Lack of activity in op exchanges...

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Lack of activity in op exchanges...

Postby Gene Starwind 21122 » Thu May 15, 2014 6:28 am

I've notice since being back on the forum, there is a lack of activity on the op exchange forums. Do editors not exchange reviews on video any more? When I was editing from 2002-2007 there was a ton of activity. We would be swapping opinions and helping each other out by giving opinions. Why do you think there is less activity with editors leaving reviews?

Personally I love leaving reviews. I think its a lot of fun when you can watch a video and appreciate what other editors have done. Or help them out, so that way they can get better. Without feedback we may fall into making the same mistakes again in our next project. I've learned a lot about the visual clean up techniques to release 1080 videos. That's a lot different than 7 years ago. Anyways I hope we can make this a more active place like it use to be.

If anybody wants feedback on their amv let me know and I'll be happy to swap reviews. Just PM me or look for me in the op exchange.

THIS IS NOT AN OP EXCHANGE POST. lol

Gene Starwind 21122
No matter what, stay calm, stay cool and live life to the fullest.
Plus as Gene would say always go big in life.
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Re: Lack of activity in op exchanges...

Postby macchinainterna » Thu May 15, 2014 7:35 am

The Org has become considerably less active socially in the last few years. While some members are doing their best to revive it and encourage newer editors to be more involved, I've noticed this happening with a lot of editing communities I am a part of. Many of them have pretty much become "drop and run" sites where the majority of activity seen are just people posting their own videos and nothing else. Vidders.net has sadly become such a site as well, despite heavy support from well known fanvid editors.
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Re: Lack of activity in op exchanges...

Postby Nya-chan Production » Thu May 15, 2014 7:54 am

Old members are leaving the hobby and Org doesn't attract new editors. Less people on forums mean less op exchanges. That's all.
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Re: Lack of activity in op exchanges...

Postby Shui » Thu May 15, 2014 8:23 am

Most people like to circlejerk on how cool their masks/presets look on youtube instead of having proper feedback anyways.
Also I think the OPs system is just not what they're used to anymore. And yeah people leaving the org for smaller communities is nothing new.
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Re: Lack of activity in op exchanges...

Postby Gene Starwind 21122 » Thu May 15, 2014 9:16 am

I'm going to try and see if I can reach out to new editors and help make this place more active like it use to be.

@shui- There is nothing wrong with the new style of editing. However as a contest coordinator over the past few years, I notice less and less videos having meaning to them. I started editing again because I miss amv's that have a story and emotion to them.

@Nya-chan Production - Why don't we mention the org at conventions we go to. Draw in the audience at contest, mention it there. Mention it at AMV Panels, talk to editors and have them become active here. If its dying out we need to revive it by talking about the site.

Anyways, I know when I go to AWA this year I'll be talking about it there. I have a few more conventions to go to before then, and I'll be sure to mention it there.

Gene
No matter what, stay calm, stay cool and live life to the fullest.
Plus as Gene would say always go big in life.
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Re: Lack of activity in op exchanges...

Postby Radical_Yue » Thu May 15, 2014 9:59 am

Gene Starwind 21122 wrote:I'm going to try and see if I can reach out to new editors and help make this place more active like it use to be.



Messaging people in private and asking for Op exchanges isn't the way. It can be taken as solicitation and is not okay.
Your heart is in the right place but if you want to make it more active try commenting on some threads in the AMV Announcement section and link to your Opinion Exchange in your signature.
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Re: Lack of activity in op exchanges...

Postby MouseBollocks » Thu May 15, 2014 10:35 am

Gene Starwind 21122 wrote:I'm going to try and see if I can reach out to new editors and help make this place more active like it use to be.


I'm going to try and do this too. Unfortunately, the way the community is here doesn't make it appealing to the current new editors. I'm a newish editor myself, who came here because the community seemed generally better (especially for technical advice) than YT. However, a lot of newer editors don't want the honest criticism that you get here, and just want to circle jerk each other in their own little friend circles, like Shui said. Of course, that's a problem created by those editors, and not the community here, but that doesn't change the fact that it could easily prevent a fair amount of new editors from participating in the community here, which is a shame.
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Re: Lack of activity in op exchanges...

