Star Ratings in the Announcement Forum

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Re: Star Ratings in the Announcement Forum

Postby Arigatomina » Wed Nov 10, 2010 10:07 pm

Phantasmagoriat wrote:Basically, my point is that it's totally possible to leave a comment without including a rating, or spoiling a video,

Agreed. I don't think anyone is debating that.

PHantasmagoriat wrote:...and everyone will be better off because of it.

This is the big question. You keep assuming people want to improve or are obligated to improve. No one has to improve if they don't want to. Some people resist improving with all their strength. We're not the students in your study where we're all in this expecting and waiting to be given a grade that may have a profound affect on our careers and life after graduation. We're hobbiests, all of us having our own motivations and goals.

After a certain amount of time some people become happy with the way they edit. Their goal is to *not* improve because improvement means change and they don't want to change anything about what they do. Their motivation for posting announcement threads is to share what they've made. They may not even be interested in whether people liked or disliked the vid as long it's being watched. These aren't the high performers in your class, they're the cynical adults who've long since done their time in schools, and who roll their eyes at the thought of a bunch of kids striving for high scores likes dogs jumping for treats. They don't look at ratings, they look at who posted in their thread and where that editor falls in the totum pole of the org. The numbers they receive are meaningless because they're already far more skilled than most of the people leaving those numbers and they know it. They're beyond scores and have been for a long time now.

Others make amvs just because they can, they make no effort because they don't have to, they don't improve because they don't care to. Their motivation is just to make and share something they had fun doing. They may not resist improvement, but they make no effort because improving is meaningless to them and takes more time, time being more precious than anyone's approval. These aren't your low performers, they're the high school drop outs who are working in McDonalds because it makes just enough money to pay for their night life while they live out of mom and dad's house, and that's all they need to be happy. They don't look at scores, either, they look at views. The more people who clicked the thread, the happier they are. Scores are just things over-achieving "serious editors" fuss over because they're trying too hard. If those fussy people want to give low scores to their sub-ridden vids, that's their problem. It certainly won't stop these editors from getting their reward with as little effort as humanly possible.

Really, I think your study says a lot about academic settings, particularly in the US where schools have to meet state standards and kids are getting dumber every year. But it doesn't apply to amvs very well. We're not forced to do this like people are forced into public schools. We don't further our careers by doing this like people who go to college. We're not forced to have our amvs graded, or to pay any attention to the grades we do receive since most 'grades' here are a matter of opinion and not right or wrong fact. Some of us do care as much as the students in your study do, but a lot of us don't and have no reason to. You have to include all of us when you talk about amv fans who post in the announcement section, or amv fans in general. What's "better" for one group is a waste of time, if not an outright annoyance, for another. There are a lot of people here for whom scores are everything, but there are just as many people for whom the scores are random numbers that mean nothing and are only typed in because you can't watch a local vid or leave an op without doing so.
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Re: Star Ratings in the Announcement Forum

Postby Phantasmagoriat » Thu Nov 11, 2010 1:07 am

Arigatomina wrote:This is the big question. You keep assuming people want to improve or are obligated to improve.
Sorry I jumped the gun there, it's just my opinion. I only bring this up because I think I have a pretty strong case why people should omit ratings in their public comments. I simply present the study as a comparison. Whether anyone thinks it's relevant to AMVs is up to them to decide. Omitting the star rating is a simple action, no more difficult than including it. I just want to raise awareness why people may or may not want to do so. I'm probably coming across as making too big a deal out of this, because really, we're just talking about the difference between simple comments like these:

1. "Good job. I liked the atmosphere in this AMV."
2. "Good job. 4/5"
3. "Good job. I liked the atmosphere in this AMV. 4/5"

The differences are subtle, but each comment has a different effect. And it might be good to be aware of it.
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Re: Star Ratings in the Announcement Forum

Postby JaddziaDax » Thu Nov 11, 2010 12:51 pm

Truthfully I usually ignore ratings when given to me.
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Re: Star Ratings in the Announcement Forum

Postby Knowname » Fri Nov 12, 2010 1:42 pm

I try to treat announcements as.... simply announcements and not 'pimp my video' threads. Unlike what you'll find AMV announcement etiquette thread I'd appreciate it if ppl saved their comments for private matters such as ops. My basic reasoning is, take any other kind of announcements, such as a housewarming party or a baby shower. Do you really want homeowning tips or parenting tips at the actual party?? No. take it to the appropriate place thank you. |:>
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Re: Star Ratings in the Announcement Forum

Postby Knowname » Fri Nov 12, 2010 1:50 pm

In other words I'm saying no to star ratings AND no to comments, other than 'yaaaaaaaaaaaay' or even 'this sucks'. Maybe a short reason why, but leave the ACTUAL critique for the ops thx. for the announcement thread, watch the video once and leave your initial imoresion. If you like it so much or you just want to be an ass and comb through all the mistakes or positives in multiple viewings, do it in an op! Put the appropriate comments into the appropriate place!
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Re: Star Ratings in the Announcement Forum

Postby Phantasmagoriat » Fri Nov 12, 2010 4:11 pm

You know, now I'm starting to question what the purpose of Announcements are in the first place.

Promotion, Discussion, Review, Ratings etc... what else...?

I mean, if it is just for the sole purpose of making an Announcement, the threads would be pretty boring. I think it's pretty clear that I want the threads to be less about Ratings and more about Discussion. Yet at the core, I think Announcement threads are about Promotion, without crossing the line into hardcore pimping (should that even be frowned upon...?). So, what do people really want out of making their Announcement Threads anyway? And are Ratings part of what people want?
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Re: Star Ratings in the Announcement Forum

Postby Knowname » Fri Nov 12, 2010 4:23 pm

what your specifying is more like op exchange. in those threads you actually find ppl that WANT DISCUSSION. Ppl don't necessarily want discussion when they're announcing their video -_- though some explicitly ask for opinions... they probably don't want the meat of it in their announcement thread. It's just really a shame how primitive the op system is. It should be the center of this entire website imho.
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Re: Star Ratings in the Announcement Forum

Postby Phantasmagoriat » Fri Nov 12, 2010 4:48 pm

Oh, I'm not saying every announcement thread should pick apart the video. That would be terrible.
Rather, I think real comments should stand on their own instead of including ratings. Ratings are just misleading and don't call things what they are, in addition to the other disadvantages outlined in my first post.
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Re: Star Ratings in the Announcement Forum

Postby Nya-chan Production » Fri Nov 12, 2010 5:23 pm

I want shameless pimping

There, I said it

|:
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Re: Star Ratings in the Announcement Forum

Postby Enigma » Fri Nov 12, 2010 5:32 pm

Nya-chan Production wrote:I want a shameless godix pimp
There, I said it

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Re: Star Ratings in the Announcement Forum

Postby Phantasmagoriat » Fri Nov 12, 2010 6:02 pm

Nya-chan Production wrote:I want shameless pimping

There, I said it

|:
It wouldn't be such a bad thing, in terms of fun-factor. |:>
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Re: Star Ratings in the Announcement Forum

Postby JaddziaDax » Fri Nov 12, 2010 7:43 pm

Shameless pimping for me as well O.O
though I do like reading discussion and comments as well :3
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