X Ghosts - Interested?

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X Ghosts - Interested?

Postby Bauzi » Thu Dec 10, 2009 10:11 am

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Hey guys,

I was thinking about some sort of MEP idea. You know I was lately listening to NIN music again and I thought about starting a small little project. It's like a collection of short amvs. The core idea is simple as that. Really.

The second core theme around this idea is the album Ghosts I-IV by Nine Inch Nails. This free album is a collection of instrumental songs by Trent Reznor (man behind the project NiN). A pretty interesting album because of it's great diversity.

You can download the album legaly and free from this website:
http://www.archive.org/details/nineinch ... hosts_I_IV

Nine Inch Nails presents Ghosts I - IV, a brand new 36 track instrumental collection available right now. Almost two hours of new music composed and recorded over an intense ten week period last fall, Ghosts I - IV sprawls Nine Inch Nails across a variety of new terrain.

Trent Reznor explains, "I've been considering and wanting to make this kind of record for years, but by its very nature it wouldn't have made sense until this point. This collection of music is the result of working from a very visual perspective - dressing imagined locations and scenarios with sound and texture; a soundtrack for daydreams. I'm very pleased with the result and the ability to present it directly to you without interference. I hope you enjoy the first four volumes of Ghosts."


+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

This is just an interest gauge thread, but I 'll tell you how I imagine this MEP/collection of short amvs:

-No track is longer than 2 minutes or shorter than 30 seconds. Of yours this point is always discussable if somebody needs more or less time.

-Effects. Not really effects needed, but it's a goal to make a track as visual tasty and interesting as possible. Effects can help. Think about designs and concepts =) Artsy and stuff...

-Interesting sources. Allowed are: anime, hentai (please artsy and not to perfedic!), original animation, games (be aware that old games might not fit the quality standards because of the low graphical quality they have), original animation and yes: Life Action.

Still the goal is to host this video on the org. That means 50%+ must be a-m-v.org source related. A 18+ video is not the goal, but if for artsy reasons this video happens to be this way than I let it be it. There might be also a censored/org friendly version too.

Sources I will reject unless you can really really confince me that your track is something special even with this footage: Final Fantasy, FInal Fantasy AC/Crises Core etc, Naruto, Bleach, Inujasha, Kingdom Hearts… Oh I probably forgot a lot to mention.

Why do I reject them? Because I dislike them. Deal with it! There is still the chance to convince me. Good luck ;)

-There won't be a mix. Yes there won't be a fix mix for this project. Everybody is free to choose every song from the album and use it (a song can only be used once). The album is a great atmospheric work. There really is no need for a mix, because the mood of the album is already alright. There might be even no transitions. That's why this is more a collection of videos, than a regular MEP as we all imagine it.

-I have the right to reject a track. Don't think that just because you made a track you're automaticly in. I think a lot of projects miss a strong coordinator behind it who just can say no to bad tracks. Remember AMV Hell 4! A strong hand should have rejected a lot of Deathnote clips for the sake of the quality of the project.

So I play the Nazi role in this game, but trust me: At least I will give you feedback and all sort of infos needed that such rejections won't happen. Refer to the paragraph about effects and design and you won't have any troubles.


-Technical site: Widescreen. 60fps. SD-ressolution (unless everybody uses at least 720p footage)

60fps: gives us a lot of visual possibilities and sexyness. However you're not supposed to edit in 60fps. If you're fine with 30fps for your track than do so and I will adjust the framerate at the end mix. However I encourage everybody who uses original animation or motion effects to use 60fps. Thx.

-Absolut deadline: Begin June 2010, because afterwards I might be a hell of a busy person and that would delay the release by months.

Why is it called X Ghosts? X will stand for the numbers of tracks we will finaly have in this project.

So… How do you like the idea? Any feedback, questions, comments, interests?

This MEP will be started with at least 4 participants/tracks (including myself).
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Re: X Ghosts - Interested?

Postby Otohiko » Thu Dec 10, 2009 10:20 am

Would probably maybe potentially be interested, given the material at hand.
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Re: X Ghosts - Interested?

Postby godix » Thu Dec 10, 2009 12:41 pm

I haven't listened to Ghosts since it came out, but from what I can recall of it, I'd be interested
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Re: X Ghosts - Interested?

Postby Enigma » Thu Dec 10, 2009 1:04 pm

I want in :up:
Last edited by Enigma on Thu Dec 10, 2009 2:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: X Ghosts - Interested?

Postby Chez » Thu Dec 10, 2009 1:07 pm

I'd be a little interested, i'd need to know deadlines and what not but i could try my hand a little.
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Re: X Ghosts - Interested?

Postby Emotive » Thu Dec 10, 2009 2:34 pm

Sounds like it could have potential. But what's with the 60 fps thing? I find such technological progression to be quite the mood-killer sometimes, like "oooo look at the pretty thing moving fast" instead of " ;_; hold me teddy bear.", and this mep seems like it should be more about the teddy bear part.
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Re: X Ghosts - Interested?

Postby Enigma » Thu Dec 10, 2009 2:47 pm

Emotive wrote:Sounds like it could have potential. But what's with the 60 fps thing? I find such technological progression to be quite the mood-killer sometimes, like "oooo look at the pretty thing moving fast" instead of " ;_; hold me teddy bear.", and this mep seems like it should be more about the teddy bear part.


Seeing Emotive in such pain is unacceptable ! I DEMAND this to be 100,100 and 15 fps.
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Re: X Ghosts - Interested?

Postby Bauzi » Thu Dec 10, 2009 2:50 pm

Chez wrote:I'd be a little interested, i'd need to know deadlines and what not but i could try my hand a little.

