The Undercover MEP [closed]

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Postby NS » Sat Apr 28, 2007 11:49 pm

I don't like all these people using betas they already started like a year ago XD. i mean if you update em it's fine, just don't slack off on meh
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Postby AMV_4000 » Sat Apr 28, 2007 11:58 pm

NerdStrudel wrote:I don't like all these people using betas they already started like a year ago XD. i mean if you update em it's fine, just don't slack off on meh


well this beta is from 2005, and the only reason I never finished it is because my dvd rips got deleted, as well as the project file and the good version of the video... but i would like to redo what I had... its up to you tho...
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Postby NS » Sun Apr 29, 2007 12:07 am

Oh, it's fine, I'm just saying XD
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Postby Prodigi » Sun Apr 29, 2007 12:56 am

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Postby Fire_Starter » Sun Apr 29, 2007 1:08 am

A few issues I see with the technical aspects.

1) Framerate- 29.97
3) HIGH QUALITY FOOTAGE ONLY!!!!!!
4) De- interlace your final and betas plz


Quite simply, these three do not mix. If you de-interlace without decimating the framerate to 23.98 (i.e. film), you will not get the requirements for item #3. This is because decimating actually REMOVES the interlaced frames, while just de-interlacing either blends frames together (ghosting) or drops the resolution on the interlaced frames and upscales them back to match the rest (artifacting).

6) Final in .AVI Uncompressed.


Do you have ANY clue how much space that would take up? Uncompressed = every bit stored for every pixel of every frame.

640x480 = 307,200 pixels per frame

24 bits/pixel = 7,372,800 bits = 921,600 bytes = 900kb per frame

29.97fps * 900kb/frame = 26.34 megabytes PER SECOND.

So with these figures, 1:00 of video would be 1,580 megabytes (1.54 gigabytes), and 1:45 would be 2,765 megabytes (2.7 gigabytes). And that's not taking audio into account.

Using lossless compression (such as Huffy) would reduce this greatly, but you're still looking at up to 900 megabytes or so PER SEGMENT. Keep in mind that most non-dedicated editing systems don't have drives that can feed that kind of data in realtime when editing...
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Postby wurpess » Sun Apr 29, 2007 1:42 am

NerdStrudel wrote:Yah the only part I kinda don't like is after the "Undercover MEP" where the eyes blink again, I wanted em to kinda close slowly, but still like it.

Well, I said in the pm that i'd change it if you wanted. :P (Though not right now, b/c I've been drinking a lot of rum, and I'm not sure how it would turn out. :D)

NerdStrudel wrote:I don't like all these people using betas they already started like a year ago XD. i mean if you update em it's fine, just don't slack off on meh

Still not sure how much I've done of it. . since I never got a chance to check before family summoned me off to drunken game night. WHEEEEE!!!! :D But I can assure you, its probably not enough that I could turn in even for a beta w/o doing something to it. *^_^*
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Postby dbz0gohan0dbz » Sun Apr 29, 2007 4:33 am

Fire_Starter1982 wrote:
So with these figures, 1:00 of video would be 1,580 megabytes (1.54 gigabytes), and 1:45 would be 2,765 megabytes (2.7 gigabytes). And that's not taking audio into account.

Using lossless compression (such as Huffy) would reduce this greatly, but you're still looking at up to 900 megabytes or so PER SEGMENT. Keep in mind that most non-dedicated editing systems don't have drives that can feed that kind of data in realtime when editing...


hmm... i saved my ill nino MEP uncompressed and had 1.98GB and only 50 secs of work.... but ehh... i agree with you uncompressed is waaaayy to much
Last edited by dbz0gohan0dbz on Sun Apr 29, 2007 5:48 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Kevmaster » Sun Apr 29, 2007 4:58 am

dbz0gohan0dbz wrote:
Fire_Starter1982 wrote:
So with these figures, 1:00 of video would be 1,580 megabytes (1.54 gigabytes), and 1:45 would be 2,765 megabytes (2.7 gigabytes). And that's not taking audio into account.

Using lossless compression (such as Huffy) would reduce this greatly, but you're still looking at up to 900 megabytes or so PER SEGMENT. Keep in mind that most non-dedicated editing systems don't have drives that can feed that kind of data in realtime when editing...


hmm... i saved my ill nino MEP uncompressed and had 1.98GB and only 50 secs of work.... but ehh... i agree with you uncompressed is waaaayy to much


If he'd give me his adress I'd save the uncompressed ona dvd and send it to him per mail :lol: cause theres no way for me to upload a uncompressed with my upload speed of 6 or 7 kb
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Postby NS » Sun Apr 29, 2007 8:50 am

Fire_Starter1982 wrote:A few issues I see with the technical aspects.

