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Postby [Mike of the Desert] » Wed Nov 16, 2005 1:49 pm

Anyway, in the end, we have the possibility to enter it into the catalog, so it isn't the worst case, as creator, I'm soddisfied. Since if someone want to see the video can contact me, as Infinity Squared said, and if someone don't want to, he/she will not contact me as the same he/she would have not downloaded it in the first time. That's not true at 100% but generally, it is like this.

Talking seriously, we had luck, things could have gone really, really worst that how they are now. Again thanks to Phade for handle it in a so great way.
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Postby x_rex30 » Wed Nov 16, 2005 1:51 pm

If it's the artists that are mad, then all I could do is lol.
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Postby Adv1sor » Wed Nov 16, 2005 1:52 pm

Is there any way to communicate to the recording industry the fact that I have actually purchased some songs, songs that I otherwise would not have bought, just to make an AMV?
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Postby x_rex30 » Wed Nov 16, 2005 1:54 pm

Adv1sor wrote:Is there any way to communicate to the recording industry the fact that I have actually purchased some songs, songs that I otherwise would not have bought, just to make an AMV?
I know of hundreds of people who have done this. Even those who bought CDs after hearing a song from it in a AMV.
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Postby Zahmira » Wed Nov 16, 2005 2:03 pm

Michele wrote:So, in the end, it is not possible to even create a link on the comments.
Btw I would have a question in my mind.. Providing a link to a website where we uploaded it, writing instructions to reach the true link, would be the same? I think yes (so it is not possible legally), but I would like to hear at least some more opinions.
a-m-v.org would not be held legally responsible if there was a link on their site than lead to another site which hosted the video.
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Postby sheena_bandy » Wed Nov 16, 2005 2:10 pm

Good gods.... I just went through all the squishy goodness of hiding my fanstuffs section and all that, so I'm in the same boat as yall! I've kept it hidden and will continue to post my art for as long as I am alive to make it. In any case, I just keep it exclusive and out of the way ^_^ just thought I'd say that...
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Postby [Mike of the Desert] » Wed Nov 16, 2005 2:16 pm

x_rex30 wrote:
Adv1sor wrote:Is there any way to communicate to the recording industry the fact that I have actually purchased some songs, songs that I otherwise would not have bought, just to make an AMV?
I know of hundreds of people who have done this. Even those who bought CDs after hearing a song from it in a AMV.


Yeah, EXACTLY. They are been fool in this mean.. Actually we're making publicity to them.. This is something that strangely they didn't understood. I actually bought 3Cds of 'em because I heard them for the first time in an amv. That's really true..


To Zahmira: mmm.. I understand, but that site would be. It's really a problem all this. Thanks for the information. Probably I'll try it with a personal folder of web space, who knows.
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Postby Zahmira » Wed Nov 16, 2005 2:23 pm

Michele wrote:To Zahmira: mmm.. I understand, but that site would be. It's really a problem all this. Thanks for the information. Probably I'll try it with a personal folder of web space, who knows.
Yes, that site would have to take responsiblity, but if we are willing to do so, posting a link to our site on this one shouldn't be a problem.
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Postby BasharOfTheAges » Wed Nov 16, 2005 2:46 pm

People in the music industry don't seem to care about this thing called reality. Data exists to the contrary of the claims that advent of downloading software has lead to slumping sales, yet they still cling to the notion that they are correct and therefore have the moral right to do something about it. Now they do have the legal right, but attempting to reason with these people is a fool's errand. Logic doesn’t quite work.

I bet you know someone, a friend or relative perhaps, that will, no matter what, argue their point to the grave regardless of whether or not they are correct -- even if presented with a plethora of data sources to the contrary. Well, imagine if this person was ridiculously wealthy, powerful, and paranoid. That's the music industry in America (it's also fast becoming the movie industry as well and has been the current political administration for some time now, but that's another issue). Reasoning with them will not work! However, attempting to reason with them in public forum (i.e. the media) where you can get public sympathy/support may shame them into backing down; that is, assuming they still care what the public thinks... previous actions have suggested otherwise.

Yes, I’m focusing more on the actions of the RIAA, because, as I have stated in the past, business etiquette would suggest that what happened here will not stay hushed up. Another record label or 20 will undoable make the same requests as Wind-Up Records did simply because they will be notified of the org by Wind-Up Records or by Sony BGM Music Entertainment, their parent company. Once this becomes more mainstream knowledge in the music world, the RIAA will undoubtedly stick their head in to pick off an easy target. Sure, they have bigger fish to fry (p2ps for instance) but as those present difficulty, and we’re a very open system that publicly states that we’ll submit if we are challenged – what looks like an easy victory? Common sense would tell you that any pseudo-legal action like a Cease and Desist order would be made known to Sony BGM at the very least. Whether or not this gets lost in a clutter of paperwork is another question entirely... Let's hope for that.
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Postby JaddziaDax » Wed Nov 16, 2005 3:20 pm

truthfully it seems to me that this company didnt even WANT to push the issue, but due to some idiot that should be cornered and shot *glares* :twisted: :shock: they were FORCED to do it... which is why we only got a "cease and desist" instead of "YOU ARE RUINING OUR INUDSTRY!! DIE 14 YEAROLD SCUM!!"