Postby TritioAFB » Thu May 15, 2014 10:39 am

In the past I used to create lots of Free Ops thread, the lack of time prevents me to do so. But still, looking for any way I can be active.
Thinking about the new editors, this place really seems to be less friendly
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Re: Lack of activity in op exchanges...

Postby ngsilver » Thu May 15, 2014 10:42 am

Gene Starwind 21122 wrote:@Nya-chan Production - Why don't we mention the org at conventions we go to. Draw in the audience at contest, mention it there. Mention it at AMV Panels, talk to editors and have them become active here. If its dying out we need to revive it by talking about the site.

I know we pimp the org out at all the cons I attend. Addmittently that's very few now, basically AWA and Youma. But I know we do speak about the org at AWA and at Youma I pimp the org out as much as I can. I see a big issue nowadays is that most people who edit are looking for instant gratification and the org just can't produce that like Youtube can. There is also still a stigma attached to the org that we are the 'serious' editors and only serious editors should hang out here. Our critiques, especially ops, are way more in depth then the standard editor today cares for. They just want a bunch of views, subscribers, and thumbs up really. To a person like that, the org is pretty hostile place.
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Re: Lack of activity in op exchanges...

Postby Gene Starwind 21122 » Thu May 15, 2014 10:45 am

Radical_Yue wrote:
Gene Starwind 21122 wrote:I'm going to try and see if I can reach out to new editors and help make this place more active like it use to be.



Messaging people in private and asking for Op exchanges isn't the way. It can be taken as solicitation and is not okay.
Your heart is in the right place but if you want to make it more active try commenting on some threads in the AMV Announcement section and link to your Opinion Exchange in your signature.


Hey Radical Yue. Sorry about that, I was just trying to reach out to editors that haven't had many reviews, and see if they wanted feedback. I didn't know if they were just shy or what not. I wasn't trying to solicitate to anybody. I will however take your advice and hit up the AMV Announcement thread and also do the link in my signature.

How would you try to get more people involve? I really want to see this place come alive again.

@ngsilver - While it's true that we do go into more detail about our reviews here, but that's because we want to help editors improve. Not everything is about getting a pat on the back saying great job it was amazing. I know that from years of editing. It does stink from time to time when you get a review that you think was bad. However when you take a look at it, maybe the other person was right or they just didn't see what you saw. So I don't know if the editing world is changing but I really do want to try and help editors embrace the site here and be more apart of it. I remember how a live this place use to be and how everyone would share and comment on the videos around here.
No matter what, stay calm, stay cool and live life to the fullest.
Plus as Gene would say always go big in life.
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Re: Lack of activity in op exchanges...

Postby Radical_Yue » Thu May 15, 2014 11:07 am

Gene Starwind 21122 wrote:
Radical_Yue wrote:
Gene Starwind 21122 wrote:I'm going to try and see if I can reach out to new editors and help make this place more active like it use to be.



Messaging people in private and asking for Op exchanges isn't the way. It can be taken as solicitation and is not okay.
Your heart is in the right place but if you want to make it more active try commenting on some threads in the AMV Announcement section and link to your Opinion Exchange in your signature.


Hey Radical Yue. Sorry about that, I was just trying to reach out to editors that haven't had many reviews, and see if they wanted feedback. I didn't know if they were just shy or what not. I wasn't trying to solicitate to anybody. I will however take your advice and hit up the AMV Announcement thread and also do the link in my signature.

How would you try to get more people involve? I really want to see this place come alive again.



This is what I've been working on for the past few years since I became a mod and most recently, an admin.

Sadly, it's not as easy as just putting a few opinions out there. A couple problems have already been posted and this has already been discussed numerous times throughout the years but...

1) The website isn't very easy to use for new members. It's outdated, broken, and still heavily relies on multi-steps combined with FTP. They're not used to this. Most new editors don't know what FTP even is. They're used to the simplicity of Youtube with an easy drag, drop and stream option. This prevents people from signing up and posting their videos.

2) A lot of editors don't sign up or get active on the Org because we're still seen as an elitist community, even after all these years. They don't believe they're "good enough" or they think they'll be flamed if they post something silly. We're still quite scary to a lot of people.

3) As Mousebollocks pointed out, not everyone is open to criticism. Not everyone posts or gets involved because they don't want to be told that there is room for improvement. Therefore, they stick to Youtube where they can get their ego stroked at any time.

