checked, it wasn't.

Who said it was illegal to talk about drugs? It's against the rules to talk about illegal things though. If you were talking about talking about drugs (i.e. talking about a conversation after it happened and that conversation was about drugs) then what you just said would make sense. That's not what happens though, so it doesn't.

Rules of private organizations are different from laws. Foremost so in that they aren't constrained by any sort of rights you think you might have.
Another Anime Convention AMV Contest Coordinator 2008-2014 & Head of the AAC Fan-works Theater - follow us on Twitter: https://twitter.com/#!/AACFanTheater
:sorcerer: :sorcerer: |RD: "Oh, Action!" (side-by-side) | |
User avatar
BasharOfTheAges
Just zis guy, you know?
 
Joined: 14 Sep 2004
Location: Merrimack, NH
Status: Extreeeeeeeeeme

Re: Censorship

Postby NME » Sun Jan 23, 2011 12:38 pm

If you have any faith in a leader who charges you 10 dollars a year to edit your posts and to post on this craphole of a phpBB you deserve a leader as fucking shitty as Phade. We are all the problem until we all speak up and demand a better community.

That's basically it. Most of you are too conformist to be able to even care about this problem though, as many of you straight up lack the mental ability to think along divergent lines. I know this is pretty much the problem with society at large and its inability to adopt new ideas - too many conformist brains. You'll pay your fee to someone who did nothing but get some hosting together and cobble a broken shit database system together. You'll grin your shit-eating grin because 10 dollars is nothing to you. You'll feel content, fat and happy in the first world that you have expendable income to give to someone who is too greedy to do something like this out of love and his own pocketbook. The fact is Phade started charging for access to fan created videos. This is wrong. As far as I'm concerned he doesn't deserve to run a community he has stolen from under the guise of paying for hosting. Bandwidth is cheap as fuck and Phade is a comfortably middle class man. He has a kid. Greed.

This is what happens when you put dollar signs on art. Isn't it fitting that the best AMVs are coming from places that allow and encourage actual artistic expression these days? Russian AMV scene has only grown while ours has died.

This is purely due to policy decisions.

Also, LMFAO @ all the people who think talking about illegal things is illegal and needs to be censored. This is fear dictating policy again. There is no such thing as free speech anyway when you get down to brass tacks, but that's the meatspace world. This is the internet, the only thing that can hurt you here is yourself and your own perception of the words of another. Blocking off the ugly parts of anything instead of dealing with them openly is moronic. There is no reason to attempt to control our behaviour in this way, it does not make an inviting community.

The people who run this site and the IRC channel are afraid, they should be because they are confused; we all are on some level. We've got to be open and communicate with each other if we want this confusion to lessen though. You're not going to make people less confused by locking expression down though. Ya'll monkeys is brainwashed and it hurts me to see this shit get spewed out from your fingers like it's more meaningful than the sad childish charade it actually is. Fuckin' infantile thought process of the administrator is strangling innovation and the amount of cooks (not chefs, mind you) in the IRC are spoiling the broth.

It's sad to see all the banners made trying to get people to join this site - all that hard work and skill is basically for naught because the community cares, but the admin doesn't give a fuck and we're all suffering and getting a sub-par community because of it.

TL;DR - Phade is a moron with no leadership ability who has installed puppet after puppet to run this site, his puppets have been failures because they've been very little but yes men and pederasts who openly broke rules (big up cross da pond sex drugs n rock n roll massiv!)

If you want a better community it's time to stand up and shout that THIS MUST END.
nil per os
NME
 
Joined: 13 Jul 2001
Location: Far Country
Status: nauseating bliss

Re: Censorship

Postby godix » Sun Jan 23, 2011 1:19 pm

Power to the people!

But lord, does it have to be THESE people?





WOOHOO! EDITED! THE PEOPLE WIN!
Image
User avatar
godix
a disturbed member
 
Joined: 03 Aug 2002

Re: Censorship

Postby Otohiko » Sun Jan 23, 2011 1:26 pm

Wait, so let me get this straight. This is a thread about censorship, but the actual complaint is about the inability to censor yourself? Wat?
By the way, I support the idea of editing buttons being available to everyone - or more accurately, I'm ambivalent to it. I honestly don't think there's been any serious precedent lately that would justify a strong position on them in either direction.

As far as the IRC and drugs - how many discussions have we had about those? Honestly, I think as long as you stop short of "hey go try this buddy", it's fine. Just don't be telling people who are not of legal age the what/how or otherwise encouraging them. Legal or not (and yes, sure, I can see how ops/mods would use that as an argument, even if it's not the crux of the issue), it's just not ethical or in any sense cool to be telling minors to do weed or anyone where/how to go find some on a public discussion forum. In that sense, alcohol is much on the same level and honestly, all things considered, I fail to see how 'light' drugs are treated differently in IRC discussions than alcohol or tobacco. We've probably had more (rational) discussions of the former than the latter. So don't get into victim mentality here - yeah, some people do throw a pissy fit over it, but I wouldn't count the ops and administration among them, as long as it's kept at a rational level. For all it's worth, it's not #drugs, and we'd like to at least keep any mention of it a diversion rather than a topic of contention.
Otohiko
 
Joined: 05 May 2003

Re: Censorship

Postby AaronAMV » Sun Jan 23, 2011 3:01 pm

tl;dr

f*ck all of y'all
Image
User avatar
AaronAMV
eating that e. coli spinach
 
Joined: 22 Jan 2008
Location: (◔ ◡ ◔ )
Status: (◔ ◡ ◔ )

Re: Censorship

Postby kenisama » Sun Jan 23, 2011 3:49 pm

Otohiko wrote:Wait, so let me get this straight. This is a thread about censorship, but the actual complaint is about the inability to censor yourself? Wat?


LMAO, loved this!

BTW... :bzz: welcome to teh interwebz everyone :bzz2: all your arguments are now invalidz :dino:
George Orwell wrote:People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.
User avatar
kenisama
 
Joined: 13 Aug 2004
Location: All Around the World and Back
Status: Ahh Yeah!!!

Next

Return to General Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: macchinainterna and 1 guest