AMV Editing: A dying hobby (?)

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Re: AMV Editing: A dying hobby (?)

Postby qyll » Fri Sep 13, 2013 7:41 am

Ah, I’ll agree with you there, Taite. The org is dying, but as others have said, the hobby is not. It’s simply shifted to other places like Youtube. Back in 2006, the org may have been the only game in town, but then Youtube stomped onto the scene and it was easier to watch videos (don’t need to register and download), easier to upload videos (don’t need to download an FTP client), and friendlier (perhaps it was Darwinian selection that left the org with the group of editors it has now)? Has there been a decrease in overall quality of videos? That’s another debate entirely, but I’ve seen plenty of good editors on Youtube who probably don’t even known of this community’s existence.

I’m sad about the org slowly atrophying into a skeleton of its former self, but that’s just how it is. Things are changing, and the reality now is not the reality that used to be. I’ll cling on to this community as long as I can because seven years in Tibet spent anywhere will make one a bit nostalgic, but if I wake up one morning and find the site shutting down, then … so it goes.

“AMV theory” would be interesting to talk about, but I feel like that a large part of that subject has already been explored by past authors who wrote about cinematography and editing theory and montages and the like. Rule of thirds. Depth of field. Mise en scène. Omelette du fromage. Anime has a few quirks that may be worth discussing, however, and I’d love to see some people start a conversation about that.

I totally get what you’re talking about when you say AMV editing is too restricting. We don’t worry about lighting or acting or scriptwriting because we get the footage already released on shiny 1080p. However, short film creation is another hobby out there with many followers, and it’s not mutually exclusive with creating AMVs.

For me, though, editing anime is enough. As you said, the hobby dies individually for each person. My mind is too cluttered to handle lighting and acting and scriptwriting on top of editing, so I’m content with just the last part.
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Re: AMV Editing: A dying hobby (?)

Postby Mastamind » Fri Sep 13, 2013 8:49 pm

If you find this thread interesting, take a scroll through this one:
http://www.animemusicvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=70&t=102020

I imagine this will become one of those threads where longer posts like mine get skipped over or go unnoticed, but nonetheless:
AMVs look to me like they're becoming much more popular nowadays. Some are racking up millions of views on YouTube, other editing communities are growing (amvnews, especially, looks like it's gaining membership quickly)? Earlier this year, when I attended a local AMV showing at a convention, I had to stand in the back of a packed and lively room.

Since the topic's moved to whether this site is "dying," well, of course it is, and maybe that's because everybody knows it. These forums are hardly constructive anymore, which has been pointed out repeatedly, and therefore anyone with any hope of continuing AMV-ing has to look elsewhere. But what's even more striking is how stagnant the site outside of the forums is now. Take a look at PaperHeart, which earned 6 VCA awards including 2013 Video of the Year, but doesn't qualify for the Top 10% List list because it hasn't gotten the minimum amount of opinions? What does it say about the org when a video earns less feedback than it does VCAs?

Most viewers simply prefer not to decipher the org's old and clunky layout, and so the forums have increasingly been left with older editors who became accustomed to it before YouTube came up. About three years ago, this topic was addressed and people decided to do something about it. The whole site suddenly seemed more alive. Users actually debated at length and shared opinions on how to renovate the org in order to encourage activity. The "Org Redesign" was what many of us were hoping for, and for awhile it looked like something exciting was gonna happen. It didn't, not yet at least, but it needs to if this community doesn't want to shrink further. trythil may be busy, but if someone picks up the ball on the Org Redesign then that'd definitely stimulate the site. Until then, we can expect to see less and less activity, especially since the general vibe is "yeap, the org's dead, watcha gonna do bout it" and that's detrimental to the forum's sense of community.

qyll wrote:I’ll cling on to this community as long as I can because seven years in Tibet spent anywhere will make one a bit nostalgic, but if I wake up one morning and find the site shutting down, then … so it goes.

Same here (and, heck, I agree with the rest of your post)? There is room for growth with AMVs, it all depends on how much time and effort one puts into being creative. Taite, while I don't learn as much through editing AMVs than I do through film and animation, perhaps that's partly due to how dispirited I am at how little criticism there is here. I'm still hoping to see some developments on this site, but I won't be - and haven't been - visiting too much for the same reasons everyone's been posting.
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Re: AMV Editing: A dying hobby (?)

Postby blaksun » Sat Sep 14, 2013 8:34 am

As i see it one off the major problems is if you give a opinion you get no respond you dot get a thank you, this don't help , you get 0 how seal a nibw lean if you don't give fate back on the opinion ? :|
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Re: AMV Editing: A dying hobby (?)

