What's wrong with noobies? [Food for thought]

Arigatomina · Post by **Arigatomina** » Mon Jun 02, 2003 11:32 am

First, I hate the word 'noobie' and 'noobs' but for the sake of getting along, I'll use it. And as the subject asks, what's wrong with noobies? Why is there so much hostility toward them? Why is it so important that a member of this forum have been a member for a long time, or, "a LOT longer than you!!!" as one non-noob put it. What's the deal? It reminds me of hazing rituals that are meant to scar beginners to the point that only the most jaded (and hopefully the strongest) will survive and remain to join the rest of the 'non-noob' community. Noobies are flamed, cussed out, treated like idiots for asking beginning questions (which even non-noobs must have wondered when they first started). Their opinions are dismissed unless they're so meek about it they scrape the ground and try to agree with what the non-noobs are saying. And even then they're flamed for 'trying to act smart.' Why? Is it just ritual? It seems to be meant to turn people away, or to teach the pathetic disgusting little noobies to know their places - beneath anyone who's so good as to have been a member longer than them.

With the influx since the Carrot, there have been a lot of noobs flooding here (yes, I was watching the site for a lot longer than I've been a member - I'm sure other noobies have as well). I'm not trying to start trouble with the all-powerful non-noobs, but watching new members get flamed, attacked, treated like worse than refuge is disturbing. So I wonder if it bothers anyone else - not including the non-noobs who are just doing their duty of hazing those with smaller intelligences than their own. See? I worship all non-noobs, I'm not a trouble-maker, and I hope no one thinks I mean to lower the importance of the dedicated, long-standing members. I'm merely curious as to where all the hostility comes from. I understand it can be irritating to see the same questions asked, to see people who don't know the rules not following the rules (since they don't know them, it's obvious why they aren't following them, but that's not the point). I know it's infuriating to see a noobie talk back to a hostile, bold letters in triple-sized font non-noob. I know, but here it seems people (non-noobs since noobies are not treated at a level high enough to be considered thinking-feeling people) - people are encouraged to be harsh, they're applauded when they cuss out a noobie, they're joined in flock by non-noobs who cheer and mark their hit lists and generally celebrate the mutilation of yet another pathetic noobie. To be repetitive, I ask why?

EarthCurrent · Post by **EarthCurrent** » Mon Jun 02, 2003 12:26 pm

I believe it more a trial by fire. If they get through all the BS tossed their way, and stick around, then they might actually be worth something...

Don't really know, though.
Only the occasional newcomer to the forum really manages to rub me the wrong way.

Arigatomina · Post by **Arigatomina** » Mon Jun 02, 2003 12:42 pm

In other words, a sensitive noobie is a short-term member. But either way, the treatment is done on purpose, rather than being a case where every noobie who is flamed actually deserved that treatment. It's good to know, but some warning for incoming members might be in order. Perhaps an additional 'sticky post' is in order warning 'Noobies should expect to be treated like shit until such time as their one-year noobie warranty wears out.' It would keep them (gomen! I mean *us* ) from taking the treatment personally.

Lone Wolf · Post by **Lone Wolf** » Mon Jun 02, 2003 12:45 pm

Noobs are usually, but not always, treated like that because they lack sense. They will often ask questions when the answers are right in front of them. Most of the time, they don't look around first. For example, we have the right to flame a noob who's asking "Where can I download the AMVs?" when there's a 'search videos' button right in front of them on the main page. It's irritating to have to answer the same questions over and over again.

Not all noobs are treated this way, however. Several noobs here have been recognized and praised by the veterans because of their well-thought-out topics and questions. These noobs add important points to a discussion.

y2kwizard · Post by **y2kwizard** » Mon Jun 02, 2003 12:50 pm

I think it's the fact that many n00bs do not read any of the requred reading that we provide for them. They'll make a new thread saying "How do I rip a DVD??" when there's a perfectly good guide on ripping a DVD right in front of their faces. I think this is what pisses so many non-n00bs off.

