Evangelion Episode 23 Director's Cut proves the following...

AtomicWeezleman · Post by **AtomicWeezleman** » Fri Feb 13, 2004 11:27 am

Unit 00 defenetily wasnt made of Lilith, its stated that Unit 01 is diferent tto 00 and 02, in the fact that it was made of lilith (somewhere in eva.......)

Rrei was part Yui Ikari (dna sampling) and part Lilith, hence the look of Yui, also when she returns to lilith, Welcome Home appears....... if we link this to what Kawaro says, Those made of adam must return to adam, we can also assume the same of lilith..........

Kracus · Post by **Kracus** » Fri Feb 13, 2004 12:45 pm

AtomicWeezleman wrote:Unit 00 defenetily wasnt made of Lilith, its stated that Unit 01 is diferent tto 00 and 02, in the fact that it was made of lilith (somewhere in eva.......)

Rrei was part Yui Ikari (dna sampling) and part Lilith, hence the look of Yui, also when she returns to lilith, Welcome Home appears....... if we link this to what Kawaro says, Those made of adam must return to adam, we can also assume the same of lilith..........

the welcome home I thought was what Lillith says. Tadaima is what you say when you are returning home. But I still think Rei taking part of adam into herself, had something to do with it.

and yea I wasn't sure about the 00 part, I forgot.

UncleMilo · Post by **UncleMilo** » Fri Feb 13, 2004 5:39 pm

AtomicWeezleman wrote:Unit 00 defenetily wasnt made of Lilith, its stated that Unit 01 is diferent tto 00 and 02, in the fact that it was made of lilith (somewhere in eva.......)

Rrei was part Yui Ikari (dna sampling) and part Lilith, hence the look of Yui, also when she returns to lilith, Welcome Home appears....... if we link this to what Kawaro says, Those made of adam must return to adam, we can also assume the same of lilith..........

SPOILERS

I have not read ANY ogf this thread... and so I apologize for repeating anything that was said before...

but all the EVAs were made from Lillith...

The reason Unit 01 was different from Units 00 and 02 was because Units 00 and 02 had computer brains (which used the same technology as the MAGI computers... brain-like computers that made use of human imprint), but EVA 01 had the actual essence of Yui within it... making it more than a human imprint on a computer.

-Uncle Milo

Cyanna · Post by **Cyanna** » Fri Feb 13, 2004 6:11 pm

I could have sworn that Units 00 and 02 were made from Adam.

Kaworu wrote: The Eva series was born from Adam, born from man's antithesis. And yet the Lilim will utilise that which they hate most of all in order to survive. I do not understand.

...

Your Evas and I are composed of the same matter. Born from Adam, I can synchronise with it easily as long as there is no dominate soul. And Unit Two's soul is now hiding itself, thus Eva Two is mine.

SEELE 01 (Keel) wrote:The promised time has come. With the Lance of Longinus now lost, complementation using Lilith is impossible. Our only hope is to proceed with EVA-01, Lilith's sole clone.

UncleMilo · Post by **UncleMilo** » Fri Feb 13, 2004 6:16 pm

Cyanna wrote:I could have sworn that Units 00 and 02 were made from Adam.

It is impossible for the EVAs to have been made from Adam, based on the series continuity.

Of course, the more important thing is that you have to go to the designs themselves. You see, in the actual story of Lillith, Lillith was the mother of all demons... and the designs for EVAs units 00, 01 and 02 were all based on the descriptions of her first three children.

-Uncle Milo

Cyanna · Post by **Cyanna** » Fri Feb 13, 2004 6:37 pm

UncleMilo wrote:
Cyanna wrote:I could have sworn that Units 00 and 02 were made from Adam.
It is impossible for the EVAs to have been made from Adam, based on the series continuity.

How?

Seriously. I am curious because the dialogue points otherwise.

UncleMilo · Post by **UncleMilo** » Fri Feb 13, 2004 6:54 pm

Cyanna wrote:
UncleMilo wrote:
Cyanna wrote:I could have sworn that Units 00 and 02 were made from Adam.
It is impossible for the EVAs to have been made from Adam, based on the series continuity.
How?

Seriously. I am curious because the dialogue points otherwise.

There are many translations of EVA and many of them have errors...

I mean "Lance of Longinus" is a minor mis-translation and it was in the ADV release of Evangelion. The "Spear of Longinus" is an actual Holy Relic and should not have been mis-translated... This shows a lack of research on the part of the translation.

Anyway...

It was established in the TV series that NERV was built where Lillith was. NERV has always had Lillith available to them for genetic copy.

Adam caused 2nd Impact and they indiated it had only regenerated so far (the Embryo that Kaji had with him) and that Adam's containment is why it had not regnerated further.

NERV never had Adam to work with (as far as taking genetic samples from) as far as I can tell from all I have read and seen.

Lastly, as I mentioned before, the EVAs are based on the descriptions of the demon children of Lillith.