1) Framerate- 29.97
3) HIGH QUALITY FOOTAGE ONLY!!!!!!
4) De- interlace your final and betas plz


Quite simply, these three do not mix. If you de-interlace without decimating the framerate to 23.98 (i.e. film), you will not get the requirements for item #3. This is because decimating actually REMOVES the interlaced frames, while just de-interlacing either blends frames together (ghosting) or drops the resolution on the interlaced frames and upscales them back to match the rest (artifacting).

6) Final in .AVI Uncompressed.


Do you have ANY clue how much space that would take up? Uncompressed = every bit stored for every pixel of every frame.

640x480 = 307,200 pixels per frame

24 bits/pixel = 7,372,800 bits = 921,600 bytes = 900kb per frame

29.97fps * 900kb/frame = 26.34 megabytes PER SECOND.

So with these figures, 1:00 of video would be 1,580 megabytes (1.54 gigabytes), and 1:45 would be 2,765 megabytes (2.7 gigabytes). And that's not taking audio into account.

Using lossless compression (such as Huffy) would reduce this greatly, but you're still looking at up to 900 megabytes or so PER SEGMENT. Keep in mind that most non-dedicated editing systems don't have drives that can feed that kind of data in realtime when editing...


To be honest, I didn't/don't really know about the technical shit, so if you could help me with better technical guidlines to have that would be great
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Postby dbz0gohan0dbz » Sun Apr 29, 2007 10:21 am

NerdStrudel wrote:
To be honest, I didn't/don't really know about the technical shit, so if you could help me with better technical guidlines to have that would be great


hmmm.. i think 23 fps and huffy 640x480 ...
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Postby Prodigi » Sun Apr 29, 2007 10:23 am

Prodigi wrote:UUUUUUUUUUUNGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHH.

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Postby Keeper of Hellfire » Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:05 am

Fire_Starter1982 wrote:A few issues I see with the technical aspects.

1) Framerate- 29.97
3) HIGH QUALITY FOOTAGE ONLY!!!!!!
4) De- interlace your final and betas plz


Quite simply, these three do not mix. If you de-interlace without decimating the framerate to 23.98 (i.e. film), you will not get the requirements for item #3. This is because decimating actually REMOVES the interlaced frames, while just de-interlacing either blends frames together (ghosting) or drops the resolution on the interlaced frames and upscales them back to match the rest (artifacting).
If you don't have clue, just shut up.
1.) IVTCed NTSC has a framerate of 23.976 fps. The most editing systems can't handle that, working with 23.98 would cause synching issues.
2.) Decimating doesn't remove the (de-)interlaced frames. It removes either the frames that are most similar to its neighbours or one from the longest run of the same frames, depending on the parameters.
3.) Inverse telecine of properly telecined material doesn't deinterlace in usual sense. In interlaced frames one (afaik the dominating) field is combined with the matching field from a neighboring frame to make it progressive.
4.) There exist much more ways to create progressive frames from interlaced frames than you describe. You describe the 2 worst.
5.) IVTC makes sense for cinema movies. TV-shows and OVA's often have parts in it with real 29.97 fps, so it's better to stick with that speed.

And while your claims about uncompressed files being too large and that better lossless compressed should be used are o.k., what you say about the speed of hard drives is wrong. Even slower models (if not too old) can feed an average data rate of 40MByte/s, what is enough. HuffYUV or Lagarith are more problematic for real time feeding because they need much processing power for decoding.

Edit:
@NerdStrudel
I did notice you have removed the technical guidelines. IIRC they were ok, except the uncompressed files.
Last edited by Keeper of Hellfire on Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:11 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Prodigi » Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:09 am

Prodigi wrote:
Prodigi wrote:UUUUUUUUUUUNGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHH.

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Postby NS » Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:53 am

@keeper ok, but what should I change the setting for for final tracks?. I'm new to this so don't know. I put loseless HuffyUV just now. but yah


@prodigi

If you don't stop i'll get a mod in here
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Postby Minion » Mon Apr 30, 2007 7:03 am

lulz
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