Artifacts in Anime/Toon Footage

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Re: Artifacts in Anime/Toon Footage

Postby Mister Hatt » Tue Sep 28, 2010 6:20 pm

You are nuking your footage with that filterchain. I think you know what that means. You need to revise your filtering (:EFFORT:) or not filter at all (:LAZYMODO:). I would suggest the latter. A high motion vid won't even let the footage make a difference to you really, so it's not all that big a deal. Unfiltered video ALWAYS looks better than overfiltered.
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Re: Artifacts in Anime/Toon Footage

Postby Anno-san » Tue Sep 28, 2010 7:09 pm

^
I used TemporalDegrain because the filter was severely grainy. If temporaldegrain isn't the right filter to fix this (assuming the problem even is grain) then suggest another filter. If I'm overfiltering then please make some specific script change suggestions.

Also stop calling me "lazy" and making statements about my character. I could do the same to others on this forum but I don not. Argue points and don't post insulting or offensive statements.
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Re: Artifacts in Anime/Toon Footage

Postby mirkosp » Tue Sep 28, 2010 8:02 pm

He didn't say you're lazy. He just suggested you should be in this case because the effort would probably be not worth it. That's up to you to decide, though.
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Re: Artifacts in Anime/Toon Footage

Postby Mister Hatt » Wed Sep 29, 2010 1:02 am

Also, about grain, a good friend of mine wrote about how grain is not a defect: read it.
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Re: Artifacts in Anime/Toon Footage

Postby mirkosp » Wed Sep 29, 2010 9:02 am

Mister Hatt wrote:Also, about grain, a good friend of mine wrote about how grain is not a defect: read it.

Grain isn't a defect, but I think in this case he just meant actual noise and just didn't call it properly. Refer to this screenshot. Does show noise aside for the bad chroma subsampling.
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Re: Artifacts in Anime/Toon Footage

Postby Mister Hatt » Wed Sep 29, 2010 3:53 pm

Word, that is indeed noise and not grain. People should word their posts correctly.
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Re: Artifacts in Anime/Toon Footage

Postby post-it » Sat Oct 02, 2010 5:26 pm

Mister Hatt wrote:Word, that is indeed noise and not grain.
People should word their posts correctly.


.. An Example of Picture(s) should be posted .. showing what each article is being talked about.
.. it is a simple way to narrow-down where the problem might be :beer:

.. just an opinion

P.S. .. words fail too many times; You already know that from my transliterations on this board.
[ and yeah, it might be a little 1960'ish to do things with pictures but; everyone knew what we
were talking about back then .. today, people HAVE TO ASK, "know what I mean?" while they themselves
are trying to explain what THEY are trying to say: I don't like it but, the medium we're call communication
seems to be breaking-down from Improperly Identifiable Wordings. Even the 800 AD Church's understood
that Pictures could Identify what the commoners could not pronounce. ]
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Re: Artifacts in Anime/Toon Footage

Postby Mister Hatt » Sat Oct 02, 2010 11:37 pm

I've explained it often enough. Grain is of a uniform size and only impacts the luma channel. It is usually constant but sometimes changes across frames. Noise is uneven in size, often has coloured tints like purple, green, and red, and is often quite blocky. They are easy to tell apart. Dirt is a type of small eneven noise on fine edges, like the points of hair. It usually sits in the luma channel though. Anything else?
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Re: Artifacts in Anime/Toon Footage

Postby post-it » Sun Oct 03, 2010 2:36 pm

.. nope; that's as direct as possible. 'me need-um a dirt remover!

^_^ .. THx
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Re: Artifacts in Anime/Toon Footage

Postby mirkosp » Mon Oct 04, 2010 2:26 pm

Mister Hatt wrote:I've explained it often enough. Grain is of a uniform size and only impacts the luma channel. It is usually constant but sometimes changes across frames. Noise is uneven in size, often has coloured tints like purple, green, and red, and is often quite blocky. They are easy to tell apart. Dirt is a type of small eneven noise on fine edges, like the points of hair. It usually sits in the luma channel though. Anything else?

Scratches, which happen in old footage, or are used these days as an "old looking" effect.
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Re: Artifacts in Anime/Toon Footage

Postby Mister Hatt » Tue Oct 05, 2010 1:18 am

Film clumps and scratches are obvious as all hell though :V
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Re: Artifacts in Anime/Toon Footage

Postby Anno-san » Tue Oct 05, 2010 10:23 am

What does everyone find so great about ZarX264GUI? MeGUI is much more customizable and powerful imo.
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Re: Artifacts in Anime/Toon Footage

Postby Qyot27 » Tue Oct 05, 2010 11:12 am

Anno-san wrote:What does everyone find so great about ZarX264GUI? MeGUI is much more customizable and powerful imo.

That's sort of the point - Zarx264gui is meant as a simple transcoder for users that are intimidated by/complained about MeGUI's complexity (or at least it started out that way). It also tended to stay closer to x264's settings parity while MeGUI languished in development hell for months and got outpaced by a metric assload of x264's options.

I don't know where MeGUI's current parity with x264 is, as I think it was picked up again a couple times. But by that point I'd pretty much eschewed GUI solutions entirely, only using them as a springboard for CLI settings (and even that got minimized by the introduction of the preset/tune system in x264's CLI, although I do some preset overrides).
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Re: Artifacts in Anime/Toon Footage

Postby mirkosp » Tue Oct 05, 2010 11:15 am

Anno-san wrote:What does everyone find so great about ZarX264GUI? MeGUI is much more customizable and powerful imo.

It uses JEEB's x264. And if you know what you're doing you can customize it completely all the same. Considering that using x264 directly from command line is faster than using it from any gui, most encoders actually don't use either, so GUIs end up being for people that just know only in part how to encode, which means that in reality having a simple gui with just the options you really need to tweak instead of leaving something in the wrong hands is better.

EDIT: Heh, Qyot was faster. :P
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Re: Artifacts in Anime/Toon Footage

Postby Qyot27 » Tue Oct 05, 2010 11:46 am

I should probably also make it clear that I do think there's essentially three types of options in apps like x264, when considering GUI design:
A) options you should or must alter
B) options that are a matter of preference on whether to alter
C) options you shouldn't alter (which are only used by those who really know what they're doing, and which are probably at their defaults for an extremely good reason, thus altering them isn't recommended no matter who you are)

A GUI should provide access to A and B, but not C. The aid of a GUI is to make it easier to customize A and B, while leaving C alone so you don't screw yourself over. To frame this in light of Zarx264gui, MeGUI, and x264's CLI, Zarx264gui probably lies between A and B (some B options exposed, but not all), MeGUI is probably firmly in the B area or between B and C. x264's CLI is in the A, B, and C camps depending on how you configure it (preset/tune is definitely A, preset overrides can be on B or C level).
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