Postby trythil » Sun Sep 15, 2013 9:57 pm

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Re: AMV Editing: A dying hobby (?)

Postby Taite » Sun Sep 15, 2013 10:22 pm

blaksun wrote:As i see it one off the major problems is if you give a opinion you get no respond you dot get a thank you, this don't help , you get 0 how seal a nibw lean if you don't give fate back on the opinion ? :|

I personally disagree. More than a majority of my opinions/comments don't get replies, but it's not like I'm discouraged by it. It seems kind of childish to say that you don't want to give opinions anymore just because you don't get a thank you. I think the main reason people don't get opinions as often anymore is because people slowly stopped giving fucks and are too involved with their own/friends' agendas.
“AMV theory” would be interesting to talk about, but I feel like that a large part of that subject has already been explored by past authors who wrote about cinematography and editing theory and montages and the like. Rule of thirds. Depth of field. Mise en scène. Omelette du fromage. Anime has a few quirks that may be worth discussing, however, and I’d love to see some people start a conversation about that.

Shame I missed out then, perhaps I'll do some searching to see if those topics covered what I was thinking of. Either way more discussion about anything would be nice.
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Re: AMV Editing: A dying hobby (?)

Postby Castor Troy » Mon Sep 16, 2013 10:55 am

Taite kinda nailed it for me.

I just got tired of being limited to editing someone else's shows and music.
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Re: AMV Editing: A dying hobby (?)

Postby Vlad G Pohnert » Mon Sep 16, 2013 2:03 pm

Castor Troy wrote:I just got tired of being limited to editing someone else's shows and music.


I guess it depends on how you look at it, the alternative is to shoot or draw or animate your own works.?? this is in essence a job and usually out of the scope of a simple hobby for many that you can do here and there when ever you feel like it. But then again if you become an editor, that pretty much what you do (edit other people works)?

As for feedback, honestly the org is not the only place that is "DYING"? this is a universal problem. I know I may get a lot of flank on saying this, but social media, texting and other factors have changed things and how people do feedback.? I know as I see the amount of "formal" feedback at cons diminishing and becoming more hidden. I've just been around long enough to see the change in the past 20 years.??

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Re: AMV Editing: A dying hobby (?)

Postby Mr Pilkington » Mon Sep 16, 2013 10:43 pm

Castor Troy wrote:I just got tired of being limited to editing someone else's shows and music.


And there is nothing wrong with that. I love that amving was gateway drug to discovering my hidden love for animation. I have since worked with all forms of media because this hobby set the foundation and allowed me to hone skills. I can't say my released work here has been evident of this, but my professional reel is full of evidence of such. I view AMVing today, as a relaxing hobby. Some people get far to competitive with it imho, but that's how they view the hobby, and that's okay too. The biggest issue is people are always seeking the "bigger and better," and it's really hard to go from nle work (simply cutting footage), to some of the really compositing, and still being able too see room for growth. I'd argue that there's MORE than enough software out there to make that feasible, but it's very very time consuming. So it's natural to want to go create Battle Geek Plus, or become someone like M Dot Strange. But that's a tough road, and one has to really take the time to stick with it, ignore the criticism, and strive. So in a way, AMVing isn't dying, its evolving. And with the advent of youtube as a stage, and the various types of media available, it's easy to want to strove for more. AMVing will always be here, but as a community I feel more people are just "passing through." Which is hard to understand as some of us know each other outside of the the forums and competitions. We just have to accept that more and more, people will use this as a stepping stone to the next level and never look back. It's not new. Without naming names plenty had done that, it's just far more common today.


AMVing isn't dying, it's just not sticking with people like it used to.
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Re: AMV Editing: A dying hobby (?)

Postby Kyssifur » Thu Sep 19, 2013 6:02 am

And what if a completely new (or partially) scoring system would do the job? Or should I just stop dreaming?
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Re: AMV Editing: A dying hobby (?)

Postby seasons » Thu Sep 19, 2013 10:22 am

AMV editing isn't "dying" but the audience has become so fractured that there's no longer any consensus on what's worth watching. I'm even going to complain that people don't even recognize what's "good editing" anymore because that's a whole other argument (maybe worth having, but not in this post)?

This site did a pretty terrible job of staying relevant over the past 7 years. I'm not blaming a single person or anything like that. But the atmosphere here has always been extremely exclusive. I'm not even talking about the "tough love" approach that's generally taken here with beginning editors. Even for editors who take advantage of the resources here in order to improve, and even who try to acclimate themselves to the community here, assimilation is pretty much impossible. Unless you're friends with people here, no one will watch or comment on your videos. Not even if you're making a good faith effort to comment, leave opinions. participate in MEPs.?? if you weren't here in the mid 2000s then you're pretty much invisible and no one gives a shit that you're here.