4) The mentality when it comes to posting and commenting has changed. As already pointed out, it's being more of a drop and run type of atmosphere than it used to be. In the old days you'd post your video, post on other threads to get noticed/involved, and in turn you'd get responses on your work. Now people post their videos and nothing else, then get upset at the lack of activity in their own thread. Both new and old editors have become guilty of this action. It used to be seen as shameful to get less than 3 pages on an announcement post, now you're lucky to get 3 responses.

5) The community is much more spread out. A lot of "community' activity doesn't happen on the forums anymore but in private editor chats on messaging programs such as Skype. That and there are other AMV communities out there such as AMVNews.ru, AMV-France, etc. Not to mention one of the largest and most spread out communities of them all being Youtube. So an editor that might not post a ton on the forums may be incredibly active and well-versed in the community by being involved in chats outside of the forums.

Now, what we're doing to fix this....

We're working on a redesign. This has been something in the works for many, many years but I'm considering this to be the final and best attempt possible. We've got a small team together, headed by a well known and respected member of the community, working their butts off in an attempt to make this a better community for us all. They're not getting paid and I don't want to post their names right here so they don't get any kind of harassment (they're welcome to advertise their involvement if they want) but right now they're the best hope for getting this place out of the current grave it's been dug into.

I've personally been running contests on the Org. CodeZTM started it all with Project Org Editor and we've expanded the number and types of contest we personally host on the Org. The contests have proven to generate activity and a decent amount of first posts are actually sign ups for said contests. It's not a major change but it has helped quite a few people that are currently on the forum get more involved and interested in the community.

That's all we can really do. There isn't a ton that can be done at this time. Until the redesign is completed we're basically trying to advertise a theme park with no rides and moldy cotton candy. No one wants to get involved indepth in something that is broken and unloved. We can still try to get our names out there but in my opinion it doesn't make much of a difference at this point. And this is coming from someone who has been at it for over 3 years now.
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Re: Lack of activity in op exchanges...

Postby MouseBollocks » Thu May 15, 2014 11:16 am

Another option is to pin all our hopes on Google continuing to fuck with YouTube, so that people decide to actually leave and come here instead :up:
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Re: Lack of activity in op exchanges...

Postby Gene Starwind 21122 » Thu May 15, 2014 11:24 am

Wow...Radical I did not realize it was that bad. I didn't know FTP was that hard to use. Just download an FTP program type in the info the org gives you and you're done.

As far as the elitest attitude that was never really the case. I mean yes people are harsh on their reviews, but we don't sugar coat things. If we like something we'll say it, if not I know most editors will try and explain what they didn't like. It's all about taking the info and wanting to create the best video possible. I know that I have a lot to learn with the newere styles of editing, but I'm happy with my style for now. I'll try new things eventually.

It's cool the org is getting a making over. I hope it goes well, I'll be contributing more money this year to org too. I really love being here and I missed editing. I just hope the new editors / youtube generation can embrass the old dogs like us.

We don't bite...much. lol

Anyways again sorry about everything, I had no idea it had change that much. Don't want to cause any trouble for you.

Gene
No matter what, stay calm, stay cool and live life to the fullest.
Plus as Gene would say always go big in life.
Anime Mid Atlantic AMV Contest Coordinator 2007-2011
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T-Mode Contest Coordinator 2013
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Re: Lack of activity in op exchanges...

Postby Radical_Yue » Thu May 15, 2014 11:43 am

You're not causing trouble. Just saying that this has been an on-going thing for a while.

CrackTheSky and I were actually just having a conversation about the state of things last night. The majority of this all hinges on the redesign. You obviously can't force people to get more involved but hopefully by making a website that isn't broken/old it'll entice more people to want to get involved. While FTP is easy peasy for you and I, it's become a pretty obsolete method for most people since in-browser uploading and management that has been built into the website itself is quickly becoming the norm. You can't really blame them for not jumping on board with an severely outdated method.

One of these "The Org is Dying" thread comes along about every couple months nowadays. Most of the time they're from people that like to complain about inactivity and do nothing to help it though. Don't get me wrong, I want to see things improve but at this point conversations like this just create and eye roll and response of "Not this again..."
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Re: Lack of activity in op exchanges...

Postby Koopiskeva » Thu May 15, 2014 1:23 pm

I'm causing trouble |:
Hi.
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