Deadline is around the begin of June 2010. If we won't reach it, it will delayed until the beginning of August due to some local convention stuff I have to do (like contest organizing :) ).

Sounds like it could have potential. But what's with the 60 fps thing? I find such technological progression to be quite the mood-killer sometimes, like "oooo look at the pretty thing moving fast" instead of " ;_; hold me teddy bear.", and this mep seems like it should be more about the teddy bear part.

Actually you're right and I forgot about the mood thing. Cinema will be 24fps for ages just for one good reason: It was always this way. Sounds silly, right? However we are so much used to <30fps rates that rates of 50fps and more look unreal and strange too use. It has this kind of amateur look for use (Blairwitch Project). Cinema remains 24fps because of estetic reasons.

You bring up a really good point and I will definatly consider this. I thought 60fps could be usefull for effect motion and stuff like noise. Maybe we keep it 60fps for parts that benifit from it and the rest is just upspeed 30fps? Ei... this is really a dilema. Let me think about it, because the mood thingy is very important. What I can say (my personal experience) is that you notice 60fps only if you tweak with velocity settings of your clips and custom effects with motion.
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Re: X Ghosts - Interested?

Postby godix » Thu Dec 10, 2009 3:15 pm

Bauzi wrote:What I can say (my personal experience) is that you notice 60fps only if you tweak with velocity settings of your clips and custom effects with motion.

To quote your original post: "Not really effects needed". I got the impression the entire point isn't eye candy. If I got that wrong, then I withdraw my interest. I don't want to be in another eyecandy only MEP. This isn't Ayumix after all, hopefully this will actually be entertaining.

Also, we deal with anime which is often as low as 12 fps if you actually look at what frames change. 60 FPS can look really nice if done right, as nostro has proved, but how many people are going to go to the effort of doing it right? Adding assumefps(60) to a script is not doing it right, but I'll bet that's exactly what most people would do. I know that's all I'd do at least.
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Re: X Ghosts - Interested?

Postby Dar » Thu Dec 10, 2009 3:53 pm

Well id definetly be interested in watching it :lol:
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Re: X Ghosts - Interested?

Postby Enigma » Thu Dec 10, 2009 4:00 pm

Still,I'd be nice if u could make it 24fps or 23.976,60 is just ;_;
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Re: X Ghosts - Interested?

Postby ExSphere » Thu Dec 10, 2009 4:38 pm

I'm all over this like a fat kid eating a cupcake. And I think a full mep in 60 fps would look stunning. :up:
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Re: X Ghosts - Interested?

Postby Bauzi » Thu Dec 10, 2009 4:50 pm

To quote your original post: "Not really effects needed". I got the impression the entire point isn't eye candy. If I got that wrong, then I withdraw my interest.

What do you define as eye candy?

I want the tracks to be interesting. You can appeal this with designs and effects or an interesting story line. I for myself will most likely try to achieve this with playing around in effects. I would prefer tracks where the effects make sense and are good. Uhm I would call Koop's Twilight as interesting. It might not be perfect, but it really got my interest. I just wanted to know what happens next.

What I would like to avoid are tracks that threw the shiny effects in your face when they don't really give the concept in the track anything. ...and if the point of the track are effects well than let them be atmospharical, not chessy and some sort of original.

Thx for pointing out. I will work this definition more out.

Still,I'd be nice if u could make it 24fps or 23.976,60 is just ;_;

I won't make it 23.976 or 29.97 because I made bad experiences with dropped frames lately. I will make round framerates like 24, 25 or 30.

Well I think people can make their tracks 60fps or 30fps if they won't too. I can compose the MEP in a 60fps encode than the 60 tracks will get their advantage and the 30s won't. I think doubled frames without frame blending won't visualy efffect it. I think that could work, but I better test it though. Would this be pleasent for you all? In the end we can still drop the 60fps thing if no track gets a benefit of it. lol
I think this is a good idea, because everybody can choose the sort of framerate he wants for his track. The idea of mixing framerates in one video because of estetic reasons makes me excited.

@Dar: Haha. You're welcome =)
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Re: X Ghosts - Interested?

Postby Vivaldi » Thu Dec 10, 2009 4:54 pm

godix wrote:
Bauzi wrote:What I can say (my personal experience) is that you notice 60fps only if you tweak with velocity settings of your clips and custom effects with motion.

To quote your original post: "Not really effects needed". I got the impression the entire point isn't eye candy. If I got that wrong, then I withdraw my interest. I don't want to be in another eyecandy only MEP. This isn't Ayumix after all, hopefully this will actually be entertaining.

I don't think the idea that one precludes the other is really valid, well done effects can accentuate a video with substance, and in some cases well designed effects can be the basis of substance. Color alterations, footage alteration and such should be valid no matter how down to earth the video is supposed to be.

I.e. I got the impression you're just avoiding needlessly self-serving 4th wall breaking effects.


As for 60fps, it would work if you could provide a reliable way for creating interpolated frames, but I don't have or know how to use twixtor or it equivilants, I'm sure most people don't either, and I feel if we don't take it all the way it'll just be a gimmick.
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Re: X Ghosts - Interested?

Postby Bauzi » Thu Dec 10, 2009 4:58 pm

Vivaldi wrote:As for 60fps, it would work if you could provide a reliable way for creating interpolated frames, but I don't have or know how to use twixtor or it equivilants, I'm sure most people don't either, and I feel if we don't take it all the way it'll just be a gimmick.

I think Twixtor is a good idea. It gives the whole 60fps thingy a way better reason to be part of the MEP. I better give a look to it and write a quick tutorial/explanation for those who want to use it.
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