I dont think that they are the same type of paranoid media maggots that caused Napster to die..

but after a night of sleep, I have calmed down...

This site might have not started out as a hosting site, but for many it has become that, especially for the ones who cant afford hosting on their own o.0 and its a shame that it has been limited, but at the same time its not the end of the world.

AMVs will live on, and so will filesharing programs (as much as I dont like them) I just hope that this doesnt lead to the rest of the Industry or Labels pushing it too. Because I happen to like having a central hosting place where anyone can find my AMVs..
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Postby [Mike of the Desert] » Wed Nov 16, 2005 4:19 pm

I didn't get any answer from Phade (he must be extremely busy) but I understood everything I wanted here in these last hours. =) I hope to have not bother him too much with that question. So, Zahmira, I understand what you mean and create a my website is something I'm plannign to do from a lot of time. :)

For the rest, I actually quote everything you all said, I understand what you mean, especially Jaddzia, since I feel the same, I really love to have this central site for my most big passion. And I only hope this will stop with this case. But who knows in the future.. ;( I don't have any idea for now.
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Postby setalone » Wed Nov 16, 2005 4:33 pm

i'm reading everything everyone says and all i can say is...

i AM glad that the site was not down and i AM glad that PHADE has gone through so much trouble. i PRAY that no other music groups decide to take the same course of action. a petition sounds good but will have little effect. i believe we should just let it go for now and hope that maybe in the future they will remove the ban (possibly if/when the bands break up...) i forget who said it...but i agree that using their music to make videos to post on a-m-v.org should not be our only reason. i will continue to use their music and share them with my friends. BTW we also have things like MORPHEUS and LIMEWIRE (which is where i first found about 20 AMVs by accident. but not to say that just to go behind the artist's back as most people get AMVs form this site...) so there's my 2 cents.
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Postby rogueintellectproductions » Wed Nov 16, 2005 4:34 pm

First off, Phade, thank you - you should not have to take the heat for us, but I am eternally grateful you did.

Secondly, there are some points in Phade's first post that people are either ignoring, or did not notice.

If the AMV you have created is not available for download on your own web site, you are safe.


In other words, you're not supposed to have it available, period. As was stated before, the label will now likely turn its eye (at least for a little while) on private websites that had these videos available for download. Thank you, Phade, for giving us the warning.

PS. Please do not write to the record label, band, or anyone else in the music industry about AMVs for any reason. Thank you.


PLEASE DO NOT ATTEMPT TO PETITION THE BAND MEMBERS! We got off light; let's not jeapordize that by bitching and moaning to the band behind the label's back. The label could have done alot worse to Phade and to us. The less attention we draw to the site, the longer it'll be around in the shape and form you know it.

Thanks and kudos again have to go to Phade. He not only took a bullet for us, he's trying to make sure we don't draw any more fire.

Chris

(Honestly, you think a letter or petition would get through to the band members without management seeing it first?)
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Postby NeoQuixotic » Wed Nov 16, 2005 4:39 pm

Oh dear, it has happened. I have to say that AMVs have introduced me to music I never knew or cared about. I have bought all the albums of an artist/group because of just one song in a AMV I saw. And I buy CDs, not downloaded crap (legal or illegal), because I want a nice full quality CD that I can do what I want with (unless more of this Sony DRM crap starts popping up). It is true that some people will download a video just to rip a song, however most people seem to use lower quality sources to begin with and compress it so much it isn't really worth trying. I'll keep buying my CDs unless legal downloads of uncompressed or lossless compression files start. Some artists have done this, "They Might Be Giants" being one who offer FLAC as a download. I enjoy almost all music and the 3 bands banned so far are 3 too many. If the artists/groups themselves dissaprove of what we are doing I will respect their wishes, but if the damn labels are the ones, then F**K them!

We should create a banned music MEP to show our dissaproval, although getting in further trouble would kill even a decent sized community such as this. I love when people go against the "rules", like when bookstores will purposefully push supposedly "banned" books. I've been thinking of making a video with a song by "Alter Bridge" (part of Wind Up Records) and I would still make it even if it gets banned too. In fact, I would love to know why Wind Up didn't ban all of the artists they have. As I said before, if the artists themselves asked for the cease and decist I will agree to that, just not if the record company decided it was bad for publicity or marketing. The sheer volume of Evanesence videos shows me that other AMVs convinced other people to buy their music. However, as most of the Evanesence videos are crappy or low quality, a lot of users probably obtained the music through less than legal methods. Well thats enough from me for now.

BTW, have any anime distributors/companies asked for any anime not be used or be taken off the site?
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Postby Vlad G Pohnert » Wed Nov 16, 2005 4:43 pm

Just a few suggetions and personal comments in regards to writting to the bands/label:

Writting to the bands will probably in most cases not get any notice. Most big bands are quite busy and hence why they have a label do all thier legal work. Most likely it might bring it to the attendtion of the label itself and that might make things worse...

But if you feel you must write no matter what, please don't in any way mention this site. As what we do in regards to copyright of songs is at best grey, we don't need other labels decending on us. Right now our best bet is to keep trying to stay below thier radar. If this was an order to eliminate all links, then there is nothing to loose, but that is not the case right now as we have a lot more to loose. Any association or even mention of the org in a letter would greatly increase the chances of something like this happening again.

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