60 FPS

This forum is for questions and discussion of all the aspects of handling your footage. If you have questions about capturing/ripping footage, AviSynth, or compression/encoding/converting, look here.

60 FPS

Postby JudgeHolden » Wed Dec 01, 2010 1:33 am

How do you convert progressive footage to 60 FPS without field blending? :dino:

Edit: I should say that what I want to do in the end is slow down my footage in my editor and still have it look smooth. :ying:
ImageImageImageImage
User avatar
JudgeHolden
 
Joined: 14 Mar 2005
Location: The great white north (Minneapolis)
Status: Looking at you through your window!

Re: 60 FPS

Postby Pwolf » Wed Dec 01, 2010 2:07 am

not very easily. You'd have to interpolate which is basically letting the computer try to "guess" what's between the frames. assuming a perfect 23.976 video source, that's letting the computer "guess" on 36.024 frames in a second. While other editors have done it (see nostromo's videos and even the 60fps Skittles), the animation looks "jello-y" and in no way natural. This can be done using commercial products such as Twixtor or using Avisynth.

In some interlaced source cases, you can separate the fields as separate frames. This gives you double the frame count but you get half the frame height so you have to resize it and stretch it back. This works better with live action sources but not so well with animation as you see the defects a lot more. This can be done in avisynth.
ImageImage
ImageImage
Like the AMV .Org App? Think about donating to help me make it better.
User avatar
Pwolf
Friendly Neighborhood Pwaffle
 
Joined: 03 May 2001
Location: Some where in California, I forgot :\

Re: 60 FPS

Postby Pwolf » Wed Dec 01, 2010 3:00 am

Here's a quick example of doing it in avisynth:

http://www.pwolfamv.com/other/Avisynth% ... lation.mp4

The results look worse the faster the movement across the frame. Twixtor does it a little bit better IMO but creates a more fluid type movement which will create the more jello like look. Both look terrible though. I looked into doing this for a video I had in mind and not being able to get the smooth slow motion I wanted ended up killing the project for me.
ImageImage
ImageImage
Like the AMV .Org App? Think about donating to help me make it better.
User avatar
Pwolf
Friendly Neighborhood Pwaffle
 
Joined: 03 May 2001
Location: Some where in California, I forgot :\

Re: 60 FPS

Postby mirkosp » Wed Dec 01, 2010 9:55 am

And then there's the hard working man way: REDRAWAN!

If you really really need to slow down that bad and twixtor and mvtools just don't do it right, redrawing is about the only thing you can do.
Image
User avatar
mirkosp
MODkip
 
Joined: 24 Apr 2006
Location: Gallarate (VA), Italy
Status: (」・ワ・)」(⊃・ワ・)⊃

Re: 60 FPS

Postby Pwolf » Wed Dec 01, 2010 4:01 pm

mirkosp wrote:And then there's the hard working man way: REDRAWAN!

If you really really need to slow down that bad and twixtor and mvtools just don't do it right, redrawing is about the only thing you can do.


You might be able to get away with using interpolation and then just redrawing the bad frames via masking and such in AE. A lot of work but if you absolutely need the slow motion effect, then it would be worth it i think.
ImageImage
ImageImage
Like the AMV .Org App? Think about donating to help me make it better.
User avatar
Pwolf
Friendly Neighborhood Pwaffle
 
Joined: 03 May 2001
Location: Some where in California, I forgot :\

Re: 60 FPS

Postby mirkosp » Wed Dec 01, 2010 4:11 pm

Another thing you can try is using mvtools or twixtor to interpolate the framerate like up to 9001fps, then blending and motion-blurring the frames together. That might hide the bad interpolation and perhaps give a more natural feel too, somehow.
Image
User avatar
mirkosp
MODkip
 
Joined: 24 Apr 2006
Location: Gallarate (VA), Italy
Status: (」・ワ・)」(⊃・ワ・)⊃

Re: 60 FPS

Postby Phantasmagoriat » Wed Dec 01, 2010 4:30 pm

viewtopic.php?f=53&t=102247

Yeah, animation is a pain to frame-interpolate. Particularly with complex motion like what pwolf posted, although you can see it worked alright for some of the subtle movement.
I should probably add that FI usually works best when using even multiples of the original framerate (in this case 47.952fps), then use assumefps() to slow things down again.

Live footage is much easier though. Actually, sometimes I'll Frame-interpolate on-the-fly with MPC+Avisynth so I can use my computer monitor in place of one of those fancy 60Hz TV's :pizza:


mirkosp wrote:Another thing you can try is using mvtools or twixtor to interpolate the framerate like up to 9001fps, then blending and motion-blurring the frames together. That might hide the bad interpolation and perhaps give a more natural feel too, somehow.
Another option that usually gets overlooked is to simply use duplicate frames. I know that sounds contrary to what we are trying to achieve here, but since animation is already made up of many duplicates, sometimes you can get away with it. Even if it doesn't look as fluid, as least you don't get ugly warped frames. Most of nostromo's work is a combination of interpolated frames (whenever it's possible) and duplicates (when it's not possible). Plus it's waaay easier to scrap scenes that don't interpolate properly, instead of fighting with the animation to make it work.
Image
Org Profile | AMVGuide | Phan Picks! | THE424SHOW | YouTube | "Galactic Escape"

"Effort to Understand; Effort to be Understood; to See through Different Eyes."
User avatar
Phantasmagoriat
 
Joined: 06 Feb 2006
Status: ☁SteamPunked≈☂

Re: 60 FPS

Postby Mister Hatt » Tue Dec 14, 2010 7:30 pm

I've done this with mocha, perl, imagemagick, and ffmpeg >_>

Wouldn't recommend it though.
Mister Hatt
 
Joined: 25 Dec 2007
Status: better than you

Re: 60 FPS

Postby Mister Hatt » Tue Dec 14, 2010 7:33 pm

TL Note: Someone join these two posts, orz.

You can actually achieve this, although it won't be smooth, with a soft telecine. It can also be done with mvtools in avisynth by building a motion mask, and then interpolating the frames in between. Hopefully you can do this better than whatever idiot attempted a blend-conversion on the Angel Beats PV. That thing was awful and I had to freezeframe 2 out of every 3 frames. Just saying, it almost always looks bad to do what you're asking.
Mister Hatt
 
Joined: 25 Dec 2007
Status: better than you


Return to Footage Help

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests