HD AMV Questionaire

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Re: HD AMV Questionaire

Postby Taite » Sun Aug 22, 2010 11:51 am

1 - If I already own the dvds, I will not buy the blu-rays for it. If I don't own the anime, but I like it a lot, and it's available in blu-ray, then I'll get the blu-ray.

2 - Rip the blu-ray, save it as lossless to an external hard drive, edit the lossless. I edit both, but 1080p more commonly. All from blu-rays, as upscaled sources are disgusting. As of right now, I have 19 blu-ray dvds, and therefore 19 available to edit (all already ripped.)

3 - I don't like the editing process. My system most likely can not handle it, but I abuse it anyhow. It's worth it though, as I really like HD.

4 - Best quality available. 1080p > 720p.

5 - I don't know. I consider NDK one of "my cons" as I am not far away, but I've only entered it once and have never gone (though am looking forward to.) I'm not sure if they show 1080p/720p amvs if they receive them, or if they just downscale them.
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Re: HD AMV Questionaire

Postby dj_ultima_the_great » Sun Aug 22, 2010 12:20 pm

1 - If you dont edit in HD, why are you not editing in HD? Is it because of the sources you use are not available in HD or is it because your system cannot handle it or it becomes an inconvenience at times?

I don't own anything that can play blu rays, so no point in buying them. Also, my laptop has overheating issues; it gets dangerously hot sometimes just when editing/rendering regular videos, so I'm pretty sure it would fry with an HD source.

2 - If you do edit in HD, what method do you use? Do you bait and switch or edit directly off the 720p or 1080p? Do you edit in both 720p and 1080p? Are you restricted to only 720p at the moment?

3 - How do you like editing in HD? Is the extra render time and larger file sizes worth it with your current system?

Let's say that I could successfully edit in HD, firstly. My lappy can handle playing the videos, so it would be nice to have them if I could make them. However, it's not a priority, and even when I'm able to switch over to a computer that could handle editing/rendering HD sources, I don't think I would care too much. Furthermore, I primarily edit videogame sources, so going above 480p with pretty much anything from before the "next-gen" era is just hurting video quality. Heck, some PS1 games aren't even in 240p.

4 - Do you watch AMVs in HD or grab the lower res or both?

For this site, I get whatever is on Local first, so that I can be reminded later that I already downloaded it. Then, if I know I'll like the source in HD (VG stuff, for example, like Castor's RE5 video), or I end up enjoying the video afterward, I'll get whatever is the highest quality available.

5 - How are conventions adapting HD into their AMV showings and is it a priority at your con?

The long and the short of it is that I totally support the trend of HD videos, so long as two concepts remain intact. One, editors shouldn't be pressured to use HD sources. As long as any source has had the proper processing and is at a reasonable resolution compared to the original from whence it came, nobody should be complaining. Two, the quality of the source should never outshine the quality of the editing. If just getting a source ready for editing is taking more attention (note: I said attention, not time) than the video itself, then some priorities need to be rearranged.


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Re: HD AMV Questionaire

Postby JaddziaDax » Sun Aug 22, 2010 5:46 pm

A lot of HD videos that I've seen floating around are just up-scaled from what I can tell.

I don't own many anime blurays (I think Ponyo is the only one - and it came with a DVD as well) So I find no point in editing in HD.

I also don't plan on buying anime blurays (unless they are a single movie, not a series) because they are just too expensive. I don't want to upgrade my computer either.
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Re: HD AMV Questionaire

Postby Mastamind » Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:20 pm

If you have the resources to edit in the highest possible quality I don't see why not. It's always a good idea to use the highest available quality source as long as it's practical.

1 - I've edited in 720p without problems and am working on a 1080p project. The problems come up when editing 1080p footage because I don't have too much hard drive space and my system isn't nearly optimal for editing.

2 - I always edit directly with the full quality lossless files. I don't like using proxies because if I'm masking or creating media it won't be as sharp when I switch.

3 - What Taite said. I don't like doing it, but it's definitely worth it.

4 - I'll download the highest quality available, but I don't mind watching smaller resolutions :up:
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Re: HD AMV Questionaire

Postby aguelo » Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:54 pm

1 - If you dont edit in HD, why are you not editing in HD? Is it because of the sources you use are not available in HD or is it because your system cannot handle it or it becomes an inconvenience at times?

My system is a pan-dimensional abacus. It can barely withstand 720p.

2 - If you do edit in HD, what method do you use? Do you bait and switch or edit directly off the 720p or 1080p? Do you edit in both 720p and 1080p? Are you restricted to only 720p at the moment?

I re-encode into huffyuv (unless the source is uncompressed), so I can edit in 720p without risks of fire :ying:

3 - How do you like editing in HD? Is the extra render time and larger file sizes worth it with your current system?

Dunno, lol. Rendering always takes lots of time and space.

4 - Do you watch AMVs in HD or grab the lower res or both?

720p and MPC, so the balls of my pan-dimensional abacus don't get inert.

5 - How are conventions adapting HD into their AMV showings and is it a priority at your con?

I don't go to cons nor I enter videos, since I have nil AMVs done :lol:
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Re: HD AMV Questionaire

Postby gotenks794 » Sun Aug 22, 2010 10:12 pm

LittleAtari wrote:1 - If you dont edit in HD, why are you not editing in HD? Is it because of the sources you use are not available in HD or is it because your system cannot handle it or it becomes an inconvenience at times?

When I don't edit in HD it could be for a variety of reasons. Perhaps at the time I don't have adequate storage, or maybe it's because the source isn't HD. Most commonly though, it's because I don't want to wait for encodes.
LittleAtari wrote:2 - If you do edit in HD, what method do you use? Do you bait and switch or edit directly off the 720p or 1080p? Do you edit in both 720p and 1080p? Are you restricted to only 720p at the moment?

I edit directly in the highest resolution available.
LittleAtari wrote:3 - How do you like editing in HD? Is the extra render time and larger file sizes worth it with your current system?

It's meh. I don't notice much wait increase from most SD.
LittleAtari wrote:4 - Do you watch AMVs in HD or grab the lower res or both?

Best available.
LittleAtari wrote:5 - How are conventions adapting HD into their AMV showings and is it a priority at your con?

Most I've seen still need mpeg2... :uhoh:
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Re: HD AMV Questionaire

Postby qyll » Sun Aug 22, 2010 10:50 pm

1 - If you dont edit in HD, why are you not editing in HD? Is it because of the sources you use are not available in HD or is it because your system cannot handle it or it becomes an inconvenience at times?


I do try to edit in HD when possible. My computer can handle it.

2 - If you do edit in HD, what method do you use? Do you bait and switch or edit directly off the 720p or 1080p? Do you edit in both 720p and 1080p? Are you restricted to only 720p at the moment?


Whichever is available.

3 - How do you like editing in HD? Is the extra render time and larger file sizes worth it with your current system?


Yes. The final video quality, I think, is worth it.

4 - Do you watch AMVs in HD or grab the lower res or both?


This is probably bad practice, but I usually just watch preview version first. If I like it, I'll take the one with the highest res. Disk space costs peanuts these days, right?

5 - How are conventions adapting HD into their AMV showings and is it a priority at your con?


I don't know. I'm rather out of the AMV con loop.
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Re: HD AMV Questionaire

Postby LantisEscudo » Sun Aug 22, 2010 11:53 pm

LittleAtari wrote:1 - If you dont edit in HD, why are you not editing in HD? Is it because of the sources you use are not available in HD or is it because your system cannot handle it or it becomes an inconvenience at times?

It's the sources. I'm reluctant to rebuy what I already have on DVD on BD, and most of the things I'm interested in editing haven't come out on BD at all.

LittleAtari wrote:2 - If you do edit in HD, what method do you use? Do you bait and switch or edit directly off the 720p or 1080p? Do you edit in both 720p and 1080p? Are you restricted to only 720p at the moment?

The few times I've edited HD, once was 720p, the other two were 1080p. In one case, my master was AVCHD from a camera, so that was the format I was working in. The other two, I converted the BD files to just the clips I needed in Lagarith, to make some savings on drive space.

LittleAtari wrote:3 - How do you like editing in HD? Is the extra render time and larger file sizes worth it with your current system?

It's pretty nice. More user-friendly rippers would be nice, though.

LittleAtari wrote:4 - Do you watch AMVs in HD or grab the lower res or both?

I grab the highest res available.

LittleAtari wrote:5 - How are conventions adapting HD into their AMV showings and is it a priority at your con?

The only con I'm aware of that's gone HD is Anime Boston, where it's a requirement. Other than that, every con I submit to still asks for DVD-spec MPEG-2.
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Re: HD AMV Questionaire

Postby Megamom » Sun Aug 22, 2010 11:55 pm

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1 - If you dont edit in HD, why are you not editing in HD? Is it because of the sources you use are not available in HD or is it because your system cannot handle it or it becomes an inconvenience at times?


I am currently working on an AMV 720p, although in the past I have edited with high-resolution sources!


2 - If you do edit in HD, what method do you use? Do you bait and switch or edit directly off the 720p or 1080p? Do you edit in both 720p and 1080p? Are you restricted to only 720p at the moment?


1080p Never :awesome: No change of method, I use the same method to edit since 2007!

3 - How do you like editing in HD? Is the extra render time and larger file sizes worth it with your current system?


The rendering takes longer... but I think it's worth :up:


4 - Do you watch AMVs in HD or grab the lower res or both?


Both!!!

5 - How are conventions adapting HD into their AMV showings and is it a priority at your con?


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Re: HD AMV Questionaire

Postby MaggIvy » Mon Aug 23, 2010 12:33 am

LittleAtari wrote:I just wanted a quick look around to see how common HD editing has become for editors now. Here's what I want to know:

1 - If you dont edit in HD, why are you not editing in HD? Is it because of the sources you use are not available in HD or is it because your system cannot handle it or it becomes an inconvenience at times?

2 - If you do edit in HD, what method do you use? Do you bait and switch or edit directly off the 720p or 1080p? Do you edit in both 720p and 1080p? Are you restricted to only 720p at the moment?

3 - How do you like editing in HD? Is the extra render time and larger file sizes worth it with your current system?

4 - Do you watch AMVs in HD or grab the lower res or both?

5 - How are conventions adapting HD into their AMV showings and is it a priority at your con?


1. If I weren't to edit in HD, it's because of the sources. For example, editing using FFX or FF13. If it's in HD I'll use it, if not, I'll use whatever is available at the time.

2. I edit so far in 720p using lossless codec like lagarith or huffyuv. So I'm kinda restricted, I can edit in 1080 but I have no real urge to do so at the moment.

3. I like it, can complain, the rendering takes a while and even though I use MJPeg to render my previews it still takes up a lot of space. Much worth it in the end though.

4. Both

5. I don't do conventions, so I wouldn't know. :pizza:
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Re: HD AMV Questionaire

Postby kireblue » Mon Aug 23, 2010 3:50 am

LittleAtari wrote:I just wanted a quick look around to see how common HD editing has become for editors now. Here's what I want to know:

1 - If you dont edit in HD, why are you not editing in HD? Is it because of the sources you use are not available in HD or is it because your system cannot handle it or it becomes an inconvenience at times?

2 - If you do edit in HD, what method do you use? Do you bait and switch or edit directly off the 720p or 1080p? Do you edit in both 720p and 1080p? Are you restricted to only 720p at the moment?

3 - How do you like editing in HD? Is the extra render time and larger file sizes worth it with your current system?

4 - Do you watch AMVs in HD or grab the lower res or both?

5 - How are conventions adapting HD into their AMV showings and is it a priority at your con?


1 - I typically edit using DVD footage because I have a fairly large collection of them, and Netflicks charges extra for a blu-ray rental subscription. If I don't already own the DVDs, and Netflicks doesn't have it either, then I'll usually use blu-ray footage if it is available.

2 - 1080p seems really unnecessary. If I'm using multiple sources, and only some of them are available in blu-ray, then I scale the blu-ray footage down to 480p. If I'm using multiple series and nothing but blu-ray footage, I scale everything down to 720p. If I'm using only a single series that is available in blu-ray, I'll probably keep it a 1080p.

3 - I don't really notice the extra render time or a larger file size.

4 - I always download the highest quality version available.

5 - My main AMV submission every year is AWA. I had to scale my AMV down from 720p to 480p and then crop off the the sides in order to get it to be the required 720x480. I think that I actually may have done it wrong, and hurt the video quality too much.

Also, I'm charge of Momocon's AMV department, and we don't have any restrictions in terms of HD. If you send us a 1080p AMV, we will play it in 1080p without any alterations. Instead of burning AMVs to DVDs, we actually play everything from our laptops, so we have a lot more flexibility than most cons.

On another note, I can't wait to buy the Eden of the East blu-ray set next month. I plan on releasing it in 1080p |:>
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Re: HD AMV Questionaire

Postby Nya-chan Production » Mon Aug 23, 2010 7:12 am

CodeZTM wrote:5 - I think it will be several years before they begin adapting it for every common con. Especially because most people don't know how to edit properly in HD, and just upscale their 480p footage and make it look terrible. Plus, do you really want to send an MPEG2 of an HD file over the internet?

You won't have to send mpeg-2 of HD, since mpeg-2 is usually/almost always for DVD mastering purposes, thus in 720x480.
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Re: HD AMV Questionaire

Postby Qyot27 » Mon Aug 23, 2010 7:55 am

LittleAtari wrote:1 - If you dont edit in HD, why are you not editing in HD? Is it because of the sources you use are not available in HD or is it because your system cannot handle it or it becomes an inconvenience at times?

Mostly because I've not been dealing with HD sources. My system can't handle it either, but that's beside the point, because it struggles enough with 480p HuffYUV as it is. This is a big part of why I haven't done any serious editing in a little over a year. I finally just got sick of my hardware being a hindrance.

Income-willing, I would actually use the Blu-ray version of any series I was planning to edit with, although this would largely extend only to those series I don't currently have. If I loved the series enough I would get it on Blu-ray even if I previously had the DVD. But if there's a BD available now, I'm just going with that one and forgoing the DVD entirely - even though I don't have a Blu-ray player or BD-ROM drive (although my mom has a laptop that does). Certainly didn't stop me from buying Eva 1.11 on BD.

2 - If you do edit in HD, what method do you use? Do you bait and switch or edit directly off the 720p or 1080p? Do you edit in both 720p and 1080p? Are you restricted to only 720p at the moment?

The times I've edited in HD, the target was 720p - and that's only because the sources were in 720p's ballpark. Doing 1080p with them would require upscaling.

Two were done entirely in After Effects, one was simply a remaster of a previously edited AMV Hell-rejected segment. The two in AFX I cheated on by making it render previews at 1/4 or 1/8 size, so even though the source was way too big, the previews played back fine. Doubly-cheated, in fact, because one of them was always intended to be 720p60 but edited at 24fps, the other one was 720p30 but I went back later and re-rendered it at 60fps just because. In both cases, I could get away with it because neither had video elements - only stills.

3 - How do you like editing in HD? Is the extra render time and larger file sizes worth it with your current system?

Not applicable, although the time necessary to render out whatever I edit in the resolution I'm aiming for is inherently worth it, even if it is a longer amount of time than usual. But there is a reason I've only done it a handful of times.

The same logic also largely applies to my distro encoding. I'll take 0.2fps out of x264 if I have to (although the availability of much stronger computers makes this largely irrelevant to me).

4 - Do you watch AMVs in HD or grab the lower res or both?

Watch, not on this computer - it can't even play 480p H.264 smoothly in most situations. But in all cases I'll make sure to download the highest quality/resolution version available. I put pretty much every video I download on DVD, so they're all getting converted to standard-def MPEG-2 anyway, and it can handle that no problem. I still put the originals in storage, though, and have access to a couple of other computers that can play them at the original size.

5 - How are conventions adapting HD into their AMV showings and is it a priority at your con?

I wouldn't know, I've only been to conventions thrice, and only one of those times did I enter the AMV contest - in 2004, when 640x480 AMVs were just starting to become commonplace (with most widescreen videos - a pathetically-small amount at the time - being at most 720, 704, or 640 width, not a full 848; usually they were 512 or 480 width).
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Re: HD AMV Questionaire

Postby ZephyrStar » Mon Aug 23, 2010 12:46 pm

1) I used to not edit in HD because of system specs, and that I did not want to upscale any of my SD sources. I started a 720p video on my old comp that I could not edit directly, so I set it up as bait and switch, and I also worked on a smaller project with transcoded clips. I always edit based on my source resolution. I really don't like upscaling unless there is a distinct purpose for it (such as rotoing out a lot of SD stuff and making an HD video)

2 - Now that I have a new i7 behemoth, I edit whatever my source resolution is, and I usually just serve it directly into premiere with a script.

3 - I love it. So much more detail, so much more real estate for stuff. The thing is, if you're doing original work, then it becomes "twice as hard" because you have to supply all that detail :)

4 - Will grab HD if available first, lower rez if that's the only thing available.

5 - Pretty much unheard of I think? Unless hotels and convention centers all update their gear to HD, or the people bringing in their own gear for setups shell out the $$$ for HD projectors, I don't see it happening any time soon. Not sure though, I would love to see more HD content at conventions.

(personal note: as dazzling as new tech is, none of that matters if you make crap. I see it a lot on an indie film site I belong to... people whine and complain about gear and needing better gear, and when they've spent all that money on the best gear you can buy, they still make crap. That's why you'll see me buy an 1800$ pro cam vs a 7500$ pro cam.....I'll spend what I saved on lighting, sound, props, etc.)
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Re: HD AMV Questionaire

Postby Pwolf » Mon Aug 23, 2010 1:42 pm

LittleAtari wrote:1 - If you dont edit in HD, why are you not editing in HD? Is it because of the sources you use are not available in HD or is it because your system cannot handle it or it becomes an inconvenience at times?


See #2

LittleAtari wrote:2 - If you do edit in HD, what method do you use? Do you bait and switch or edit directly off the 720p or 1080p? Do you edit in both 720p and 1080p? Are you restricted to only 720p at the moment?


I think ripping and dealing with HD sources is still an iffy process with a lot extra work. There are programs out there that will help it along but so far my experience hasn't been as desirable to just throwing a DVD into the drive and ripping it. On top of that, the source prep can be a little difficult as well as just doing a simple avisynth file isn't that simple either.

I think a lot of people, when they edit with HD sources, are using downloaded source so their stuff has already been ripped and the hard prep work is already done. I think most people will go with 720p because thats more common then the 1080p option (also very little is truely 1080p.)

Personally, the one HD video I did was with an HD-DVD I ripped myself and I used a bait and switch method with three different options: 480p (for editing), 1080p and I then downscaled the 1080p for the 720p and 480p distros. I think Now I would be comfortable editing directly from the 720p or 1080p source but I really don't have a driving desire to edit with HD sources.

Just because HD sources are available doesn't necessarily make me want to use them. While they are nice and all, I make my videos based on an idea and choose my sources to accommodate, if an HD source isn't one of my options, it's not a problem.

LittleAtari wrote:3 - How do you like editing in HD? Is the extra render time and larger file sizes worth it with your current system?


Editing HD is fine. The extra render time wasn't a problem but the file sizes were. I encode everything to Lagartih but even then we are looking at 40-50+gb per file. Hard drives are cheap though.

LittleAtari wrote:4 - Do you watch AMVs in HD or grab the lower res or both?


Yea I watch what ever the editor releases. if they have a 1080p version I'll watch it but I very rarely care if it's in HD or not. If a video is in HD it doesn't make it better so if I have to watch a 480p version of it, thats fine.

LittleAtari wrote:5 - How are conventions adapting HD into their AMV showings and is it a priority at your con?


I would prefer that cons stay away from HD content for a few years. To ensure accurate playback for all videos, I think all the videos would have to be converted to the same standard. If this standard is h264 then I would like to see that as the submission standard or the coordinators convert everything to it. However, I don't believe cons can accurately and reliably convert submissions to an HD format correctly. I don't think most people can. Sure you can run it through Zarxgui but what if you run into an issue? I don't think people have the technical know how to fix encoding issues with h264 just yet. It's already difficult doing so with MPEG2, I have a hard time believing that h264 would be any easier. Not to mention the number of HD videos compared to SD videos is still much lower IMO.

There's also the need for HD equipment. For a decent home theater 1080p projector you're looking at a couple thousand dollars. Depending on the venue, that could go up based on the con's needs. For a larger con, they'll need more then one. I think AX and Otakon have had up to 5 screens at one point. What about running cable to those projectors (they are mounted on the ceiling)? And that's just one room. imagine the cost of outfitting an entire convention with HD projects. I'm sure people would like to see HD amvs at an AMV panel also. While the large cons might be able to accommodate the costs of such a feat I doubt the smaller ones would. Not to mention, no other event at a con needs HD projectors. AMVs aren't all that popular in the grand scheme of anime fandom so I also doubt a con is going to shell out thousands of dollars for AMVs when they don't need to, even more so when the majority of a the submissions aren't even in HD to begin with.
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