Arigatomina · Post by **Arigatomina** » Mon Jun 02, 2003 12:54 pm

I can certainly understand where repetitive (and rediculous) questions would draw a lot of flaming. But what about the ones who merely lack the proper forum protocall? I mean, resurrecting dead threads, for example. That entitles a lot of flaming, it's constantly complained about, and yet there is no thread telling newbies what to and not to do when posting in the forum. And telling a person to search through threads (when there are hundreds and more with similar words that don't answer the question) doesn't mean they'll ever find the answer they're looking for. But a person asking a question that's been asked before is attacked. Sure, it's been asked before - all they have to do is wade through the threads in the proper forum to find the answer. Which could take weeks.

I don't feel personally insulted by the treatment of noobies (I'm going to use newbies from now on, since I really don't like the way that word looks or sounds) - newbies with dumb questions should be treated as if they asked dumb questions. I get that. But how are they supposed to react to this 'trial by fire?' If they stand up for themselves, they'll only create enemies and ruin any chance they have of surviving as a member. If they sit back quietly after being rebuked, their ego can have permanent damage. Some of the flames are downright nasty, cruel, and uncalled for. Yet the newbie who complains and argues with the flamer is in much more danger of getting in official trouble on the forum than the person attacking him is. That is what bothers me.

emp|typ|athetic · Post by **emp|typ|athetic** » Mon Jun 02, 2003 1:20 pm

EarthCurrent wrote:I believe it more a trial by fire. If they get through all the BS tossed their way, and stick around, then they might actually be worth something...

Don't really know, though.
Only the occasional newcomer to the forum really manages to rub me the wrong way.

http://animemusicvideos.org/phpBB/viewt ... sc&start=0

, EC, very

..

EarthCurrent · Post by **EarthCurrent** » Mon Jun 02, 2003 1:24 pm

[quote="emp|typ|athetic"http://animemusicvideos.org/phpBB/viewt ... sc&start=0

, EC, very

..[/quote]
There was a higher then normal number of occasionals when I made that post.

EarthCurrent · Post by **EarthCurrent** » Mon Jun 02, 2003 1:26 pm

EarthCurrent wrote:
emp|typ|athetic wrote:http://animemusicvideos.org/phpBB/viewt ... sc&start=0
, EC, very ..
There was a higher then normal number of occasionals when I made that post.

phear my mad quoting skillz

Arigatomina · Post by **Arigatomina** » Mon Jun 02, 2003 1:35 pm

Great link, perfect example, though the rant wasn't directed to any newbie in particular. I've seen far worse, if I get bored (I am a college graduate, so I'm included in that - just got out of school category) I may go and find some more blatant, hateful, and disgusting flames - and point out how insignificant the newbie crimes were in those cases. At least that way, with specific examples, I won't feel as if I'm crying to the wind about something that can't be pointed at and screamed "Look at how you're treating these people who have *never* done a damn thing to you! What did they do to offend you so badly?! Why do you treat them like that just because they are new? What are you so afraid of that you jump on a newbie and partake in a feeding frenzy? And if this is tradition, what the hell did the old-timers do to you when you joined that you must take that hidden hatred out on others?" But maybe the examples aren't needed. I think I really would like to hear more from the flamed newbies, they've been silenced rather well. I'm willing to wager that a number of them are not so 'ignorant' as the non-noobs want to claim. If I didn't know better I'd think the non-noobs want to scare away newbies so they don't have to worry about someone coming in and gaining attention away from themselves. But I don't think that's the problem. I think they were conditioned to hate new-comers who invade *their* private space. I know I hate uninvited guests, so I sympathize.

I just hope I haven't spited myself - I was hoping to have a non-flaming conversation about the treatment of newbies. Instead I find myself wanting to give counseling to some of the more hateful members, and it is *definitely* not my place or problem. I appologize - I really can't stand to see people bullied or treated like this - and it is rampant here. I've never seen it this bad, and yes, like another newbie I read a thread by earlier, I'm an old veteran of forums - at least *those* warned newbies not to post for a certain time period so they can get used to the way things are. They had very vivid introductory material on how newbies were going to be treated and what to do if they wanted to avoid such treatment. Here, it's slipping in the midst of a pack of wolves and wondering what you've done wrong to make so many (nearly the entire forum of non-noobs) hate you just for what you are. Blame the entire multitude of newbies for the few posts of the bad ones.