Animemusicvideos.org is still a great resource (the AMVapp and the guides are still useful to anyone just getting started) but as far as a community goes it's just a social club for the same 40 or 50 people that it's always been. Most of the veterans here don't watch or even like anime anymore. It's all about contests and competition (now motivated to an extent beyond anything else in video, music, or any artform that I can think of) and no one will watch an AMV unless it's for a contest. Or unless one of their friends made it. Meanwhile, Youtube channels like √Bestamvsofalltime are re-writing the AMV canon (kudos for you if your video gets hosted on it, but have you seen some of the other shit that's listed alongside it?) while our top rated AMVs list looks exactly the same as it did 5 or 6 years ago because no one cares enough to take even 5 minutes to write an opinion for anyone.

I know we have this conversation on a regular basis in one thread or another.?? and I think that's a good thing because I think it's worth talking about. But I no longer know what to even say about it without just repeating the same mantras over and over again. I fell in love with this hobby ten years ago and this site played a HUGE part in that. And because of that, I can't help but feel invested in the future of this site and in the future of the hobby. But I feel like I'm the only one who's not content to just let it go on the course that it seems it's headed.

I'm working on a video now, might have it done before the end of the year (I work very, very slowly)? I'll post it here but I no longer have any expectations that anyone will watch it or even comment if they do. So I'm not sure why I'm here anymore, I guess. Really sucks our hobby is dependent on interaction and sharing, but which has become about as social as building model ships in glass bottles alone in your basement. Because that's what it feels like.
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Re: AMV Editing: A dying hobby (?)

Postby BasharOfTheAges » Thu Sep 19, 2013 12:11 pm

Our ship has sailed. Because we didn't do certain things several years ago a lot of the newer batch of "big names" don't even feel any reason to interact here. They do their interaction elsewhere. Burnout happens, especially when you realize all our discussions devolve into beating the same pack of dead horses over and over again. Older vets stopped interacting as was the natural way of things, and nobody stepped up to take the reigns. It sucks, but we didn't train our replacements, and they wanted something different.
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Re: AMV Editing: A dying hobby (?)

Postby l33tmeatwad » Thu Sep 19, 2013 12:57 pm

Honestly, the org is not dead yet and there's always hope while there is life left. That said, it appears to be more work than anyone is willing to put into the org to revive it.
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Re: AMV Editing: A dying hobby (?)

Postby AceD » Thu Sep 19, 2013 1:43 pm

seasons wrote:Meanwhile, Youtube channels like √Bestamvsofalltime are re-writing the AMV canon (kudos for you if your video gets hosted on it, but have you seen some of the other shit that's listed alongside it?)
The best edited video, won't necessarily be the most popular or most liked video. There are more things to consider than amazing editing alone. My audience is huge.??.most people on youtube are fans of anime and music before video editing you know? People enjoy certain things regardless of how good a video is technically.

Besides, maybe I just like the person who edited it and felt like it. :wink:
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Re: AMV Editing: A dying hobby (?)

Postby blaksun » Sat Sep 21, 2013 8:14 am

Taite wrote:
blaksun wrote:As i see it one off the major problems is if you give a opinion you get no respond you dot get a thank you, this don't help , you get 0 how seal a nibw lean if you don't give fate back on the opinion ? :|

I personally disagree. More than a majority of my opinions/comments don't get replies, but it's not like I'm discouraged by it. It seems kind of childish to say that you don't want to give opinions anymore just because you don't get a thank you. I think the main reason people don't get opinions as often anymore is because people slowly stopped giving fucks and are too involved with their own/friends' agendas.
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Re: AMV Editing: A dying hobby (?)

Postby Taite » Sat Sep 21, 2013 9:21 am

blaksun wrote: if you give a opinion you get no respond you dot get a thank you

if you think i wont give a o.p if i don't get a tanks :rofl: you just go on believing that :aimkissyface:


Taite wrote:More than a majority of my opinions/comments don't get replies, but it's not like I'm discouraged by it. you don't want to give opinions anymore just because you don't get a thank you


Umm.?? that's what you said? Haha. Either way I addressed both parts of what you said, no need to get so defensive, you missed the point of my post too which didn't have anything to do with attacking your opinion. "I personally disagree.??"


Kyssifur wrote:And what if a completely new (or partially) scoring system would do the job? Or should I just stop dreaming?

I'm curious what you were thinking. Are you referring to the format of the opinion/stars? Haven't really thought about it myself and didn't know some people didn't like it, but since this is different than everything else in the thread and I've used it a lot more often now, I'm just curious.
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