Wind-up records? Copyright Infrigement?

[Kazeatoo]

In November 2005, the administrator of AnimeMusicVideos.org was contacted by Wind-up Records, requesting the removal of content featuring the work of the bands Creed, Evanescence, and Seether. Videos have been removed in different amv websites due to copyright infringement of either TV Tokyo or the Warner Music Group and other labels and or companies. How can the amv making editors continue to enjoy and make the music videos they have been doing for years. Will it soon reach the animemusicvideos.org members again? How can we prepare to go off against websites like utube and veoh and other websites?

[mirkosp]

If copyright infringement really bothers you, then this ultimately isn't the right hobby for you. You technically go against the law in the very moment you decrypt and copy your CDs/DVDs/BDs/what-have-you from the support to your PC. That said, you could start using music released certain Creative Commons licenses (basically, anything that doesn't have the "NoDerivs" license is pretty much fair game to be used in AMVs).
As for anime... you don't have many possibilities here. Start doing your own animations or something, I guess.
With all that said, depending on the country you live in AMVs might or might not be allowed even in the very "copyright infringing" form. Some countries bluntly ban them, other countries treat them as something more along the "grey area" lines, and other countries might accept them without any issues (pretty much only the countries that don't have laws against copyright infringement, I would think) - USA seems to be in the "grey area" zone atm, though that might change for the better or the worse in the future.

Now, when it comes down to the org... the worst issue for the org is actually having LOCAL upload. As long as we were just indexing AMVs back in the beginning, nothing could have really be done to us since we weren't offering downloads. But since when the local upload has been made available ages ago, the org has been in a somewhat risky position, as the wind-up records case clearly shown. I'm not sure if they'll reach us again, since the org is a somewhat obscure site, compared to bigger streaming site like the ones you cited yourself as an example. That said, those sites have completely different focuses than the org has. Org is just AMVs, and tries to always allow the best quality copy to be available. The tube, veoh, etc. are just streaming sites for pretty much any content to be available, though not for max quality download. Anyway, in the case that lawyers get to us again, depending on the consequences, our best bet to still stay somehow alive is to take down all download links. Or we could move the servers to another country.
See, in the end, even if AMVs are supposedly grey area over there in the US, the better lawyers one has, the more chances that one has to win in the end. We, as in the org, wouldn't be able to afford lawyers that could really do much against the lawyers of the copyright detentors, so even if we were to be right, we could end up losing and be fined for copyright infringement anyway.

That should be answering your questions... maybe. I might have said some stupid things in there, so anyone that knows better than I do, feel free to correct me.

PS: as a side note, no matter how many times these thread come up, there is no reason to spam and flame them. Try to be nice, guys.

[Kazeatoo]

Thanks for your reply..the question has been raised how this community can continue to exist... the post of such a discussion was only raised to see the perspective nd opinion of members of the org. The org is a somewhat obscure site ACCORDING TO YOU but to my opinion the org is rapidly growing in size and it will continue growing thus in the future it will not be, again as the case of wind-up records another incident of these can happen. I agree with you that the worst issue for the org is actually having LOCAL upload. My question still remains partially unanswered what can we do in the future...we can take down all download links...we can change the server to another country... we can get lawyers and try to solve.. if all of this fails then what?

btw: copyright infringement bothers all editors no matter what age
editing opens the possibilities of the impossible ( think about it)

Thanks for your reply, i appreciately accept it...

[mirkosp]

If all that fails, org amministration gets fined and possibly jailed... potentially along with all the users found guilty and living in the US? I'm not really sure how law works in the US since it's not my country, but that might be the worst possible ending...

[Otohiko]

I don't think it will come to that. There is no guarantee we won't get another C&D, but it's very unlikely it will get beyond that. If it does, provided there is a will among the current administration (and I hope there is), we can and should defend with at least some success.

[Panky]

Searching and fining people from here in case of copyright infrigment would be a loss-loss case for them, I don't think they would do such thing. They would lose way too much money to get nothing in exchange. Procedures to lawsuit would make them lose more money that what they would possible make from people. That, if we are thinking inside of US, if it's another country then it's even way more impossible for it to happen, even if it's a country that goes along with these kind of procedures (and again, they are a lot that couldn't give a damn).

Worst case scenario would be to get the site closed off because of local hosting of the videos and music as mirkosp said. This site isn't getting "profit" at all, and isn't even getting in the scope of corporations like torrents sites where you can get their software for "free", that would be a high risk. Believe me when I say the Org isn't in the scope, torrents site don't hold local downloads of files (not direct, only files with peers to download for) which would make them "legal" and still get closed when they're getting popular.

[Panky]

Searching and fining people from here in case of copyright infrigment would be a loss-loss case for them, I don't think they would do such thing. They would lose way too much money to get nothing in exchange. Procedures to lawsuit would make them lose more money that what they would possible make from people. That, if we are thinking inside of US, if it's another country then it's even way more impossible for it to happen, even if it's a country that goes along with these kind of procedures (and again, they are a lot that couldn't give a damn).

Worst case scenario would be to get the site closed off because of local hosting of the videos and music as mirkosp said. This site isn't getting "profit" at all, and isn't even getting in the scope of corporations like torrents sites where you can get their software for "free", that would be a high risk. Believe me when I say the Org isn't in the scope, torrents site don't hold local downloads of files (not direct, only files with peers to download for) which would make them "legal" and still get closed when they're getting popular.

Meant to say software as a general interest in torrents sites, even though there is more stuff, bah.

[Knowname]

what can we do in the future...we can take down all download links...we can change the server to another country... we can get lawyers and try to solve..

How much of this would really happen anyway?? Isn't the org privately owned so anything beyond taking down d/l links is pretty much out of the question, IMHO. I think that's why Phade decided to move so quickly on this when it happened.

Also since this time we have started a streaming service. This is a slightly more reasonable method, as far as copyright litigation is concerned, than downloading a file of their stuff.

I don't know what kind of resources/ or how much Phade would be willing to do for this site! But I'm pretty sure he wouldn't be too happy if he had to move (thus moving the server out of country) to keep the site running, especially considering that might leave him with only 3rd world countries to choose from... not that there's anything wrong with 3rd world countries *running water*. I don't know, I suppose he has multiple servers anyway and might do remote hosting anyway. I don't know about all that kind of stuff and what's in the realm of possibilities. BUT keep in mind, the org is here because Phade wants it here x| (unless he sold it and I missed that)

[Knowname]

On that note, can we get Windup records based amvs streamed?? Or should we just let it go. I like some of their songs :/

[Fall_Child42]

the worst possible ending...

BAD END