-Uncle Milo

HeartbreakerByZep · Post by **HeartbreakerByZep** » Fri Feb 13, 2004 7:14 pm

You definetly make a convincing argument. But clearly the dialouge proves beyond a doubt otherwise, unless you can disccredit Kaworu and Seele. (Them being probably the most reliable sources of information in the series..) Something as simple as mistranslations can't be blamed and used to explain away the clear dialouge. I'd say the dialouge is one of the most important parts of understanding Evangelion. You certainly can't just look to mythology for the answers, Evangelion uses mythological refferences but it does not align with them. (In Evangelion) The Spear of Longinus was never used to pierce Christ. (In Evangelion) Adam did not give birth to humanity, Adam was not human. (In The Bible) Lilith did not give birth to Humanity. The refferences that are a part of Evangelion are not in any way Biblicly or mythologically accurate, and therefore you can't use mythology as basis of prove for anything in the series.

About Adam being not available and Lilith being available. That's a good point. But it's possible that Adam was brought to Nerv and used for Evangelion 00 (and previous prototypes), then moved to German for protection because of the large possibility of failure upon the arrival of the first angel (since for one thing they only have on pilot, and she's sometimes injured, and since they've never fought an angel before, or had an Evangelion in battle, they have no idea what level of effectiveness they will have, so it's safer to get Adam out of Tokyo-3 so that even if they fail there is still some chance) and then sampled in Germany to create Evangelion 02, and brought back to Nerv when the third pilot arrives and the time draws ever closer that Adam will need to be used.

UncleMilo · Post by **UncleMilo** » Fri Feb 13, 2004 7:51 pm

HeartbreakerByZep wrote:About Adam being not available and Lilith being available. That's a good point. But it's possible that Adam was brought to Nerv and used for Evangelion 00 (and previous prototypes), then moved to German for protection because of the large possibility of failure upon the arrival of the first angel (since for one thing they only have on pilot, and she's sometimes injured, and since they've never fought an angel before, or had an Evangelion in battle, they have no idea what level of effectiveness they will have, so it's safer to get Adam out of Tokyo-3 so that even if they fail there is still some chance) and then sampled in Germany to create Evangelion 02, and brought back to Nerv when the third pilot arrives and the time draws ever closer that Adam will need to be used.

What dialogue are you talking about? Because nothing I have seen in Evangelion supports anything you're saying. Furthermore, you're now jumping to unsupported ideas about how MAYBE they did this and MAYBE they did that.

And how can you BEGIN to hope to understand the surface story of Evangelion if you don't know the mythologies that are used in the story?

I mean, the seven-eye symbol isn't just something they thought was cool... it is the actual symbol of Lilith. The Angels are all designed in relation to the Angels that they are based on.

And let's not forget about Gendo's rug.

However, let's talk more about facts from the show. As far as I can tell from what I saw in the actual TV series, they had already found Lilith and built NERV around the location where Lilth was. Adam blew up and people knew this would happen as soon as man tampered with it. They knew this, which allowed Gendo to get out of the way long before it happened.

What makes more sense... that they could make use of Lilith, who they had on hand and under control... or that they were able to make copies from the genetic material from a blown up being that had to regenerate.

Misato made the mistake of believing that Lilith was Adam. They planned to deceive the audience by showing us this scene. Not only did it show how Misato was not "in the know" but it kept us confused.

Furthermore... the construction of EVA was being done in many countries under the coordination of NERV... (including the USA)

NERV had Lilith, not Adam.

-Uncle Milo

HeartbreakerByZep · Post by **HeartbreakerByZep** » Fri Feb 13, 2004 8:13 pm

Kaworu wrote: The Eva series was born from Adam, born from man's antithesis. And yet the Lilim will utilise that which they hate most of all in order to survive. I do not understand.

...

Your Evas and I are composed of the same matter. Born from Adam, I can synchronise with it easily as long as there is no dominate soul. And Unit Two's soul is now hiding itself, thus Eva Two is mine.

SEELE 01 (Keel) wrote:The promised time has come. With the Lance of Longinus now lost, complementation using Lilith is impossible. Our only hope is to proceed with EVA-01, Lilith's sole clone.

If you're not willing to beleive the series, who are you going to beleive? Kaworu and Seele are easily among the most knowledgable people in the series. There's no point to deceive us or anyone else with these phrases, Kaworu's words are the ones that are suposed to make us realize the truth. If we can't even trust that these instances are reliable, there is almost nothing in Evangelion that we can beleive.

I have a fairly good grasp on all of the major mythology used for Evangelion. It has importance, but not really a lot of relevance. Like I said, what is used in Evangelion is not accurate at all to the original sources, so you can't expect other uses of mythology to be parallel while the clearest ones are not. The 7 Eye symbol was used countless times in the Bible, I'd be willing to bet that it doesn't have any overarching importance in Evangelion though, atleast as far as deciding on how the Evangelions where created is concerned.

About "MAYBE this... MAYBE that.." that's what Evangelion related theory is based on. Evangelion itself doesn't provide us with all of the answers in a clear cut "This is it. period." fashion, though all the information we need is right there, we just have to put two and two together to get it out. One has to see Point A and Point C and assume the most logical path between them would be point B. It's always open to interpretation and new thoughts, but whatever 'maybes' are the most logical and are backed the most by proves from the series are the ones that are accepted. It's a necissary thing.