Converting 120 FPS to 24 or 30 FPS

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Qyot27
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Postby Qyot27 » Wed Nov 15, 2006 2:30 pm

Willen wrote:The only thing that gets me is that the programs are broadcast at 29.97 fps (actually 59.94 fields per second, interlaced). Why not keep it all at 29.97 fps OR do IVTC and release at 23.976 fps instead of doing 119.88 fps VFR?

I would assume it's to preserve the motion of the 29.97 segments alongside having an IVTC-ish effect on the 23.976 segments. Sort of along the same rationale that if possible, don't simply deinterlace or field-match something - do an IVTC instead, except if one does that on footage that's supposed to be 29.97 the motion can potentially get sacrificed. Like I'd mentioned though, considering how null frames are treated by video decoding software, it would only be necessary to insert them into non-29.97fps segments to make everything 29.97.

I guess what gets me more is why wonky 120fps AVIs are even made anymore when newer containers can properly handle VFR content. From the little bit that I read about how 120fps AVIs are made, it's more trouble to do that than to just concatenate 23.976 and 29.97 video streams together into an MKV or MP4 (I've never actually done that with MP4, though, I've just heard that it can handle VFR also).

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Postby Gepetto » Thu Nov 16, 2006 5:17 am

Qyot27 wrote:I guess what gets me more is why wonky 120fps AVIs are even made anymore when newer containers can properly handle VFR content. From the little bit that I read about how 120fps AVIs are made, it's more trouble to do that than to just concatenate 23.976 and 29.97 video streams together into an MKV or MP4 (I've never actually done that with MP4, though, I've just heard that it can handle VFR also).


In general, fansubbers aren't the smartest people around (at least not most of the ones I've ever talked to). If they don't know that they can mix different framerates in MKV, they'll continue to do 120fps AVIs. In fact, most of them think that the only practical advantage of MKV over AVI (other than accepting x.264) is the possibility of softsubbing the episodes. A great surprise, considering that they needn't go further than the Wikipedia to find out three times as much about any container.

I didn't know that they broadcasted CG at a different framerate o.o but in some cases, there's a great chance Bashar's e-penis theory is also valid.
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Qyot27
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Postby Qyot27 » Thu Nov 16, 2006 10:43 pm

Gepetto wrote:In general, fansubbers aren't the smartest people around (at least not most of the ones I've ever talked to). If they don't know that they can mix different framerates in MKV, they'll continue to do 120fps AVIs. In fact, most of them think that the only practical advantage of MKV over AVI (other than accepting x.264) is the possibility of softsubbing the episodes. A great surprise, considering that they needn't go further than the Wikipedia to find out three times as much about any container.

Well actually, it's the RAW cappers being talked about here. I've never seen any 120fps fansubs.

And if they don't know that MKV can handle VFR, sometimes they still make 120fps MKVs (and to add insult to injury, these are sometimes even 120fps, upscaled, WMV9 VCM encodes in MKV).

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Postby Willen » Fri Nov 17, 2006 3:44 am

Qyot27 wrote:And if they don't know that MKV can handle VFR, sometimes they still make 120fps MKVs (and to add insult to injury, these are sometimes even 120fps, upscaled, WMV9 VCM encodes in MKV).

I think the RAW cappers just want to over-complicate things on purpose. I don't see why they cant just cap a 29.97 fps broadcast at 29.97 fps and leave it at that (codec and container is up to the capper). And don't get me started on upscaling...
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Postby Gepetto » Fri Nov 17, 2006 8:32 am

Qyot27 wrote:120fps, upscaled, WMV9 VCM encodes in MKV).


There is a reason why people commit suicide and I think you just nailed it.
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Postby ReligionX » Sat Nov 18, 2006 1:11 pm

Gepetto wrote:
Qyot27 wrote:120fps, upscaled, WMV9 VCM encodes in MKV).


There is a reason why people commit suicide and I think you just nailed it.

I've just decided that technology will simplify this problem on it's own, where it will eventually be another one of those processes that I take for granted. 6 years ago, I wasn't able to edit with ANY footage that I could find, and now it's a rarity that I would come across something that I can't render properly.

I have decided that it is in fact the source footage that is giving me problems, and I am able to cleanly edit with and render other h264 120FPS footage.

I thank you for all of your possible solutions and suggestions. I actually did try each suggestion, 2 and 3 times, to no avail I was hoping to take the easy way into editing. Instead of killing myself over this matter, I am working on a different project.

Again, if someone is absolutely gung ho about resolving this problem, and really thinks that they can turn out a non-choppy version of this footage using AVISynth (if you develop scripts for AVISynth) I've definately got some project footage here for you to play with.

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Postby Moonie » Sat Nov 18, 2006 2:28 pm

h.264 120fps footage... >_<

If all else fails try this.

Convert the video to another codec using Graphedit (keeping the 120fps framerate) Then open the new video in Virtualdub
Go to "video" then select "frame rate"
Uncheck "Process all frames" and select "Convert to fps" then put in 29.970
Then save the video.
That might work. Here is an example with some 120fps footage i had

Before:
http://download.yousendit.com/2F87FA5A517F0184
After:
http://download.yousendit.com/9B79E7DB072DC901
ImageImageImage
ImageImageImage


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